Author Topic: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!  (Read 215317 times)

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Offline Ev

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1075 on: January 05, 2013, 09:50:52 PM »
Steve,

All three of your pies look very tasty!  :chef:  What kind of cheese, or cheeses did you use.  I like the no crumb sag from the sauce.  :-D

Norma


Norma, I used a blend, maybe 50/50 of Weis sharp cheddar and Country brand wm/lm mozz.  It wasn't bad but not as good as brick or ampi cheddar.


Offline Ev

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1076 on: January 05, 2013, 09:52:07 PM »
Steve the squares look killer, absolutely killer!  You could put L & B out of business.

Thanks Gene but I don't think L&B needs to worry much about me! :-D

Offline norma427

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1077 on: January 05, 2013, 10:11:16 PM »
Norma,

There is another "pizza genius" that took a page out of Gus Guerra's book, with a lot of analogs to what Gus and his successors did: Dom DeMarco of DiFara's.

Dom uses a flavorful blend of flours (00 and high-gluten) along with a fairly high hydration and salt and yeast (but no oil or sugar) to make an emergency dough. I even recall when he once showed me a drawer or something similar under his oven where he kept the emergency dough balls warm and cozy, much as you use your Hatco unit to do the same thing with your emergency Buddy's clone doughs.

Dom then took what most of us would consider a pedestrian dough and used some really high quality cheeses (imported and Grande), fresh and imported tomatoes (San Marzano DOPs), freshly grated hard cheeses (like Reggiano-Parmigiano and Grana Padano), and fresh herbs. For years, customers have lined up for Dom's pizzas, oblivious to the shortcomings of his dough (at least to some of us on this forum) but finding great appeal in all of the quality items Dom put on his pizzas. It also certainly helped that the media heaped praise on Dom and DiFara's over the years, just as is done by the Detroit-area media with Buddy's. Like Dom set a standard against many NY pizza makers would be measured, Buddy's is the king of the hill against which all other Detroit style pizza makers are compared and measured.

Peter

Peter,

Thanks for reminding me of the other “pizza genius”, Dom DeMarco of DiFara’s.  I know Dom has also done something like Buddy’s pizza in that he uses what is an emergency dough.  I didn’t know though that he once showed you a drawer or something similar under his oven where he kept the emergency dough balls warm and cozy, like I am trying to do in the Hatco Unit.  I wonder how long his dough balls stayed in the drawer.  Did you taste any byproducts of fermentation in Dom’s crust, or were the toppings the star of the pizza you tried something like Buddy’s pizza?

I also looked on the web for higher hydration Sicilian doughs without any salt, but didn’t find any.   

I also know Dom took what is basically an emergency dough and then added really high quality ingredients and fresh herbs on his baked pizzas.  I also agree that the media helped both DiFara’s and Buddy’s.  They both are “pizza geniuses".   

Norma
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Offline gschwim

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1078 on: January 06, 2013, 01:35:48 AM »
I'm too lazy to search for the exact post, but I had mentioned remembering a "creaminess" to the Buddy's pizzas I remember from Detroit.  I'm sure Buddy's didn't (doesn't) use this type of flour, but I made a Detroit style pie (and ate it before I could photograph it(!), but it looked like the others on this thread) using Italian 00 flour and definitely got the "creamy" effect.  Or maybe it was the recipe and not the flour, because this also was the first time I tried using Jim Lahey's recipe from his new - and very good - book, My Pizza (http://www.amazon.com/My-Pizza-Easy-No-Knead-Spectacular/dp/0307886158/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1357452859&sr=1-1&keywords=my+pizza)

The recipe is very simple:

500 grams flour (recipe specifies AP, but again, I used 00)
1 gram (1/4 tsp) active dry yeast (I made a mistake and used IDY).
16 grams (2 tsp) fine sea salt
350 grams water

As you all probably know, Lahey's method is to mix the ingredients for about 30 seconds or just enough to combine the ingredients and then leave it covered (I use a plastic container with the snap-on live lifted slightly in one corner) until it doubles, about 18 hours.  But perhaps, because I used IDY instead of ADY, it more than doubled, and a lot sooner than 18 hours (more like 8-10).  So I put the container in the refrigerator that morning and took it out around 9:00 p.m. for a late dinner.  

Oh, one more thing:  Lahey says, just mix the dough for 30 seconds by hand; however, I've always had trouble incorporating all the flour into the water, so I mixed, with the dough hook, on my Kitchenaid for about 1 minute, until the flour came together.

Anyway, I pulled out a 300 gram chunk of dough and spread it out in an 8 x 10 blue steel pan lubed with butter-flavored Crisco - and made an interesting discovery.  I don't recall seeing anyone post about this, but I've always had trouble spreading the dough out in the pan.  But this time, with cold dough, fresh out of the fridge, spreading the dough was very easy.  Then I let the pan sit out for about an hour, to warm up a bit and then I baked the pizza and everything was fine.

My only "complaint" was that the finished product was a bit thicker than I wanted, so I think I will try just 250 grams of dough, next time, as well as trying AP flour, and I think I will substitute 1/8 tsp IDY for the 1/4 tsp ADY in Lahey's recipe.  And getting back to the dough, maybe I will try what one or more of you said that Dom DiFara does, mixing 00 and bread flour (which, I understand, they also do in Italy).  Can anyone advise me on the right ratio (by weight) of 00 and bread?

Final point:  Some of you have been talking about thickness and posting photos with a ruler alongside, to show how thick the pie is.  But unless I'm misremembering something, all the photos were taken with the ruler being held against the outside of the pie.  But I don't recall the Buddy's pizzas being particular thick - thicker than a round pie, yes, but not as thick as a "standard" Sicilian.  (But maybe those of you who have ordered Buddy's pies on the Internet can correct me if I'm wrong.)  So I'm thinking that the height might be accounted for by how high the "edge cheese" rides up the inside wall of the pan.  The caramelized cheese crust, of course, is one of the features that distinguishes a Buddy's/Detroit style pizza, so I can see why a pizzeria would want to get as much "naked" crust as possible.

And finally, since I referred to My Pizza, it's a great book that I would recommend everyone to get.  Some interesting recipes that I actually think could work well with a Detroit-style dough, but definitely look great for a standard round pizza.

Gene
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 01:43:56 AM by gschwim »

Offline norma427

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1079 on: January 06, 2013, 09:02:41 AM »
I'm too lazy to search for the exact post, but I had mentioned remembering a "creaminess" to the Buddy's pizzas I remember from Detroit.  I'm sure Buddy's didn't (doesn't) use this type of flour, but I made a Detroit style pie (and ate it before I could photograph it(!), but it looked like the others on this thread) using Italian 00 flour and definitely got the "creamy" effect.  Or maybe it was the recipe and not the flour, because this also was the first time I tried using Jim Lahey's recipe from his new - and very good - book, My Pizza (http://www.amazon.com/My-Pizza-Easy-No-Knead-Spectacular/dp/0307886158/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1357452859&sr=1-1&keywords=my+pizza)

The recipe is very simple:

500 grams flour (recipe specifies AP, but again, I used 00)
1 gram (1/4 tsp) active dry yeast (I made a mistake and used IDY).
16 grams (2 tsp) fine sea salt
350 grams water

As you all probably know, Lahey's method is to mix the ingredients for about 30 seconds or just enough to combine the ingredients and then leave it covered (I use a plastic container with the snap-on live lifted slightly in one corner) until it doubles, about 18 hours.  But perhaps, because I used IDY instead of ADY, it more than doubled, and a lot sooner than 18 hours (more like 8-10).  So I put the container in the refrigerator that morning and took it out around 9:00 p.m. for a late dinner.  

Oh, one more thing:  Lahey says, just mix the dough for 30 seconds by hand; however, I've always had trouble incorporating all the flour into the water, so I mixed, with the dough hook, on my Kitchenaid for about 1 minute, until the flour came together.

Anyway, I pulled out a 300 gram chunk of dough and spread it out in an 8 x 10 blue steel pan lubed with butter-flavored Crisco - and made an interesting discovery.  I don't recall seeing anyone post about this, but I've always had trouble spreading the dough out in the pan.  But this time, with cold dough, fresh out of the fridge, spreading the dough was very easy.  Then I let the pan sit out for about an hour, to warm up a bit and then I baked the pizza and everything was fine.

My only "complaint" was that the finished product was a bit thicker than I wanted, so I think I will try just 250 grams of dough, next time, as well as trying AP flour, and I think I will substitute 1/8 tsp IDY for the 1/4 tsp ADY in Lahey's recipe.  And getting back to the dough, maybe I will try what one or more of you said that Dom DiFara does, mixing 00 and bread flour (which, I understand, they also do in Italy).  Can anyone advise me on the right ratio (by weight) of 00 and bread?

Final point:  Some of you have been talking about thickness and posting photos with a ruler alongside, to show how thick the pie is.  But unless I'm misremembering something, all the photos were taken with the ruler being held against the outside of the pie.  But I don't recall the Buddy's pizzas being particular thick - thicker than a round pie, yes, but not as thick as a "standard" Sicilian.  (But maybe those of you who have ordered Buddy's pies on the Internet can correct me if I'm wrong.)  So I'm thinking that the height might be accounted for by how high the "edge cheese" rides up the inside wall of the pan.  The caramelized cheese crust, of course, is one of the features that distinguishes a Buddy's/Detroit style pizza, so I can see why a pizzeria would want to get as much "naked" crust as possible.

And finally, since I referred to My Pizza, it's a great book that I would recommend everyone to get.  Some interesting recipes that I actually think could work well with a Detroit-style dough, but definitely look great for a standard round pizza.

Gene




Gene,

The post you made about “creaminess” was at Reply 917 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21559.msg229502.html#msg229502 

I am glad your Detroit style pizza made with Caputo flour and Jim Lahey’s recipe gave you the “creamy” effect you were looking for.  Maybe Buddy’s has changed their flours over the years, but Buddy’s did tell me at Reply 105 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21559.msg220791.html#msg220791 that the flour they use had a protein content of 12.2%.  Buddy’s also uses a bromated flour, which is why I am now using the Occident bromated flour at 12.2% for my attempts.

I also posted about the Lahey’s method different times here on the forum and did try out some of his formulations. 

I really don’t know, but for me the dough when it is cold is also easy to spread out, after the dough ball was placed in the steel pan to ferment.  I would guess that is from the higher hydration, but really don’t know.  I had less luck using cold dough balls and then putting them in the steel pans for stretching right out of the fridge, but they were okay.


It is hard to really judge how high in height a real Buddy’s pizza is, or has been just by looking at pictures on the web of Buddy‘s pizzas.  I have been measuring heights of the final baked Buddy’s clones I have been attempting because I wanted to see for one thing how my different ways of fermenting, adding different amounts of yeast, final dough temperature, etc. for a Buddy’s clone dough would affect the final bake height.  Also since I purchased a real Buddy’s pizza I took a picture of the height of that pizza at Reply 533 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21559.msg225593.html#msg225593 to compare my different Buddy’s clone attempts.   

I think it is interesting that you don’t recall the Buddy’s pizzas being much thicker than a normal pizza.  I did look at some of those really old black and white photos Buddy’s has on their website and those pizzas didn’t look very high in height either.  I don’t know if Buddy’s changed their amount of doughs they used for their pies over the years or not.

If you want to mix flours to get a certain protein level, Novembers’ Mixed Mass Dough Calculation Tool can help you do that.  http://foodsim.unclesalmon.com/  Right now you might have to scroll down to see the tool, because something isn’t working right when you click on the link.

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1080 on: January 06, 2013, 11:04:59 AM »
Norma,

Thanks for reminding me of the other “pizza genius”, Dom DeMarco of DiFara’s.  I know Dom has also done something like Buddy’s pizza in that he uses what is an emergency dough.  I didn’t know though that he once showed you a drawer or something similar under his oven where he kept the emergency dough balls warm and cozy, like I am trying to do in the Hatco Unit.  I wonder how long his dough balls stayed in the drawer.  Did you taste any byproducts of fermentation in Dom’s crust, or were the toppings the star of the pizza you tried something like Buddy’s pizza?
My recollection is that the dough at DiFara's was made throughout the day, much as Buddy's does. I don't recall discussing how long the dough balls were held in the drawer. As far as the crust flavors were concerned, we made the mistake of ordering a lot of vegetable toppings and, as a result, the crust was on the soggy side. I don't recall that there were a lot of crust flavors per se.

I also looked on the web for higher hydration Sicilian doughs without any salt, but didn’t find any.
I wouldn't expect that you would find many Sicilian doughs without salt, at least in the U.S., where people crave salt in their bread products. As mentioned previously in the context of the Chicago deep-dish doughs, there are very few such doughs that use no salt but they are not completely unheard of. According to the Slice article at http://slice.seriouseats.com/archives/2012/05/detroit-the-guerra-legacy-lives-on-at-cloverleaf.html, allegedly Gus Guerra, the founder of Buddy's, got the idea for the Sicilian style pizza from his Sicilian mother-in-law. That tidbit of information prompted me to do some searching for Sicilian bread products that call for no salt. I found examples for salt-free Sicilian bread and focaccia and pizza dough at http://www.siciliancookingplus.com/Bread-Making.html, http://sicilyscene.blogspot.com/2008/07/focaccia.html and http://recipes.sparkpeople.com/recipe-detail.asp?recipe=1724529. I did not find examples of high-hydration Sicilian pizza doughs so I can't point to something that Gus Guerra might have gotten from his Sicilian mother-in-law. On this point, I have always tended to be suspicious of famous and successful Italian pizza operators who claim that their dough recipes came from Italy, usually a parent or some other family member. I recall reading about such claims at Papa Gino's (its predecessor), Home Run Inn, Giordano's and Jets, just to cite the ones off the top of my head.

My view on salt for the Buddy's clones is to use it if desired. Maybe one day we will learn whether Buddy's uses salt in its dough and whether its Nutrition information reflects such use.

Peter


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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1081 on: January 06, 2013, 11:47:31 AM »
Norma,
My recollection is that the dough at DiFara's was made throughout the day, much as Buddy's does. I don't recall discussing how long the dough balls were held in the drawer. As far as the crust flavors were concerned, we made the mistake of ordering a lot of vegetable toppings and, as a result, the crust was on the soggy side. I don't recall that there were a lot of crust flavors per se.
I wouldn't expect that you would find many Sicilian doughs without salt, at least in the U.S., where people crave salt in their bread products. As mentioned previously in the context of the Chicago deep-dish doughs, there are very few such doughs that use no salt but they are not completely unheard of. According to the Slice article at http://slice.seriouseats.com/archives/2012/05/detroit-the-guerra-legacy-lives-on-at-cloverleaf.html, allegedly Gus Guerra, the founder of Buddy's, got the idea for the Sicilian style pizza from his Sicilian mother-in-law. That tidbit of information prompted me to do some searching for Sicilian bread products that call for no salt. I found examples for salt-free Sicilian bread and focaccia and pizza dough at http://www.siciliancookingplus.com/Bread-Making.html, http://sicilyscene.blogspot.com/2008/07/focaccia.html and http://recipes.sparkpeople.com/recipe-detail.asp?recipe=1724529. I did not find examples of high-hydration Sicilian pizza doughs so I can't point to something that Gus Guerra might have gotten from his Sicilian mother-in-law. On this point, I have always tended to be suspicious of famous and successful Italian pizza operators who claim that their dough recipes came from Italy, usually a parent or some other family member. I recall reading about such claims at Papa Gino's (its predecessor), Home Run Inn, Giordano's and Jets, just to cite the ones off the top of my head.

My view on salt for the Buddy's clones is to use it if desired. Maybe one day we will learn whether Buddy's uses salt in its dough and whether its Nutrition information reflects such use.

Peter





Peter,

Thanks for telling me about the pizza you had at DiFara’s and what your recollection is of how the dough is made and how the crust tasted.  I never tasted a DiFara’s pizza, but hope someday I can.  I almost got to taste one, but then my daughter and her friends wouldn’t stay long enough at DiFara’s to purchase any for me. 

I saw Gus Guerra said he got the idea for the Sicilian pizza from his Sicilian mother-in-law.  Thanks for the links to where you found some examples of salt-free Sicilian bread, focaccia and pizza dough.  I am also suspicious of almost any Italian pizza operators that say they learned how to make their doughs from someone in Italy, unless the pizzas are very good.  I know many local pizzerias that the owners are Italian and they have told me they got their dough recipes from way back in Italy because they is where there relatives live and many of the pizzeria operators also lived in Italy at one time.  I sure wouldn’t say anything special about their crusts on their pizza either, because I have found them to be rather bland since I joined this forum and learned more about making pizza.  At one time I did think some of their pizzas were really special.   

Thanks for telling me your view on to use salt or not in my Buddy‘s clones. 

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1082 on: January 06, 2013, 11:53:29 AM »
I really don’t think this post will tell much of anything, but am going to post it anyway.  I was looking at the waybackmachine some more.

This is a sample menu from the waybackmachine on Buddy’s menu on 2003.  It states in the menu why the pepperoni is placed under the cheese. http://web.archive.org/web/20021204205818/http://buddyspizza.com/menu.htm

Picture blown-up of how thick Buddy’s pizza looked years ago and also a picture blown-up from “Sometimes you just Need Some Buddy’s from a new campaign Buddy‘s started then I think in 2002, or even by 2001. http://web.archive.org/web/20021206094711/http://buddyspizza.com/buddysgivesback.htm

Another picture of Buddy’s pizza back in 2001 against the buildings. http://web.archive.org/web/20010301201221/http://www.buddyspizza.com/

More pictures on the right of one of Buddy’s advertising campaigns in 2005. http://web.archive.org/web/20050921030553/http://www.buddyspizza.com/

If the top pictures (old pictures) on Buddy’s website are looked at the pies did look thinner year ago at Buddy‘s, if my eyes aren‘t deceiving me.  I think, but really don’t know, that Buddy’s did change their sizes of their dough balls over the years, or something else happened.

http://web.archive.org/web/20101012142327/http://www.buddyspizza.com/index.asp

I also went on the waybackmachine and look at http://louispizza.net/  The picture at the top of the page at http://web.archive.org/web/20090313033242/http://louispizza.net/ doesn’t look that thick either.  That is the same picture Loui’s has on their webpage now, but with more pictures added

I also went back on the waybackmachine to http://www.shieldspizza.com/ but couldn‘t find much.

I think the article about Detroit's Iconic Eateries Flourish In Vanishing Neighborhoods
By Allan Lengel is interesting in how it has an article about Buddy’s Pizza if you scroll down. http://www.deadlinedetroit.com/articles/3112/detroit_s_iconic_eateries_flourish_in_vanishing_neighborhoods  By reading that article it can be seen how Buddy’s original neighborhood had better days.

Edit:  I think the new campaign started in 1999.
Norma
« Last Edit: January 06, 2013, 11:57:09 AM by norma427 »
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Offline norma427

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1083 on: January 07, 2013, 06:11:31 PM »
It was only a little over 50 degrees at market today and even after I had my small heater on for a while it still only brought the temperature up at market a couple of degrees, so to me it was cold today at market, because I didn’t put on any heavier clothes and sure couldn’t keep my coat on.  Of course then my flour and water were colder than last week.

I purchased a 50 lb. bag of the Occident flour this morning because my 25 lb. bag was almost gone.  I really don’t think my other digital thermometer at market is broken, but I need to get a battery to see if that will fix it. I took the old battery out today and it looks rusted, so hopefully the thermometer will work after I purchase a new battery. I took my home digital thermometer along today to take the final dough temperature.  I wanted to see how a fairly normal final dough temperature would do.  It can be seen in the three pictures with the digital thermometer how fast the temperature dropped in a matter of a few minutes from it being colder at market.  The dough mixed well and balled well.  I placed poppy seeds on one dough ball in the steel pan to see how much it ferments until tomorrow morning.  I forgot scan the print out sheet on my printer from the expanded dough calculation tool, so I just took a picture of it.  The dough balls for the 8”x10” steel pans were scaled to 9.5 ounces and for the large steel pan to 18 ounces.  I also received 3 more small steel pans Saturday from Detroit Style Pizza Co. and 1 larger steel pan.

Hopefully things will go well tomorrow with the Buddy’s clone dough formulation I decided to try, the tempering and the final pizzas.

Jeff, I also opened up the Weyauwega aged brick and the mild brick cheeses you sent me to taste them today and the aged brick cheese did smell kind of stinky, but it tasted very good.  ;D It wasn’t too strong for me and sure didn’t taste anything like Limburger cheese.  The mild brick also was very good.  I wonder why the aged brick is creamier though.  I am anxious to try both brick cheeses tomorrow.

Norma
« Last Edit: January 07, 2013, 06:13:47 PM by norma427 »
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1084 on: January 07, 2013, 06:13:03 PM »
Norma
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1085 on: January 08, 2013, 09:24:14 PM »
Just wanted to post that there wasn’t problems with sag under the sauce today and two Buddy’s style clone pizzas were made by 10:35 AM this morning.  I sure don’t know what the heck changed, but I was glad today.  ;D Both of these pizzas had the sauce put on before the bake.  One was a cheese and sauce and the other was the coarse grind pepperoni put under the cheese and sauce.

Norma
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1086 on: January 08, 2013, 10:04:43 PM »
Fab Norma!!  :chef:
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1087 on: January 08, 2013, 10:15:18 PM »
Fab Norma!!  :chef:

Thanks Bob, things just seemed to go much better today.

Norma

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1088 on: January 09, 2013, 08:39:08 AM »
The Buddy’s clone tempering of the dough and the final pizzas went much better yesterday.  It seems like about 45-60 minutes in the Hatco Unit is about the best tempering time so far.  The temperature of the Hatco Unit was between about 85-95 degrees F.  I didn’t change the temperature on the Hatco Unit, but watched how the temperature fluctuates.  It seems like when tempering the dough in a steel pan for a lot longer, the dough seems almost overproofed, but will have to watch that more. 

I also found the Hatco Unit is good for tempering the doughs in the steels pans for Greek style pizza.  A couple that are regular customers came and wanted to purchase a whole Greek pizza about 6:00 PM last evening and along with tempering the dough in the steel pan in the Hatco Unit for about 25 minutes, the Greek pizza was made from start to finish in about 45 minutes.  I also tried the Hatco Unit for tempering cold (right of the pizza prep fridge) regular NY style dough balls yesterday and in about 15 minutes they are warmed up enough to make them really easy to open.  I don’t know why I didn’t think of using the Hatco Unit for them before.  I guess I will always have those doh moments.    :-D

The Buddy’s clone pizza was sauce yesterday a little differently.  I didn’t sauce in exactly two or three racing stripes, but more or less dropped the sauce in different places, except in the one Buddy’s clone pizza.  That method seems to work better in the sag issue I had.  The one dough ball in the steel pan seemed like it was tempered too long and then it had hills and valleys in the height of the top of the pizza, but the crumb didn’t sag from the addition of the sauce.  I still have a lot to learn about tempering this style of dough and how to apply different dressings, but overall it went better yesterday.  Since Steve and I noticed on different Buddy’s clones we have tried that if the pepperoni is put under the cheese it really can’t be tasted, so both of us decided it is better to put the pepperoni on top of the pizza.  I found out last week if the pepperoni is put on top right away, the pepperoni wants to brown too much, so the second pepperoni Buddy’s clone pizza yesterday was put on the pizza while the pizza still part way in the oven about 4 minutes from the final bake.  That seemed to work better.  The first pizza was dressed with the pepperoni under the cheese, but Steve and I both talked about that and concluded as why to dress these Buddy’s pepperoni clones that way if the pepperoni can’t really be tasted.  The bottom crusts are browning well and are crispy.  All the customers that purchased slices of the Buddy’s clone pizzas yesterday did really like the slices.  All the Buddy’s clone doughs were used up yesterday to make Buddy‘s clone pizzas.  The maintenance men and the old flea mill manager said these are the best pizzas they ever tasted. 

I also have to watch how I put the dough balls in the steel pan in the deli case.  My shelves on my deli case are slanting shelves, so some of the dough balls slid to the one side of the steel pan.  I need to put the one end of the steel pan on the ledge of the slating shelves so the dough balls will stay in the middle of the steel pans.  It also gets a little hairy trying to make 3 styles of pizzas at one time with only two people working.  I think my experimenting with different doughs and style of pizza is soon going to be very limited because I don’t see how I will have time to do those experiments.  :(  I sure will miss those experiments, but this has been a fun journey. 

Rocco and his friend also stopped by again yesterday morning while I was busy.  Rocco comes ever few weeks to ask me about selling my small pizza stand to him.  He always says the pizzas look good.  He asked again yesterday morning if I would sell my pizza stand to him and I said to Rocco, then what would I do.  Rocco then said I could stay at home with my boyfriend.  I told Rocco I don’t have a boyfriend and I do really love making pizzas.  Rocco’s friend asked me if he should find a boyfriend for me and I said no.  Rocco asked me if I still have his phone number and I said yes I do.  I asked Rocco if he ever tried to make Detroit style pizzas and he said no.  Rocco has never tasted one of my pizzas.  My one friend across the aisle from me said he I ever sell my pizza stand to Rocco she is going to kill me because Rocco is so arrogant.  :-D She always hears the conversations between me and Rocco.

I also think I am oiling my steel pans too much with Canola oil and will have to try less Canola oil next week. 

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1089 on: January 09, 2013, 08:40:57 AM »
Norma
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1090 on: January 09, 2013, 08:42:40 AM »
Norma
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1091 on: January 09, 2013, 08:45:05 AM »
Norma
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1092 on: January 09, 2013, 08:46:28 AM »
The first picture is the hills and valley Buddy's clone pizza.

Norma
« Last Edit: January 09, 2013, 09:07:41 AM by norma427 »
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1093 on: January 09, 2013, 08:52:57 AM »
I had ordered some frozen Casa Italian Style Meatballs from my food distributor and used them on the Pete-zza TexItaliano Buddy’s clone.  The sign that was just quickly made said green peppers, but red peppers were used.  The rest of the dressings on the sign were right.  Those flavors all combined together on the Pete-zza TexItaliano Buddy’s clone pizza were delicious and I wasn‘t the only one that had those thoughts.  I thought Peter needs a Buddy’s clone pizza named after him, since he has helped me so much on this thread.  I will be offering this pizza every week.  The Casa Italian Style Meatballs are very good when eaten plain or on the pizza.  The Italian meatballs were sliced and cheese was placed under and over the meatballs, then the other dressings were added.  The meatballs were heated in the oven first.

Jeff’s mild brick cheese was also used on the Pete-zza TexItaliano Buddy’s clone yesterday.  Jeff’s mild brick cheese was very good on this pizza and the mild brick cheese stretched well on the bake pizza.  The edges got browner from Jeff’s mild brick cheese but they sure didn’t taste browner.  I didn’t get to try out Jeff’s aged brick cheese because I ran out of dough balls.

I have to work on making better signs.  

Thanks so much Peter for helping me on this thread.  I wouldn't have come this far without your help.   :chef:

Norma  
« Last Edit: January 09, 2013, 09:10:07 AM by norma427 »
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1094 on: January 09, 2013, 08:56:23 AM »
Thanks so much Jeff for sending me the brick cheese to try.  ;D The brick cheese was very good.  It was the only cheese I used on this pizza.

Norma
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1095 on: January 09, 2013, 08:57:49 AM »
Norma
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1096 on: January 09, 2013, 09:02:03 AM »
I also told Steve I wanted the name a pizza after him and asked him if he would come up with a name and dressings for a Buddy’s clone pizza.  Steve named his pizza Marco Pollo.  The Marco Pollo Buddy’s clone pizza was also very good.  Many customers stopped to say how good it looked.  I will let Steve post if he wants to in what dressings were used for his Marco Pollo Buddy’s clone pizza.  I didn’t know what kind of pizza Steve was going to come up with and he brought the extra dressings yesterday and we just used my dough and cheese blends.  When Steve wrote out his sign he mistakenly put Marco Polo on the sign, but the sign should have read Ev’s Marco Pollo.

Steve used the dough ball with the poppy seeds on to watch how that dough ball fermented.  The poppy seeds were measured at 9:30 AM and at 3:10 PM.  The dough ball was used about 5:30 PM to make Ev’s Marco Pollo Buddy’s clone pizza.  

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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1097 on: January 09, 2013, 09:04:54 AM »
Norma
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1098 on: January 09, 2013, 09:17:14 AM »
Rocco sounds like quite a character, tell him he can start by buying some pizza!  :-D I've enjoyed seeing how your Buddy's clones progressed. You and Peter did a really good job. Do you plan on offering them regularly?
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Re: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1099 on: January 09, 2013, 09:41:42 AM »
Rocco sounds like quite a character, tell him he can start by buying some pizza!  :-D I've enjoyed seeing how your Buddy's clones progressed. You and Peter did a really good job. Do you plan on offering them regularly?

Jeff,

Rocco is quite a character.  :-D  He has been bugging me to sell him my small pizza stand at market for a long while.  Rocco’s one buddy was supposed to open a pizza stand at the same spot where I am now, but something happened that he never opened it although he did have some of his equipment there for about 6 months.  He then stuck the market manager with all the costs of running water and electric to the stand.  Rocco does own a big pizzeria near Gettysburg, Pa., so it always wonders me why he wants my small stand.  Rocco told me one time he wanted it for his nephew and then told me another time he wanted to run it.  I ever offered to let him taste my pizza different times for free, but he would never taste it.  The other week he stopped by when I was really busy because Steve wasn’t there yet.  He said to me do you want me to put on a apron and come back there and sling some doughs and I said no.   :-D

I know Peter did a great job in helping me with everything he suggested and told me to try in this thread.  

Yes, I do plan on offering the Buddy’s clones all the time.  

Thanks again for the brick cheeses you sent me to try!  ;D

Norma

Edit:  This is Rocco's pizzeria. http://www.eatroccos.com/index.html
« Last Edit: January 09, 2013, 09:53:06 AM by norma427 »
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