Author Topic: Style=Time  (Read 1977 times)

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Offline Tscarborough

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Style=Time
« on: October 11, 2012, 11:13:00 PM »
It is almost impossible to break down pizza styles by objective observations.  There is one thing that is true no matter what ingredients, sauce, dough formulation, or toppings are used and that is the time of the bake.  Therefore, I hereby decree and declare that from now on we will use the following to determine what the hell you are cooking:

Neapolitan:  40-90 seconds.
New York: 3-5 minutes.
American: 6-12 minutes.
Deep dish: 20-30 minutes.


There, the argument is done.


Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2012, 11:16:24 PM »
What are all the pies that fall in the 91 second to 2:59 gap?
Pizza is not bread.

Offline Tscarborough

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2012, 11:17:53 PM »
Those would be Neo-Neapolitan.

Offline pizzaneer

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2012, 11:20:45 PM »
Thanks Tom.  I feel better already.  No more worrying.  No more therapist's couch, hypnosis, or intervention treatments!  Of course, that's just me.  I hope I just had a mild case.  There might be others who need more help...

I'd rather eat one good meal a day than 3 squares of garbage.

Offline widespreadpizza

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2012, 11:29:56 PM »
Tom,  I do like your insight as to time/stlye.  Seems odd to me though as the one who claims the pizza does not care where the heat comes from.  I have always thought that the oven determines partially what comes out of it.  -Marc

Offline Tscarborough

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2012, 11:37:32 PM »
Pizza doesn't care where the heat comes from, but it DOES care how long it is applied and at what temp (which is generally related).  That is really the only thing that can be used to define a style (other than things like shape).

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2012, 11:45:33 PM »
Pizza doesn't care where the heat comes from, but it DOES care how long it is applied and at what temp (which is generally related).  That is really the only thing that can be used to define a style (other than things like shape).

Pizza does care about the form of heat (i.e. convection, conduction, IR), and that may be related to where the heat comes from.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline Tscarborough

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2012, 11:48:32 PM »
That is a generalist hominy, not a specific instruction.  P.S. bring dry wood with you, mine is all wet.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2012, 11:50:41 PM »
Wood is on Gene's shopping list.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline Don K

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2012, 12:11:01 AM »
So, if I bake a NY style 7 minutes and it burns, is it a burned NY style or a burned American style?
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2012, 12:25:54 AM »
So, if I bake a NY style 7 minutes and it burns, is it a burned NY style or a burned American style?
Neither Don.....are you trying to make hominy or sum'in?  ;D
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Offline Don K

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2012, 12:46:54 AM »
Neither Don.....are you trying to make hominy or sum'in?  ;D
No, I've never tried to make hominy Bob. Then again, I've never been much of a musician.
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Offline scott123

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #12 on: October 12, 2012, 05:54:08 AM »
Neapolitan:  40-90 seconds.
New York: 3-5 minutes.
American: 6-12 minutes.


For some reason... I think I might have heard this before. Maybe.  It sounds familiar  ;D

Kidding aside, you're preaching to the choir. I could not agree more.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2012, 06:07:30 AM by scott123 »

Offline Tscarborough

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #13 on: October 12, 2012, 08:31:19 AM »
Yep, this just puts it at topic level to make it easier to find.

Offline scott123

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2012, 08:41:24 AM »
Yep, this just puts it at topic level to make it easier to find.

Sounds good  :)

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2012, 10:58:28 AM »
So, if I bake a NY style 7 minutes and it burns, is it a burned NY style or a burned American style?

It would be New Haven style I believe.  Closer to NY than American.   I would say NY can span around 4-8m.   And American would be 8-12m.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2012, 01:55:54 PM by Jackie Tran »

Offline scott123

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2012, 01:40:23 PM »
Yes, Chau makes a good point.  Along the "generalist hominy" lines that Tom mentioned, as you delve into the details, this can get quite complex.

While a second beyond 2 minutes causes a pizza to no longer be classifiable as Neapolitan, imo, New York's 3-6 minutes is more of a sweet spot than a firm definition.  Good NY happens in 3-6, while mediocre NY happens from 6-12.

When you get into coal, it really gets hairy.  Coal can range from 2.5 to 7 minutes, and, because of the forced air aspect, it relies heavily on convection, which, in turn, causes it to be the most oven specific of all the styles.

Offline norma427

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2012, 01:46:44 PM »
I wonder what Reinhart doughs that are baked in a WFO for about 1 minutes, or a Reinhart dough that is baked in a deck oven for about 6 minutes are called.  Both can be quite tasty in my opinion, but are they then both called American style?

Norma
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Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #18 on: October 12, 2012, 01:51:49 PM »
What are all the pies that fall in the 91 second to 2:59 gap?

Yes I agree with Tom.  Neo Neapolitan or what I call hybrid pies.  This is the category Bianco's pies fall into.  The pie in my avatar is a hybrid pie at around 2.5m bake.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2012, 01:55:19 PM by Jackie Tran »

Offline scott123

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Re: Style=Time
« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2012, 02:07:24 PM »
I wonder what Reinhart doughs that are baked in a WFO for about 1 minutes, or a Reinhart dough that is baked in a deck oven for about 6 minutes are called.  Both can be quite tasty in my opinion, but are they then both called American style?

Reinopolitan? Rein-York Style?  ;D

Seriously, though, Reinhart has a Neapolitan dough recipe that is AP and 66% hydration.  I know what Marco would say, and 66 is pretty darn high, but it might fall under the wire.  I think the final criteria would be appearance.  If it were leoparded, with a puffy crumb and no gum line (higher hydration creates a bigger potential for gum lines), then I think it might be close.

His high sugar high oil 'NY' dough, even if baked for 4 minutes, would still be, due to the quantity of ingredients, American.