Author Topic: Alcohol in sauce  (Read 4539 times)

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Offline ere514

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Alcohol in sauce
« on: October 26, 2012, 02:20:22 PM »
Tomatoes carry alcohol soluble flavor compounds and I'm curious if anyone has experimented with adding alcohol (vodka or other neutral spirit) to their sauce.


Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2012, 02:22:39 PM »
Tomatoes carry alcohol soluble flavor compounds and I'm curious if anyone has experimented with adding alcohol (vodka or other neutral spirit) to their sauce.

And at NP cooking temps, or even NY style temps, the vodka or neutral spirits would evaporate; no?
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends

Offline ere514

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2012, 02:26:04 PM »
Alcohol evaporates ~186 deg so I don't think it would reach that temp for long enough time to completely evaporate but I'm thinking a tablespoon or 2 in a quart of suace.

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2012, 02:27:27 PM »
Alcohol evaporates ~186 deg so I don't think it would reach that temp for long enough time to completely evaporate but I'm thinking a tablespoon or 2 in a quart of suace.

Would you ever be able to taste it at that low of a concentration?
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends

Offline ere514

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2012, 02:30:50 PM »
The alcohol is not in there for the taste so much as alcohol will release flavor compounds not soluble in water.

Offline ere514

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2012, 02:33:42 PM »
The alcohol is not in there for the taste so much as alcohol will release flavor compounds not soluble in water.

*Flavor compounds in the tomatoes.

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2012, 02:35:19 PM »
Sure, try it.

I have attached a chart which (I am sure) is completely useless.  Even though it is "published" by the USDA, I have a 100% confidence that it doesn't make a rats arse.

http://homecooking.about.com/library/archive/blalcohol12.htm
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Offline Don K

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2012, 02:37:13 PM »
I have added wine to sauce before but never spirits.
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Offline ere514

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2012, 02:44:49 PM »
Sure, try it.

I have attached a chart which (I am sure) is completely useless.  Even though it is "published" by the USDA, I have a 100% confidence that it doesn't make a rats arse.

http://homecooking.about.com/library/archive/blalcohol12.htm

I was hoping someone with a more sophisticated palate than mine may tried this.  I will give it a shot this weekend.


Offline ere514

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2012, 02:48:07 PM »
I have added wine to sauce before but never spirits.

I have tried wine but my thinking is vodka (or other neutral spirit) may enhance tomato flavor rather than add complementary flavor.

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2012, 02:51:39 PM »
I was hoping someone with a more sophisticated palate than mine may tried this.  I will give it a shot this weekend.

Seriously I would have doubts that any flavor in a tomato would not be soluble in water.  Except for the seeds, people are always whining that they are bitter anyway.  Let us know what you find.
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Offline Don K

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2012, 02:59:16 PM »
I'm wondering if using alcohol as a solvent may extract some flavors that are undesirable along with the ones that you do want. Can't hurt to try though.

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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2012, 03:21:15 PM »
I have tried wine but my thinking is vodka (or other neutral spirit) may enhance tomato flavor rather than add complementary flavor.

Vodka enhances the tomato flavor in my bloody mary.  ;D  For that matter, who would drink tomato juice without vodka?
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
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Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2012, 11:09:58 PM »
Vodka enhances the tomato flavor in my bloody mary.  ;D  For that matter, who would drink tomato juice without vodka?

Lest we forget our friend Clamato?
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enter8

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2012, 11:13:15 PM »
It might enhance flavour...MAYbe but taste? doubtful.

Offline Zing

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2012, 04:43:54 AM »
We put 3 tablespoons of red wine into 16 ounces by weight of Stanislaus pizza sauce for our Shakey's experimental pizza sauce clone. While there is some dispute if Shakey's puts wine flavor in their factory-produced sauce, this sauce is terrific.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2012, 09:02:00 AM »
I've been thinking about putting some red wine in my Tommy's sauce after a newer member planted the idea in my head (in the Tommy's thread in the cracker section). I'd never thought about anything like that before he mentioned it, but ever since he mentioned it I've really felt like it may be the right thing to do.

I'm actually gonna eat at Tommy's in a couple hours with Nick (weemis). It'll be my first time eating at Tommy's since early this year. Nick has never eaten there, so hopefully he'll make some valuable observations that can better help me clone their pizza (which I've already done pretty well).
Ryan
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Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.


Offline fresnosmooth

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #17 on: December 07, 2012, 05:29:06 PM »
I'll give vodka a try tonight and see if I pass out or if it makes the pizza taste different j/k - (I've got an extra dough ball ready to go and sauce made up in the fridge one "normal" size can of sauce two "small" cans paste, chopped fresh basil, pinch onion salt, pinch garlic salt, pepper, chipotle spice and soon splash of vodka).

My wife makes a Vodka pasta and that sauce would be AWESOME on a pizza with lighter flavor toppings like chicken and veggies.
Didn't think about trying it with pizza till now, I'll get back with some results.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2012, 07:28:30 PM »
My wife makes a Vodka pasta and that sauce would be AWESOME on a pizza with lighter flavor toppings like chicken and veggies.
Didn't think about trying it with pizza till now, I'll get back with some results.

Vodka sauce is not uncommon on pizza in NY. Frank at Vesta in NJ (a member here) makes an incredible pizza with vodka sauce and blackened shrimp. http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg176760.html#msg176760
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Offline fresnosmooth

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #19 on: December 12, 2012, 01:40:15 PM »
I wrote a whole big thing on here and error'd out so here's the short version - Vodka made my sauce taste better
Can of Italian herb tomato sauce 2 cans Italian herb tomato paste - fresh basil chopped - pinch garlic powder, pinch onion powder, half a spoon chipotle powder (set in fridge overnight)
Pull cup and a half of sauce aside - pour 2 shots - one for the cook, one for the sauce.

Cooked one pizza with and one without
(Vodka)
It was subtle, but "cleaner" tasting.  In addition the flavor was somewhat sweet and complex like Basil but not so liquorice (that one indescribable flavor of basil).

PS - Thanks Craig, I'll give it a try - and that pig quote is hilarious

Offline fresnosmooth

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2012, 01:53:46 PM »
This was also an experiment in old dough.  I made that dough more than a week ago and it set in the fridge the whole time.  It's not my favorite recipe, only a remnant of an old "pate fermente" (pre-ferment style).  Pulled it out, let it come to room temperature, gave it a quick 4 corner fold, balled it - let it set 30 min, half size shape - rest 30 min, and finial shape and on the hot stone (no rest).
The smell and flavor HOLY SMOKES - it smelled half like I was baking bread, half like I was steaming beer and the flavor was like butter and oakwood (not the real flavor of wood the visual image of the soft tones and complexity of wood - you get my point) nothing like what it's brothers tasted the week before.

Make too much of everything, experiment and have fun - my "secret recipes" are all experiments or accidents.



Offline PizzaJerk

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Re: Alcohol in sauce
« Reply #21 on: December 18, 2012, 12:56:58 PM »
I would suggest adding anchovy to the sauce. One may think that the result will be a bit fishy but it is not the case provided you don't put the whole can in. Anchovy, parmesan, tomato paste (or crushed tomato reduced enough to form a fond) all contain natural glutamates very similar to that of the more commonly known MSG. It will not only compliment tomato flavor but also heighten it as well.

I usually saute garlic, olive oil, anchovy and a little salt and pepper (at the lowest temp possible to get action going as not to change the characteristics of the oil) then add a few decent spoonfulls of crushed tomato and reduce to a fond. Add some red wine to deglaze, add the rest of your tomatoes and season to your liking with whatever you wish and your good to go.

Main objective was to give you a few hints as to heightening your tomato flavor and all around flavor, not a full on recipe. I hope you give it a try and that it works out well for you.
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