Author Topic: Sbarro's mall pizza  (Read 47438 times)

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Offline sethelement

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #20 on: December 16, 2006, 04:11:53 AM »
I Think this is from guy that do the dough prep.. ;D

Making Pizza, Sbarro-Style
At Sbarro, the one in Annapolis Mall, I was a prep cook for years, the only one dedicated to the task (if I wasn't there, one of the managers had to fill in). I used to work 60-hour weeks in the summer, 8:00 AM to 6:00 PM, Monday through Saturday. I prepared all the dough, made all the sauce, grated all the cheese, chopped all the vegetables, and prepared other things like lasagnas.

The dough was the central and largest task. It consisted of 75 lb. batches of dough, up to six batches a day. That comes out to aroud 300 large dough balls per day.

This was the recipe and general procedure for one batch:

1 50-lb sack of Lisante Pizza flour
1 1/2 oz dry active yeast
1 lb Lard
salt, little bit of sugar
24 lbs ice water.


I don't remember the timing exactly, but the water and yeast, salt ans sugar was mixed for a little while on the floor-model, 5-foot-high hobard mixer. Then the flour and lard added, and the whole thing would mix, with a two-foot dough hook attatchment on the Hobart, for something like 20 minutes.

When the dough was ready, I picked up the 90lb bowl off the mixer and emptied it onto the table. This was an awesome long table, top made entirely out of butcher block.

After that I cut and rolled the entire batch into 24 oz balls. "Rolling" means stretching the ball around on itself, producing a nice, round, smooth ball. I got so I could do two at once, working them one-handed against the table. The balls went into dough trays for storage and proofing rising), six balls per tray.

I'd go through this proceess up to six times per shift, not counting all the other prep work.

Also, we used the same dough for calzones, and the process was the same except the dough balls were only six ounces. I hated that because it;s not all that much less effort to roll a 6-oz ball than a full size one, and being smaller, there's so much many more to do per batch.

Actually, I usually only had to roll a couple of trays of calzone douogh balls, or about 48, for the next day, and the rest of the batch wou;d be regular 24 oz pizza balls.

But sometimes, during the holiday season, I'd have to do a whole batch of calzone balls. That was rough, wich a whole bacth making for some 200 calzone balls. The huge pile of dough never seemed to dimish when rolling for calzone.

A word about the ice water: If you ever made dough or bread at home, you might wonder about this, since most of the time bread dough needs to be warm to rise.

Well, the thing is, it's actually that dough needs to be warm to rise fast, as in, ready to bake sometime in the next couple of hours.

The truth is, once the yeast is activated (mixed with water), it's going to rise no matter what happens. when it's cold, it just rises more slowly.
Since I was preparing dough for use the next day, I actually needed to keep the brakes on the yeast as much as possible, or else it would rise too much, too fast, and become an unuable mess by the next day.

The ice water kept the dough cold during the cutting and rolling process. Then, into the walk-in refrigerator it went as soon as rolling was done, hopefully still cold.

There were times (rare, thankfully), perhaps in the summer if the Mall's AC was on the fritz, when the dough got too warm The dough balls would rise too much overnight, merging into one solid pan of dough. Usually this dough would have to be tossed, but there were a few occasions of extreme business when we didn't have enough to spare, and couldn't afford to dump the badly risen dough. Then it tested theh pizza-makers's skill, to cut out usable sections from the pan and form it best he/she could into a decently shaped pizza. Fortunately, we had good makers.Next: Lemme tell you about how they (I) USED to make sauce at Sbarro.



Offline canadave

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #21 on: December 16, 2006, 12:22:40 PM »
Quote
1 50-lb sack of Lisante Pizza flour
1 1/2 oz dry active yeast
1 lb Lard
salt, little bit of sugar
24 lbs ice water.


I'm assuming that the amount for the dry active yeast is 1 1/2 *pounds* rather than 1 1/2 *ounces*, right?  ;)  Otherwise, that'd be some pretty strong yeast!!  :o

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #22 on: December 16, 2006, 12:33:15 PM »
Dave,

I believe that 1 1/2 ounces of yeast is probably correct. With 800 ounces of flour (50 x 16), the baker's percent for the ADY is 1.5/800 = 0.1875%. That may be on the low side, but it most likely would work. I wonder more about the amount of water. If it is 24 pounds as noted, then the baker's percent for water would be 24/50 = 48%. That would be a low figure for the type of dough involved. Possibly the weight of the ice wasn't taken into account.

Peter

Offline Lydia

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #23 on: December 16, 2006, 01:11:40 PM »
I came across this info on my own a few weeks ago and I tried to find info on the Lisante flour. Internet searches came turned up  absolutely nothing.

Anyone heard of it or know any of the specs?
« Last Edit: December 16, 2006, 01:13:27 PM by Lydia »
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Offline nepa-pizza-snob

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #24 on: December 16, 2006, 08:23:30 PM »
regarding the earlier malt comment - what does this contibute to pizza dough and the finished product

Offline canadave

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #25 on: December 16, 2006, 09:37:31 PM »
Dave,

I believe that 1 1/2 ounces of yeast is probably correct. With 800 ounces of flour (50 x 16), the baker's percent for the ADY is 1.5/800 = 0.1875%. That may be on the low side, but it most likely would work. I wonder more about the amount of water. If it is 24 pounds as noted, then the baker's percent for water would be 24/50 = 48%. That would be a low figure for the type of dough involved. Possibly the weight of the ice wasn't taken into account.

Peter
Pete,

Yes, actually, I *am* a moron :)  I read 1 1/2 *teaspoons* for some reason rather than 1 1/2 ounces  :-[  This will teach me yet again not to post on here so early in the morning :)

Thanks,
Dave

Offline sethelement

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #26 on: December 17, 2006, 04:00:33 AM »
can anybody make this into a single pizza recipe.. just wonderin :chef:

Offline altmangf

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #27 on: December 17, 2006, 10:18:50 AM »
I worked at the Sbarros in the Crossgates Mall (Albany N.Y.) foodcourt.   1994-1996.  The recipe we used is as follows:

50 pounds Lisante Pizza Flour (measured on a scale, because the #50 bags usually did not contain exactly #50 of flour)
28 pounds of ice-water (measured on a floor scale, we used cold tap water and added 2 large scoops of ice from our ice machine.  The      plastic scoop is roughly the size of a 2 liter soda bottle.)

20 oz of shortening (we did not use lard)
16 oz of salt
2.00 ounces of actice-dry yeast (there was a special digital scale used to weigh the yeast.)
Malt Syrup (this came in an unlabeled plastic bag.  A thick and heavy brown liquid.  I cut the top off and squeezed it in.  A very rough guess from memory would be that  the capacity was 1.5 cups, but I can't be sure.) ???

Mixed in the giant hobart for 7 minutes low speed, 5 high.   Don't lose a limb.  Cut and roll dough, place in stackable dough trays, and slide into walk-in cooler.  Dough was made in the afternoon and used the next day.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #28 on: December 17, 2006, 11:09:01 AM »
altmangf,

Now that is more like it :). The pieces of the puzzle are starting to fall into place. I am certain that the malt is non-diastatic barley malt syrup and used for crust color and flavor purposes. Usually when barley malt syrup is used, the other forms of sugar, usually sucrose (normal table sugar), are omitted from the dough formulation, which apparently was the case when you worked at Sbarro's since you didn't specify any other sugar(s). If your 1 1/2-cup estimate for the barley malt syrup is correct, I estimate that the barley malt syrup is used at the rate of about 2.22%, which would be quite normal for sugar in a pizza dough formulation. In anticipation of a question of where one can find non-diastatic barley malt syrup, I found mine at Whole Foods. I am sure it can also be ordered from online sources.

To answer sethelement's question, yes, it is possible to come up with a single dough ball formulation. I would use 24 ounces as the dough ball size. I believe that that would be for an 18" pizza. If 18" is correct, that would be for a rather thin crust pizza, but there is no reason why the dough can't be used to make a smaller, thicker crust pizza.

A point to keep in mind is that institutional pizza dough recipes can change over time. So the most recent dough formulation may not be the one used by Sbarro's today. But, if that is not an issue, I think I can calculate the ingredients necessary to produce a 24-ounce dough ball (or any other size).

Peter

Offline ZekeTheCat

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #29 on: December 19, 2006, 07:29:30 AM »
Lisanti Pizza flour came from Lisanti Foods Incorporated  in New Jersey- now bankrupt. I used to see Lisanti pizza sauce at the Sbarro's in Ft. Wayne Indiana 20 years ago. Not sure what happened to their assets.


Offline chiguy

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #30 on: December 19, 2006, 10:35:35 AM »
 Hi peter,
 I was at Sbarros a couple years ago and asked about thier process also  how big the pizza was and they told me it is stretched to almost 17inches if that helps. It may have started out at 18inches but as prices rise over time this is how the company passed on those food costs. Just a thought,      Chiguy

Offline Lydia

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #31 on: December 19, 2006, 12:32:01 PM »
Thanks Zeke

At least now I can quit looking.

 
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Offline scott r

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #32 on: December 20, 2006, 03:04:36 AM »
lisante was at the NY pizza convention a little less than a year ago.

I think the might still be around.  They had a full line of products cheese/sauce/toppings included.  Their pizzas were being made from a really nice guy from orlando (I think?), definitely florida.  I thought it was the best pizza at the show.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #33 on: December 21, 2006, 12:01:19 PM »
To Sbarro's pizza lovers,

I recently found an article on how to make a NY style cheese pizza, by the corporate chef of Sbarro’s, Giuseppe (“Joe”) Borruso. As noted here, http://www.sbarro.com/aboutUs/managementTeam.php, Mr. Borruso is still with Sbarro’s (see bio at the bottom of the page). As noted in the article, at
http://www.nbc10.com/recipes/9992657/detail.html, 24 ounces of dough is used to make an 18-inch dough round, which is consistent with the information that was provided by members sethelement and altmangf. The article is also instructive in the amounts of sauce and cheese to use. There is no discussion about how to make the dough itself but I believe that any of the three fats mentioned so far--lard, shortening and oil (the latter by elsegundo)--can be used interchangeably since all three fats are 100% fat. I would guess that oil is used at the present for health-related reasons. The dough shaping/stretching instructions given in the article may also be useful, even in a general sense. I have no idea of what a pizza "mold" is as discussed in the article, but I doubt that it is needed.

To preserve the article, I have copied and pasted it below, as follows:

By Corporate Chef Giuseppe Joe Borruso

Makes eight slices

Ingredients:
1 24 oz. dough ball
10 oz. pizza sauce
13 oz. shredded mozzarella cheese
1/8 tsp. oregano
oz. blended oil
oz. grated romano cheese
flour

Pizza Spinning Tips:
-Dough ball needs to be eight inches in diameter
-Use only tips of fingers to pick up dough ball
-After flattening the center of the dough, make sure to create a one-inch rim around the outside
-Stretch the dough to 12 inches in diameter before spinning begins
-When tossing the dough, throw it like a Frisbee, turning it clockwise
-Make sure you don't overstretch the dough -- thin dough makes for soggy pizza

Procedure:
Note: This recipe uses tools that can be replaced if needed by more common items found in a kitchen.

Sprinkle a little flour on top of each dough ball, use center ball on tray first. Remove the dough ball with a scraper.

Flour both sides of the dough ball. Shake off extra flour. Place dough, smooth side up, in pizza mold.

Use flat fingers to push dough into the mold until flattened and distributed evenly. Dough should fill the mold with edges tight to the mold and squared. Sprinkle a little durum flour on top of the dough. Pull dough gently out of the mold. Place smooth side down on lightly floured preparation surface.

Working just inside the edge of the dough circle, guide and turn the dough two full revolutions with the side of one hand, while pressing down with the outside fingers of the other hand to form and enhance the border. Use sides of fingers, not fingertips. Pressing with flat fingers inside the border, begin at the top of the circle and move hands opposite ways around the outside of the circle, meeting at the bottom and then moving up the center of the circle to the top. This process stretches the dough and distributes it evenly across the inside of the circle. Turn the circle a quarter of the way around and repeat. Continue until you’ve completed one full revolution. Dust excess flour off the border with your fingertips and palms.

Pick up the dough. Drape it over the back of your hands, with thumbs toward each other. Just inside the border so dough doesn’t slip off. Stretch the edge about two inches with your thumbs. Move circle around about 2 inches. Stretch the edge again. Do not stretch center of dough. Continue stretching and turning dough until the circle is approximately 18 inches in diameter.

Place dough circle smooth side up on a lightly floured 18 inch pizza peel. Pour one heaping eight oz. ladle, 10 liquid oz., pizza sauce on center of dough. Hold the ladle near the bottom of the handle. Distribute sauce across dough by pressing gently, moving the ladle in circular motions from the center towards outside. Stopping when you are -inches from the rim. Put the ladle at the center again and repeat the circular motion to even the sauce. Sprinkle half of the grated romano cheese over sauce.

Starting on the outside, spread 13 oz. of shredded pizza cheese evenly over the sauce making sure all the sauce is covered with cheese. Sprinkle 1/8 tsp. of oregano over the cheese. Using an oil container in a circular motion, evenly pour oz. of blended oil over the cheese. Brush any excess flour, spilled sauce or cheese off.

Bake at 550 degrees for approximately seven minutes. The pizza is finished baking when the cheese is bubbling at its highest point and the crust is evenly golden brown. If baked too long, cheese will start to settle and break down and the pizza will look oily on top.

Place pizza on pan and cut into eight equal slices.
« Last Edit: December 26, 2006, 11:17:03 AM by Pete-zza »

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2006, 12:25:30 PM »
As a follow-up to my last post, those who are interested in making a Sbarro's dough for an 18" pizza (24 ounces of dough), might consider the two dough formulations presented below--one using shortening and one using oil. If someone prefers to use lard instead of shortening or oil, the amount that would be used is about 2.4 t. (2 1/2 t. should be fine). The lard quantity is based on the Armour brand of lard. If member wayno is correct (see Reply 13) that Sbarro’s uses a high-gluten, bleached, bromated flour, then I think that the All Trumps high-gluten flour would make a good replacement for the Lisante (Lisanti?) pizza flour. Since we have baker’s percents, it should be fairly easy to derive the quantities of ingredients for any size pizza, not just the 18” size. For those who like working with thickness factors, I calculated a value of 0.094 for the Sbarro’s pizza dough. That would translate into a thin NY style.

Shortening Version
Pizza Flour (100%): 417.5 g | 14.73 oz | 0.92 lbs
Water (56%): 233.8 g | 8.25 oz | 0.52 lbs
Salt (2%): 8.35 g | 0.29 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.5 tsp | 0.5 tbsp
ADY (0.25%): 1.04 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.28 tsp | 0.09 tbsp
Shortening* (2.5%): 10.44 g | 0.37 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.63 tsp
Non-diastatic barley malt syrup (2.22%): 9.27 g | 0.33 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.34 tsp
Total (162.97%): 680.4 g | 24 oz | 1.5 lbs
*Crisco

Oil (Soybean) Version
Pizza Flour (100%): 417.5 g | 14.73 oz | 0.92 lbs
Water (56%): 233.8 g | 8.25 oz | 0.52 lbs
Salt (2%): 8.35 g | 0.29 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.5 tsp | 0.5 tbsp
ADY (0.25%): 1.04 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.28 tsp | 0.09 tbsp
Oil (2.5%): 10.44 g | 0.37 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.24 tsp | 0.75 tbsp
Non-diastatic barley malt syrup (2.22%): 9.27 g | 0.33 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.34 tsp
Total (162.97%): 680.4 g | 24 oz | 1.5 lbs

Peter

Offline chiguy

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #35 on: December 21, 2006, 06:30:09 PM »
 Last time i was at Sbarros about a year ago, they cut all the pies in 1/6 slices, and they were not 18inches. You could take a ride to almost any mall and see for yourself the product has definitely changed.      Chiguy

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #36 on: December 21, 2006, 07:20:22 PM »
chiguy,

After reading your post, I called a local Sbarro's and asked about their pizza sizes. I was told that there is only one size--18". When I asked how many slices that came to, I was told that they will cut the pizza into 6, 8 or 12 slices, as requested. Of course, in any individual case, mileage may vary. It’s also possible that a pizza that is 18” on the peel shrinks a bit during baking.

I know that a lot of places that sell by the slice, as does Sbarro’s, often cut pizzas above 16” into 6 slices rather than 8. Maybe that is what you saw.

Peter

Offline Trinity

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #37 on: December 22, 2006, 06:25:38 AM »
I bet the lard is the "secret ingredient" for the taste of the crust. :chef:
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Offline joe

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #38 on: December 26, 2006, 01:05:39 AM »
Hello everyone! I love baking pizza but I would be an Icon (in my kids eyes) if I could duplicate Sbarro's this crust pizza and their sauce. Any ideas?

Thanks


came upon this on ebay. hope the link works.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Sbarros-Pizza-Sauce_W0QQitemZ190065670049QQihZ009QQcategoryZ25384QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Sbarro's mall pizza
« Reply #39 on: December 26, 2006, 09:45:52 AM »
joe,

I believe the eBay sauces are pasta sauces, not pizza sauces. See, for example, http://www.sbarro.com/sauces.php. My recollection is that Steve looked into the sauces when they were first introduced and came away with the impression that the marinara sauce was one that might be closest to a pizza sauce. See Reply 7 in this thread.

Peter
« Last Edit: December 26, 2006, 09:53:52 AM by Pete-zza »