Author Topic: Roberto again- yeast question  (Read 1145 times)

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Offline roberto2

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Roberto again- yeast question
« on: October 29, 2012, 08:55:30 AM »
I normally use ADY measured out as needed for small dough batches.

This is a 2 part question actually:

First- When making large batches of dough, do you use the same amount of yeast. In other words, if a small batch requires 2 1/4 teaspoons of ADY would I assume that I would multiply the amounts as needed? So for example, triple the amount of flour would require triple amount of yeast.

Second- I remember my parents using a 'brick' of fresh yeast. I have seen it in bakery supply stores. How would you measure that compared to ADY, and do you prefer one over the other?


Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Roberto again- yeast question
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2012, 09:18:31 AM »
Yes, you can scale your formula linearly. You will not need to worry about changing your percentage of yeast if you are not changing anything except the scale. Perhaps you are making massive changes (e.g. going from 1kg flour to 25kg flour) you might need to make an adjustment, however going up by 3X won't change anything.

Here is a table with conversions for ADY, IDY, and fresh (cake) yeast: http://www.theartisan.net/convert_yeast_two.htm
Pizza is not bread.

Offline roberto2

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Re: Roberto again- yeast question
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2012, 09:38:18 AM »
Thanks Craig, appreciate it!

How's weather in Houston? We're 2 miles from Point Pleasant Beach, NJ and it's getting nasty. No outdoor baking today!
« Last Edit: October 29, 2012, 09:40:19 AM by roberto2 »

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Roberto again- yeast question
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2012, 09:57:04 AM »
Thanks Craig, appreciate it!

How's weather in Houston? We're 2 miles from Point Pleasant Beach, NJ and it's getting nasty. No outdoor baking today!

Sunny and 70.

Be safe.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Roberto again- yeast question
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2012, 11:07:00 AM »
I've had results that suggest merely doubling a small batch makes a noticeable difference, but I've only ever noticed it with NY style dough that was refrigerated for two days; probably because that may be the only kind of dough for which I've ever had a reason to make a double size batch.

Here are the specifics of my experience with this issue: My regular batch size is based on 1 lb of flour, with around 60% hydration, but occasionally I've made batches based on 2 lbs of flour, using the same formula as my normal dough. (As far as I recall, I've mostly only ever done this in preparation for making a bunch of pizzas for parties or large gatherings.) It may be important to note that I tend to make pizza on a very regular basis, usually without making any big formula changes from one dough batch to the next, which means I know what to expect from my dough.

Anyway, whenever I've made these larger-than-normal batches of dough, the dough has always risen faster than I anticipated. In fact, after experiencing this a number of times, it finally puzzled me enough to mention it somewhere on these boards. And when I did, Peter (Pete-zza) responded by directing me to a web page that discusses the mass effect. This web page described exactly what I was experiencing.

I don't mean to confuse you or contradict what Craig said; I just wanted to share my experience with you because it really puzzled me every time this happened (which was every time I've doubled my dough batch). However, for all I know, it was all in my head, even though I'm pretty sure it was real. Also, it didn't make a huge difference. Still, after a couple days of cold fermentation it was a big enough difference to make me worry that I might have to serve less than ideal pizzas to guests.

Don't freak out about it, though. Like I said, it was a pretty small difference, which wasn't very noticeable until after a couple days of cold fermentation. Also, since I had no clue why it was happening, that alone probably magnified the intensity in my mind. Since you at least know such a phenomenon exists, it shouldn't catch you by surprise or make you geek out like I may have.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Roberto again- yeast question
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2012, 12:09:46 PM »
It wouldn't surprise me if you got a little more rise if you are leaving it in bulk as is it would take longer for the mass too cool when you put it in the refrigerator. Notwithstanding, and you noted, the difference with small increases 2-3X aren't particularly meaningful. If you go straight to balls, I would not expect any difference.

Fermentation creates some heat, so if you make a very large mass of dough and let it ferment, the accumulated heat can speed fermentation. There can be other effect as well. For example, it takes longer to ball more dough, as a result, it may sit out at a higher temperature for a longer time as you ball it.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Roberto again- yeast question
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2012, 01:02:43 PM »
It wouldn't surprise me if you got a little more rise if you are leaving it in bulk as is it would take longer for the mass too cool when you put it in the refrigerator. Notwithstanding, and you noted, the difference with small increases 2-3X aren't particularly meaningful. If you go straight to balls, I would not expect any difference.

Fermentation creates some heat, so if you make a very large mass of dough and let it ferment, the accumulated heat can speed fermentation. There can be other effect as well. For example, it takes longer to ball more dough, as a result, it may sit out at a higher temperature for a longer time as you ball it.

The only procedural difference between my normal dough batch and my double batch is the quantity of ingredients. That is, I do everything exactly the same, except I measure double the amount of every ingredient, which doesn't take any longer than measuring the normal amount of ingredients.

Also, I divide, scale, and refrigerate my NY style dough immediately after mixing, which means bulk fermentation cannot be responsible for making the dough rise faster.

Yes, doubling the batch size probably does generate a little more heat than usual, which may cause the dough to begin fermenting a little faster than normal. And if that is in fact what causes my larger batches to rise faster, it does not diminish what I reported in my previous post. If anything, it validates what I said. Because if Roberto doubles his batch size, the same thing will happen with his dough. And he might want to know that, rather than having it dismissed as if it doesn't happen.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Roberto again- yeast question
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2012, 01:23:07 PM »
The only procedural difference between my normal dough batch and my double batch is the quantity of ingredients. That is, I do everything Because if Roberto doubles his batch size, the same thing will happen with his dough.

Maybe - maybe not. My guess is still the latter.

Pizza is not bread.

Offline roberto2

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Re: Roberto again- yeast question
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2012, 08:49:01 AM »
Finally back to some normal behavior here at the central Jersey shore. Lots of devastation  :(

Will be back on here more as time allows, thanks for the info!

Roberto