Author Topic: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!  (Read 131987 times)

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Offline gschwim

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1120 on: January 09, 2013, 11:50:40 PM »

Bobby Flay was at market sometime, but I am trying to find out when he was there from market people.  I saw someone post different links on facebook about Bobby Flay being at Rootís, but canít find that episode on the Food Network to watch it, or find when he was there.  I think Bobby Flay was at the roast beef food stand eating their roast beef sandwiches. 

Norma


Why don't you challenge Bobby Flay to a Throwdown?  http://www.foodnetwork.com/throwdown-with-bobby-flay/index.html

Gene


Offline gschwim

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1121 on: January 09, 2013, 11:58:44 PM »
Norma,
As you know, making a dough in a home environment with a standard stand mixer is different than making dough in a commercial setting using a commercial mixer. Sometime, you might try making a Buddy's clone dough batch at market, or maybe a small test batch at home, that uses a longer knead time, to more fully develop the gluten structure.

Peter

You might want to try my modified Jim Lahey method.  Mix the dough just enough to combine all the ingredients - i.e., all of the flour incorporated into the water - perhaps reduce the amount of yeast and then let it rise at room temperature until doubled, about 18 hours.  You can then refrigerate it if you want.

In the finished dough, the gluten seems pretty strong to me, yet easy to spread in the pan, but I need to try "panning" some room temperature dough to see whether the method or the refrigerator temperature accounts for the good spreadability.

Gene

Offline gschwim

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1122 on: January 10, 2013, 12:12:05 AM »
Norma,
I would say that the Facebook commentor is correct and is consistent with what shuboyle (Jeff) said at Reply 590 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21559.msg226080.html#msg226080. At the same time, it looks like the Detroit Style Pizza Co is trying to popularize that style of pizza outside of the Detroit area by changing its name. You can see that objective at the Via 313 website at http://via313.com/style ("Spread the Revolution") and similarly at the Brown Dog Pizza in Telluride CO at http://www.browndogpizza.net/story.php.
The term "bready" is so general and vague that I wouldn't know what meaning to attach to it. The "greasy" complaint is a fairly common one, especially if a 4-square pizza contains a half-pound of brick cheese with a high fat content.

Peter


As someone born and bred in Detroit, I think the lady is only part right.  It's true, when I grew up in Detroit, we never used the term, "Detroit pizza."  I only started using it... well, here, when I started the Buddy's thread, because it was only after leaving Detroit that I realized that the style was unique.  But in Detroit, the it was just, "Let's got to Buddy's... or Shield's or whatever.  Neither me nor any of my friends were "pizzaphiles," just kids that liked pizza.  We liked Buddy's, Shield's, etc. better than plain old round pizza or Sicilian, but we didn't know, or particularly care, why - it just tasted good!

Though I don't know, I suspect that people in Chicago called their unique style "deep-dish pizza" or something, until it became widely known to people beyond Chicago.

So today, I can say "Chicago pizza" and people know what I'm talking about.  But say "Detroit pizza" and I'm sure I would get a blank stare and need to explain what a "Detroit pizza" is.  In fact, I have a friend here in NYC, who grew up in Detroit, but had no idea what I meant by "Detroit pizza" and in fact had never heard of Buddy's!

But maybe, as the "gospel" of Detroit pizza spreads, maybe that will change...  :^)

Gene

Offline norma427

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1123 on: January 10, 2013, 07:48:42 AM »
Norma,
As you know, making a dough in a home environment with a standard stand mixer is different than making dough in a commercial setting using a commercial mixer. Sometime, you might try making a Buddy's clone dough batch at market, or maybe a small test batch at home, that uses a longer knead time, to more fully develop the gluten structure. That would not be unusual for a high hydration dough and need not penalize the finished crust and crumb in terms of airiness or texture. See, for example, the dough and pizza described at https://sites.google.com/site/hollosyt/quickrusticciabattapizza. My recollection is that the hydration of the dough described in that article was around 90% or so but the principles might be the same for a dough with a hydration of around 71%, but with a shorter total knead time.
Interestingly, Buddy's often touts its pizzas as being healthy and, in so doing, often mentions that their dough contains no oil or sugar, both of which have become villains in certain health and nutrition circles. However, if Buddy's is using no salt in its dough, or very little salt, it has not touted that fact even though salt content of foods has been under attack for many years. Knowing that people often equate no salt with no taste, I am not sure that I would tell people that the dough has no salt either. Also, since there are people out there, like you and me, who are trying to reverse engineer and clone their dough, telling the world that there is little or no salt in their dough would not be a good idea.
It is very difficult to frame highly technical matters as though they are coming from a typical consumer. Ordinary consumers do not try to determine how much cheese and sauce is used on pizzas, including the brands of those ingredients, and then do all kinds of calculations to determine if any salt is used in the dough.
If I had to guess, the Hunt boys at Via 313, having lived in the Detroit area, where PizzaHog also lives, were perhaps testing out the Foremost Farms brick cheese that perhaps was reasonably available in the Detroit area. As we have discovered, there really aren't that many suppliers who can provide commercial quantities of brick cheese to multiple end users, such as Buddy's, Loui's, Shield's, Tony's, etc. Just as Klausie's had trouble sourcing good brick cheese in Raleigh, others outside of the Midwest may also have problems getting good brick cheese locally.
 As has been widely reported in the press, Detroit has been suffering for some time, economically, politically and otherwise. Operating successfully and profitably in such an environment, and also in an environment where the prices of pizza ingredients has been rising quite dramatically, just as we have experienced with our own pizza ingredients, can be extremely challenging. So, looking for cheaper substitutes and cost cutting as much as possible may be behind the lowered quality of the end products. Also, consumers may have less disposable income to spend on pizza, so cheapening the product may be needed to keep existing customers.

Peter

Peter,

I know my Kitchen Aid mixer doesnít mix exactly the same as my Hobart mixer does, and my Hobart is usually faster and does mix better, but I found something Steve told me Tuesday interesting.  Steve told me my crumbs at market are softer than when he used the same formulation as I did (by that I mean the slices just about melt in your mouth if that can be understood (when the BuddyĎs clone doughs are tempered right).  I told Steve my best results on both mixers are when I just use the flat beater on my Kitchen Aid and Hobart mixers and I told him the mixes are on speeds like 1 first then 2 and 3 and sometimes 4 on my Kitchen Aid mixer.  I mix until the dough isnít really sticky in both mixers.  I found Steveís comment about my crumb being different than his crumb somewhat strange, because even at home my Buddyís clone are almost the same in the softer crumb.  Steve told me he doesnít have a flat beater or a Kitchen Aid mixer and mostly mixes by hand and sometimes uses his Bosch mixer if I recall right.  Steve then does stretches and folds different times when I donít do that with my Buddyís clone doughs.  Do you have any explanation as why Steveís Buddyís clone pizzas donít turn out like mine in the crumb?  Maybe if Steve sees this post he can also explain more.  Steve has been looking at some used Kitchen Aid mixers, but I donít know if he will get one or not. 

I am not sure either how far I am developing the gluten structure really at either places, but to me the dough feels strong when trying to be stretched right out of both mixers.  I guess what I am trying to explain is the dough feels something like when trying to feel is the dough is windowpaning if that makes any sense to you.  It can be seen in some of my photos of how the dough balls look after being formed after I divide and scale.  I guess I could mix longer to see what happens.  I also did work on some higher hydration doughs before like in the Pizzarium thread and I know what it takes to get that kind of higher hydration dough stronger.  My way for that is using the stretch and fold methods.

When I sent Buddyís a thank you email for the questions they didnít answer me about the salt.  I just said I understood that if they used no salt in their dough that would be proprietary information, but I also said I thought if they really didnít use salt in their dough that would be healthier for their customers and wondered why if they didnít use salt in their dough why they wouldnít let customers know they are eating a healthier pizza.  I didnít think about people often equate not salt with no taste.  I do know that they are other people out there that are trying to reverse engineer and clone their dough. 

I know it would difficult to discuss highly technical matters with anyone at Buddyís as they would be coming from an ordinary consumer wanting to know about cheese, sauce and salt.  Most ordinary consumers of their products wouldnít care in the least.

I might to try to call Foremost cheese again to see if their brick cheese is available outside of the Midwest area.  I know PizzaHog lives in the Detroit area as the Hunt boys of Via 313 did.  I wonder where Via 313 and Klausieís both get their brick cheeses, since I am almost at the end of the rope in finding a brick cheese unless I would go to Scranton to purchase some.  Scranton is probably about 2 hours away from me and I am not particularly fond of traveling that far just for brick cheese.

I probably will continue to use the AMPI mild white cheddar and the mozzarella blend in my Buddyís clone pizzas, because those combinations seem to work well for me.

This isnít related to the Buddyís clone pizzas and donít want to get too far off topic like I can, but find when trying to quote what someone said and erasing some things I donít want to quote the screen wants to jump too much to get rid of that stuff I donít want in my quote if lots of things need erased.  Do you have the same problems?  I see you can easily just put different quotes and then answer right under them, which I can't easily do.

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1124 on: January 10, 2013, 08:11:57 AM »
Norma,

Can't you just put a piece of dowel or something under the lower end of the pan to prop it up to level?

I like the butter-flavored Crisco to oil my pans for Detroit pizza.  What I especially like is that it sticks to the sides of the pan, all the way to the top of the crust.  Finished pizzas slide right out.  I suppose you could use plain Crisco if you don't like the butter taste, but I actually think the butter adds another flavor note.

Gene



Gene,

I could put a dowel or something under the pans to make it level, but if I just remember to put the one edge of the pans on the edge (which is higher) I think the pans will be level.  

I also think other members like butter-flavored Crisco solid shortening to grease their steel pans and think they did like the taste from the butter-flavored Crisco.  I do have MFB that I could use.  I used that before.  I was just trying to do things somewhat like has been discussed on the Buddyís thread, but I could change my mind of what I might try.  

Norma,

What were the temperature and bake time on those pizzas?  They look very good.  Also, what kind of oven?

Gene


If you want to see pictures of what my Bakerís Pride oven look like they start on Reply 961 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9908.msg153745.html#msg153745 and continue in the next few posts.  I baked at about 538 degrees F, but that can change all depending on how much the oven doors are opened or shut and how many pizzas are going in and out of the oven.  I have found that the top of my deck oven bakes the Buddyís clone pizzas more evenly and I get a better crisp bottom crust.  I think the top deck is a little lower in temperature than my bottom deck.  The bake time is around 12 minutes or a little longer.

Why don't you challenge Bobby Flay to a Throwdown?  http://www.foodnetwork.com/throwdown-with-bobby-flay/index.html

Gene



That is for another thread and really in normal life I am shy unless I really know someone.  I donít think I could ever do something like that.

You might want to try my modified Jim Lahey method.  Mix the dough just enough to combine all the ingredients - i.e., all of the flour incorporated into the water - perhaps reduce the amount of yeast and then let it rise at room temperature until doubled, about 18 hours.  You can then refrigerate it if you want.

In the finished dough, the gluten seems pretty strong to me, yet easy to spread in the pan, but I need to try "panning" some room temperature dough to see whether the method or the refrigerator temperature accounts for the good spreadability.

Gene



I donít think I am going to try the modified Jim Lahey method, although your method is good and I did try that before.  

Norma
 

« Last Edit: January 10, 2013, 08:15:20 AM by norma427 »
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Offline norma427

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1125 on: January 10, 2013, 08:20:20 AM »
As someone born and bred in Detroit, I think the lady is only part right.  It's true, when I grew up in Detroit, we never used the term, "Detroit pizza."  I only started using it... well, here, when I started the Buddy's thread, because it was only after leaving Detroit that I realized that the style was unique.  But in Detroit, the it was just, "Let's got to Buddy's... or Shield's or whatever.  Neither me nor any of my friends were "pizzaphiles," just kids that liked pizza.  We liked Buddy's, Shield's, etc. better than plain old round pizza or Sicilian, but we didn't know, or particularly care, why - it just tasted good!

Though I don't know, I suspect that people in Chicago called their unique style "deep-dish pizza" or something, until it became widely known to people beyond Chicago.

So today, I can say "Chicago pizza" and people know what I'm talking about.  But say "Detroit pizza" and I'm sure I would get a blank stare and need to explain what a "Detroit pizza" is.  In fact, I have a friend here in NYC, who grew up in Detroit, but had no idea what I meant by "Detroit pizza" and in fact had never heard of Buddy's!

But maybe, as the "gospel" of Detroit pizza spreads, maybe that will change...  :^)

Gene


Gene,

Thank you for explaining more about using the term ďDetroit PizzaĒ and what your thoughts about that are.

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1126 on: January 10, 2013, 08:55:06 AM »
Norma,

I know my Kitchen Aid mixer doesnít mix exactly the same as my Hobart mixer does, and my Hobart is usually faster and does mix better, but I found something Steve told me Tuesday interesting.  Steve told me my crumbs at market are softer than when he used the same formulation as I did (by that I mean the slices just about melt in your mouth if that can be understood (when the BuddyĎs clone doughs are tempered right).  I told Steve my best results on both mixers are when I just use the flat beater on my Kitchen Aid and Hobart mixers and I told him the mixes are on speeds like 1 first then 2 and 3 and sometimes 4 on my Kitchen Aid mixer.  I mix until the dough isnít really sticky in both mixers.  I found Steveís comment about my crumb being different than his crumb somewhat strange, because even at home my Buddyís clone are almost the same in the softer crumb.  Steve told me he doesnít have a flat beater or a Kitchen Aid mixer and mostly mixes by hand and sometimes uses his Bosch mixer if I recall right.  Steve then does stretches and folds different times when I donít do that with my Buddyís clone doughs.  Do you have any explanation as why Steveís Buddyís clone pizzas donít turn out like mine in the crumb?  Maybe if Steve sees this post he can also explain more.  Steve has been looking at some used Kitchen Aid mixers, but I donít know if he will get one or not. 

I am not sure either how far I am developing the gluten structure really at either places, but to me the dough feels strong when trying to be stretched right out of both mixers.  I guess what I am trying to explain is the dough feels something like when trying to feel is the dough is windowpaning if that makes any sense to you.  It can be seen in some of my photos of how the dough balls look after being formed after I divide and scale.  I guess I could mix longer to see what happens.  I also did work on some higher hydration doughs before like in the Pizzarium thread and I know what it takes to get that kind of higher hydration dough stronger.  My way for that is using the stretch and fold methods.
It sounds to me that you are doing a good job with the kneading of your Buddy's clone doughs. Because of the relatively high hydration of such doughs, I also think that it is important to get sufficient gluten development, even to the point of being able to pass the windowpane test. If using the paddle or flat beater attachment helps that process along, then I would continue to use it. I do that myself for just about all doughs, for pretty much all hydration values, before switching to the dough hook on my home KitchenAid stand mixer. However, the flat beater attachment does a better job with higher hydration doughs than lower hydration doughs. I have no good explanation for why Steve doesn't get results similar to yours. Maybe he can elaborate further on his methods.

This isnít related to the Buddyís clone pizzas and donít want to get too far off topic like I can, but find when trying to quote what someone said and erasing some things I donít want to quote the screen wants to jump too much to get rid of that stuff I donít want in my quote if lots of things need erased.  Do you have the same problems?  I see you can easily just put different quotes and then answer right under them, which I can't easily do.
I have not experienced the "jumping" problem you mentioned. My practice is to compose replies on the forum in real time (unless I am doing something really involved or complicated, in which case I compose in Word). I have learned just to use the proper quote commands where necessary to tie my responses to the particular material quoted. Everything else gets deleted. That way, I am not quoting entire posts, which takes up more space.

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1127 on: January 10, 2013, 09:36:06 AM »
Norma,
It sounds to me that you are doing a good job with the kneading of your Buddy's clone doughs. Because of the relatively high hydration of such doughs, I also think that it is important to get sufficient gluten development, even to the point of being able to pass the windowpane test. If using the paddle or flat beater attachment helps that process along, then I would continue to use it. I do that myself for just about all doughs, for pretty much all hydration values, before switching to the dough hook on my home KitchenAid stand mixer. However, the flat beater attachment does a better job with higher hydration doughs than lower hydration doughs. I have no good explanation for why Steve doesn't get results similar to yours. Maybe he can elaborate further on his methods.

Peter,

Good to hear that you think I am doing a good job of kneading the Buddyís clone doughs.  I might still need more improvements in mixing, but have been satisfied with most of my crumbs if the tempering is right and I donĎt have sags from when the sauce is applied. 

It is also good that you think there needs to be sufficient gluten development, even to the point of being able to pass the windowpane test.  Interesting that you also use the paddle or flat beater for about all of your doughs, before switching to the dough hook on your home Kitchen Aid stand mixer.

I will ask Steve to post about the differences in our crumbs since you have no explanation as why Steve doesnít get the same results as I do.  If I have a leftover Buddyís clone dough ball next week I am going to give Steve one to try in his home oven to see if it is really my mixing methods or something different that we get different results in the crumb.



I have not experienced the "jumping" problem you mentioned. My practice is to compose replies on the forum in real time (unless I am doing something really involved or complicated, in which case I compose in Word). I have learned just to use the proper quote commands where necessary to tie my responses to the particular material quoted. Everything else gets deleted. That way, I am not quoting entire posts, which takes up more space.

Peter

Thanks for your comments about you have not experienced the jumping problem I mentioned.  Even if I try to compose posts in real time and if they are a little longer, there is the jumping problem for me.  I think other members have posted about that before and if I recall right even Craig mentioned that.  The box where I type keeps jumping all over the place.  Maybe Steve the administrator also has an answer for that.  I can quote, but when trying to delete parts of a post that is when I have that darn jumping problem too.  I will have to work on not using up too much space.  If my posts are long, I then use my word processor.  Maybe sometime I might start a new thread on the jumping problem if I donít get it figured out.  I canít just cut out part of your posts.  I needed to start where I wanted to delete part of it and then hold my finger on the backspace button and then keep hitting it until I have all delete that I wanted to delete.  The typing screen then starting jumping again sometimes.  That can get frustrating for me.

Norma
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Offline Ev

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1128 on: January 10, 2013, 10:16:47 AM »
Actually, I've never used my mixer for the DS dough. I'm not sure the design of the Bosch is suitable for a small amount of high hydration dough.  Of course there's no harm in trying the mixer just to see. I've just mixed by hand along with a couple S&F. I wonder if this method and a higher gluten flour would yield a more similar result to Normas'?

Offline Skee

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1129 on: January 10, 2013, 12:14:45 PM »
I've just mixed by hand along with a couple S&F. I wonder if this method and a higher gluten flour would yield a more similar result to Normas'?
I'm using KASL with 70% hydration and 0.5% IDY with a quick mix with a paddle, five minute rest, then 2-3 minutes on speed 1 (in a Kitchen Aide).  The dough is sticky and rough at this point.  I just leave it in the bowl as-is and give it an hour at room temp followed by a couple of gentle kneads, weighing (350g for an 8x10), and balling.  The dough is now silky smooth and can form a tight ball.  After 24 hours of cold-proofing, I stretch the cold dough out to just fit the pan and let it warm to room temp, stretch a little more if it needs it, and then proof in a 100F oven for about an hour.  Baked at 475F for 16-18 minutes depending on toppings.  Here are some pics of the latest results:

Edit - corrected the IDy from 2% to 0.5% (was working from memory, the amount of IDY is ~2g).
  
« Last Edit: January 14, 2013, 11:14:31 AM by Skee »


Offline Ev

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1130 on: January 10, 2013, 12:21:59 PM »
Thanks Britt. I have some KASL but no KA mixer. I may try a hand mix with the KASL though.

 Good looking pie there, btw. The bottom looks nice and crispy.

Offline Skee

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1131 on: January 10, 2013, 12:28:20 PM »
Thanks Britt. I have some KASL but no KA mixer. I may try a hand mix with the KASL though.
 Good looking pie there, btw. The bottom looks nice and crispy.
I don't see why hand-mixing wouldn't work - basically doing that with the mixer.  The bottom and sides were just about perfect - once the pans are correctly seasoned, right at the end of baking the sides will pull off the wall just a little (like a cake) which keeps the cheese crust from burning while the bottom finishes. 

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1132 on: January 10, 2013, 03:43:47 PM »
Skee,
The killer bottom of your crust reminds me of a PH pan when they used to not be too bad. I'm wondering if it eats like that....sort of a nice slightly oily airy crispyness to it. Yum!  :)
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Offline Skee

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1133 on: January 10, 2013, 04:15:28 PM »
Yes, it's crispy, just slightly oily, and so soft and pillowy inside that you have to fight hard to not inhale the entire piece in one bite. 

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1134 on: January 10, 2013, 04:23:33 PM »
Yes, it's crispy, just slightly oily, and so soft and pillowy inside that you have to fight hard to not inhale the entire piece in one bite.  
Oh boy! That sounds real nice...would you say that is a traditional DS crust and have you ever done a same day dough with this? Thanks.
Bob
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Offline Skee

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1135 on: January 10, 2013, 05:14:12 PM »
I've never had a real DS pizza so can't directly compare with what I'm making, unfortunately.  We have relatives in Chicago, might have to tag along next time my wife makes a trip up there and take a side trip to Detroit just for sampling.

I've made a LOT of DS pizza in the last couple of months (at least four 4-slice pans a week, sometimes six) and have found two ways that work well for me with the dough - either dropping it into the pans after a short bulk rise (no balling) and then allowing it to spread and proof inside the pan for a couple hours at room temp, giving it a final stretch, then proofing in a warm oven before dressing (this is what I would do if I was making it commercially, think it's close to what Buddy's is doing from the pictures and what I've read), or giving it a 24-hr cold ferment, balled, and then proofing, stretching, and proofing warm.  I think I prefer the cold-fermented crust a little over the other, it's a bit more tender, but unless they were tasted side-by-side I don't think I would notice.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1136 on: January 10, 2013, 06:02:17 PM »
I've never had a real DS pizza so can't directly compare with what I'm making, unfortunately.  We have relatives in Chicago, might have to tag along next time my wife makes a trip up there and take a side trip to Detroit just for sampling.

I've made a LOT of DS pizza in the last couple of months (at least four 4-slice pans a week, sometimes six) and have found two ways that work well for me with the dough - either dropping it into the pans after a short bulk rise (no balling) and then allowing it to spread and proof inside the pan for a couple hours at room temp, giving it a final stretch, then proofing in a warm oven before dressing (this is what I would do if I was making it commercially, think it's close to what Buddy's is doing from the pictures and what I've read), or giving it a 24-hr cold ferment, balled, and then proofing, stretching, and proofing warm.  I think I prefer the cold-fermented crust a little over the other, it's a bit more tender, but unless they were tasted side-by-side I don't think I would notice.
Thanks Skee, your same day technique sounds very familiar.... ;)
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Offline norma427

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1137 on: January 10, 2013, 06:51:33 PM »
I'm using KASL with 70% hydration and 2% IDY with a quick mix with a paddle, five minute rest, then 2-3 minutes on speed 1 (in a Kitchen Aide).  The dough is sticky and rough at this point.  I just leave it in the bowl as-is and give it an hour at room temp followed by a couple of gentle kneads, weighing (350g for an 8x10), and balling.  The dough is now silky smooth and can form a tight ball.  After 24 hours of cold-proofing, I stretch the cold dough out to just fit the pan and let it warm to room temp, stretch a little more if it needs it, and then proof in a 100F oven for about an hour.  Baked at 475F for 16-18 minutes depending on toppings.  Here are some pics of the latest results:

 

Skee,

Your Detroit style pizza looks very tasty.  :) 

What kind of cheese or cheeses are you using?  I also would like to know how you decided to use 350 grams of dough for a 4-square.

Norma 
Always working and looking for new information!

Offline Skee

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1138 on: January 11, 2013, 11:17:19 AM »
Norma,

Thanks for the compliment!

I'm using Boar's Head NY White Cheddar for the edges, 2oz per pan (shredded), and a 60:40 mix of whole milk:part skim mozzarella (both Boar's Head brand), 4 oz per pan (shredded), plus 1oz of the cheddar for the rest of the pan, for a total of 7oz cheese per 8x10.  

The 350g per pan comes from taster's preference.  I started with that amount because that's the weight I use for a 16" NY and everyone liked it.  I tried backing down to 320g with the same sauce and cheese load and most people preferred the 350g going head-to-head with the 320.  So I've settled on 350g.

Cheers,
Britt
« Last Edit: January 11, 2013, 11:22:48 AM by Skee »

Offline Skee

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Re: Two Billís pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great!
« Reply #1139 on: January 11, 2013, 02:59:58 PM »
Norma,

What's the latest on the brick cheeses you've been sampling?  Can you narrow it down to perhaps two choices, one sharp and one mild?  I do have access to a commercial account and I would like to purchase some brick, but don't want to get anything except the best!

Thanks,
Britt


 

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