Author Topic: Two Bill’s pizza..dough and Carmelina Sauce..great! (Read 51952 times)

redox · « **Reply #1560 on:** February 21, 2013, 02:46:33 PM »

TXCraig1:

The VP was the first pizza I tried using a dough formula from this site and it worked just as he said it would. Yeah, it was about 3 hours, it took the second knockdown to get the dough into the corners of the pan. The next time I do this I should make two dough balls so I can experiment a bit. I was very impressed by your pizza oven setup, your pizzas look beautiful. I gotta go make some dough, thanks for your help.

redox · « **Reply #1561 on:** February 21, 2013, 02:48:56 PM »

Chicago Bob
I'd like to give Chicago thin crust a shot soon, maybe I could ask you some q's then?

TXCraig1 · « **Reply #1562 on:** February 21, 2013, 02:49:51 PM »

Please post about the pizza and give some crumb shots. I'm very interested in non-refrigerated fermentation times, so I'm curious to hear your formula and fermentation times and temperature and see how it comes out.

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #1563 on:** February 21, 2013, 03:01:05 PM »

Quote from: redox on February 21, 2013, 01:37:40 PM

I almost forgot, what is Carmelina Sauce?

redox....
ps, glad to help anytime over on my Chi thin pics thread.

norma427 · « **Reply #1564 on:** February 21, 2013, 03:18:52 PM »

Quote from: redox on February 21, 2013, 01:37:40 PM

I'm thinking of trying one of these pizzas tonight, is there any way I can have one ready for dinner, or is it a next day kind of dough? I stopped at a local Italian deli and got all sorts of stuff I'd like to try on it, like Mortadella. They had Margherita Pepperoni for $3.99/lb. I couldn't resist, I got 4 pounds, it's my current favorite. If I can't have one ready for tonight, I'll make one for tomorrow.
I almost forgot, what is Carmelina Sauce?

Jay,

I think the best advice I could give you if you want to try a emergency Detroit dough pizza is to use the expanded dough calculation tool and put 9.5 oz. for the weight of a dough ball for a 8“x10“ steel pan or 19 oz. for a bigger steel pan. Maybe use 0.1218 as the TF if you don’t want to use a dough weight for a dough ball, then add a bowl residue compensation (I use 2.0%), use 0.80 IDY and either 71.023% water like I was using, or if you prefer 75% hydration like I am doing now. I am now using 1.75% Kosher salt in my formulation, but you could change that to regular salt if you want. KAAP flour should work okay. What kind of flours do you have to work with? Maybe you should try to use warmer water (but not to hot as to harm the yeast) and try to get a higher final dough temperature. I mix the salt in with the water and the IDY in with the flour, but you can try to mix any way you want. Form a dough ball and press it out. Cover the pan so the dough doesn't dry out. I don’t put in any oil in my Buddy’s clone dough because Buddy’s doesn’t either. Turn you oven light on and wait until the dough has tempered enough and then add your dressings and bake. If you made a Victory Pig pizza you shouldn’t have any problems trying to make a Buddy’s clone. I don’t think you have to worry about Carmelina Sauce, but can use whatever sauce you like. The Carmelina Sauce was posted about in my first post.

I could find you the link to where I made a pizza as an emergency dough at home, but I think you will be okay without it. If the link really is needed I will find it. Any other questions just ask.

Norma

gschwim · « **Reply #1565 on:** February 21, 2013, 03:29:56 PM »

Quote from: Chicago Bob on February 21, 2013, 03:01:05 PM

redox....
ps, glad to help anytime over on my Chi thin pics thread.

For anyone who's interested in flavor and saving money, too, one of the cooking magazines (America's Test Kitchen?) did a comparison test of canned whole and diced tomatoes. They rated Hunt's number one. Got some at the local market the other day, on special, for 99 cents/can and they're excellent. They have both with and without basil.

Here's a link to someone named Kate (http://cookaholics.org/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1033&start=30) agreeing with me that (a) San Marzano tomatoes are overrated and (b) Hunt's is better.

Try some and see if you don't agree with Kate and me. Since trying them myself, I only use Hunt's for all my recipes, not just pizza. I watch the local supermarkets for specials and pick up a few cans of both whole and crushed tomatoes whenever they're available.

Gene

redox · « **Reply #1566 on:** February 21, 2013, 04:03:59 PM »

Quote from: TXCraig1 on February 21, 2013, 02:49:51 PM

Please post about the pizza and give some crumb shots. I'm very interested in non-refrigerated fermentation times, so I'm curious to hear your formula and fermentation times and temperature and see how it comes out.

I'd be happy to. I'll have to hold off my wife with one hand while I snap pix, she really likes this style. It's new to both of us.

redox · « **Reply #1567 on:** February 21, 2013, 04:14:24 PM »

Quote from: Chicago Bob on February 21, 2013, 03:01:05 PM

redox....
ps, glad to help anytime over on my Chi thin pics thread.

Thanks for the offer, Bob. I want to make a few more Detroit style pizzas and then try a Chicago thin crust, I've only had Chicago DD so that will be something new for me. Next time I buy a pizza from my favorite local dive that's been family owned since the '50's I'd like to post some pics somewhere. They've got a unique crust, at least for this town but I can't believe that it's unique for the whole country. It's a thin, milti-layered crust, almost pastry like. Perhaps someone will have an idea how it's made.

redox · « **Reply #1568 on:** February 21, 2013, 04:19:24 PM »

Norma, thanks for the advice and I definitely will try that next time. I was running out of time to get it started in time for dinner so I went with the steel_baker's Victory Pig dough. I've made it before so I figured that it would be the quickest to make. Once again, I really appreciate your detailed reply and will add it to my recipe database to use the next time.

norma427 · « **Reply #1569 on:** February 21, 2013, 04:23:39 PM »

Shawn Randazzo of Detroit Style Pizza Co. says in this interview that he plans a third location for the Detroit Style Pizza Co. in the spring and also planning on a program that will assist in training, support/consulting/certification programs for anyone that is interested in learning to make Detroit style pizzas. More can be read at near the bottom of this article if interested. http://www.revention.com/customers/interviews/Shawn-Randazzo

Norma

redox · « **Reply #1570 on:** February 21, 2013, 08:17:57 PM »

I just realized that my pizza morphed into something that may not belong in this thread and if someone wants it moved then please ask a moderator to do that. I didn't intend it to not be Two Bill's Pizza when I started. I'm just posting this info here so those who might have q's can find it.
In fact, if you know where this should go, let me know and I'll ask to have it moved.

5.66 ounces King Arthur Bread Flour (100%)
3.79 ounces Bottled Water (66.99%)
0.11 ounces IDY (1.96%)
0.11 ounces Morton’s Kosher Salt (1.96%)
0.06 ounces Olive Oil (0.98%)
0.11 ounces Sugar (1.96%)
9.84 Total (173.84%)

Kitchen temperature 66 °F
Bottled water 51.6 °F

Mixed the dough until it came together in a ball, then covered it for 15 minutes.
Kneaded with the “C” dough hook on Kitchen Aid for 8 minutes.
Dough temperature was 69 °F.
Weight of dough ball was 9.8 ounces.

It’s chilly outside today (25 °F) and the kitchen was 66 °F so I was concerned that the rise time might be longer than our appetites would like. So after about 45 minutes at kitchen temperature I turned on my electric oven for 15 seconds to warm it up to 82 °F and I put the panned dough inside. (I sprayed the pan with Pam for the Grill and dropped in 0.60 ounces of peanut oil before putting in the dough.)
At the 2 hour mark (including the original 45 minutes) I knocked down the dough and put it back into the oven for another hour.
At the end of the third hour I topped the dough with a 50/50 mix of Mozzarella and Vt. White Chedar. Placed 20 pepperoni slices over the cheese. Tore up some Mortadella and placed it along with some Hickory Smoked Pulled Pork from Costco. And some mushrooms.
I put one line of sauce on top before baking and the second line after the pizza was done to compare the two ways of doing it.
I think I pressed the dough too hard against the sides of the pan because I didn’t get very much browning of the White Cheddar on the side of the pizza.
Nonetheless, I think it’s the best pizza I’ve ever done. It was terrific.

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #1571 on:** February 21, 2013, 08:26:45 PM »

Quote from: redox on February 21, 2013, 08:17:57 PM

In fact, if you know where this should go, let me know and I'll ask to have it moved.

It belongs at my house, wrap it up an send right away....Wow!!

Pete-zza · « **Reply #1572 on:** February 21, 2013, 08:29:50 PM »

Jay,

You did a terrific job. You have provided yet more evidence of the appeal of the Detroit style pizza.

Since your dough formulation was not out in left field for a Detroit style pizza, I think we can leave your post in this thread. However, if you plan to make more of such pizzas, you may want to start a new thread so that your work isn't buried in the middle of this thread. It deserves its own place in the sun.

Did you detect much of a difference between the two stripes of sauce?

Peter

norma427 · « **Reply #1573 on:** February 21, 2013, 08:36:46 PM »

Jay,

I agree that your Detroit style pizza looks stunning!

I agree with Peter that if you decide to use the same dough formulation you used you deserve to have you own thread. I love all those dressings you added. Congrats!

Norma

redox · « **Reply #1574 on:** February 21, 2013, 08:43:58 PM »

Quote from: Pete-zza on February 21, 2013, 08:29:50 PM

Jay,

You did a terrific job. You have provided yet more evidence of the appeal of the Detroit style pizza.

Since your dough formulation was not out in left field for a Detroit style pizza, I think we can leave your post in this thread. However, if you plan to make more of such pizzas, you may want to start a new thread so that your work isn't buried in the middle of this thread. It deserves its own place in the sun.

Did you detect much of a difference between the two stripes of sauce?

Peter

The baked stripe had a stronger, sharper tomato taste. Some of the water cooked off in the oven so that seems right. The stripe added post baking had a brighter, fresher taste.
I liked them both and I may continue to do it this way. Each of us got a slice of both and my wife liked them both, also.

redox · « **Reply #1575 on:** February 21, 2013, 08:48:34 PM »

Peter and Norma
Thanks for the kind words. In truth, it is only because this site is such a great resource that I was able to make such a tasty pizza on my second attempt.

norma427 · « **Reply #1576 on:** February 21, 2013, 09:04:41 PM »

Quote from: redox on February 21, 2013, 08:48:34 PM

Thanks for the kind words. In truth, it is only because this site is such a great resource that I was able to make such a tasty pizza on my second attempt.

Jay,

I think you are a fast learner when it comes to making pizza. If you stay on this forum long enough you should be able to make any kind of pizza you want.

This forum and the great members sure have helped me. If you would have seen my first pizzas you would laugh. I wasn’t a fast learner in the beginning.

Norma

TXCraig1 · « **Reply #1577 on:** February 21, 2013, 11:38:26 PM »

Very nice Jay!

norma427 · « **Reply #1578 on:** February 22, 2013, 08:24:46 AM »

Zagat gave Via 313 one of the 10 Pizza Hot Spots in Austin. http://blog.zagat.com/2013/02/10-pizza-hot-spots-in-austin.html

Qarl · « **Reply #1579 on:** February 22, 2013, 09:16:05 PM »

Norma,

What temperatures/times for baking have you been most successful with for your formulation(s)? Are you using a regular oven or a deck oven? Gas or electric?

I have a regular oven at home and can only get up to 500 degrees. I'm thinking middle rack 500 degrees? 15-20 minutes?

Would a Sicilian-style such as yours benefit from a pizza stone pre-heated in the oven and the pizza pan set on top? Or would it be better to have the heat circulating all around while it's on a rack?

Thx!