Author Topic: Super long fermentation  (Read 5122 times)

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Offline bakeshack

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #25 on: November 01, 2012, 03:16:30 PM »
IMHO, if it was due to the fire in the oven or bad manipulation inside while baking, one would get occasional burnt bubbles or char and not the almost uniform distribution of charred bubbles around the crust.


Online TXCraig1

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #26 on: November 01, 2012, 03:20:00 PM »
btw craig.... I think your awesome... sorry if it seems like im arguing w you.     

No worries. The respect is mutual.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #27 on: November 01, 2012, 04:15:33 PM »
From Yelp.
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends

Offline dellavecchia

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #28 on: November 01, 2012, 04:45:40 PM »
Two more from Yelp (one is the same Gene posted, different angle):

John

Offline dellavecchia

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #29 on: November 01, 2012, 05:07:51 PM »
I guess I caused quite the stir over at Slice with my question in this thread. I can't believe how crass Adam and Kenji were with their language and comments - especially given the very thoughtful responses people made here. I may never contribute to Slice again:

http://slice.seriouseats.com/archives/2012/10/first-look-brooklyn-central-park-slope.html#comments

John
« Last Edit: November 01, 2012, 07:53:19 PM by dellavecchia »

Offline Mangia Pizza

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #30 on: November 01, 2012, 06:10:39 PM »
I guess I caused quite the stir over at Slice with my question in this thread. I can't believe how crass Adam and Kenji were were their language and comments - especially given the very thoughtful responses people made here. I may never contribute to Slice again:

http://slice.seriouseats.com/archives/2012/10/first-look-brooklyn-central-park-slope.html#comments

John

John, don't let them get to you....

truth is that no matter what the reason is, Stefano Ferrara wouldn't be too proud to see pizzas coming out of one of his ovens look like those....
Paolo

Offline widespreadpizza

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #31 on: November 01, 2012, 07:50:39 PM »
IMO  something is going on with WHEN these crusts are divided.  over-fermented before final balling is what I see.  Too much air in the dough creates these huge pockets that blow up when they hit the oven.  -marc

Offline johnnydoubleu

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #32 on: November 01, 2012, 09:50:48 PM »
Think you are on to something there @WSP.

Online TXCraig1

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #33 on: November 01, 2012, 09:53:55 PM »
IMO  something is going on with WHEN these crusts are divided.  over-fermented before final balling is what I see.  Too much air in the dough creates these huge pockets that blow up when they hit the oven.  -marc

I completely agree. This is one of the reasons why I have stressed many times that there should be almost zero signs of fermentation when you go from bulk to ball.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
Craig's Neapolitan Garage


Phar Lap

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #34 on: November 01, 2012, 10:07:53 PM »
Craig,

Great PM-defending response on Slice!

Offline Tscarborough

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #35 on: November 01, 2012, 10:20:46 PM »
I dug some of Gene's spilled dough out of the trash and have it hydrating to use as a starter.  How often should I feed it?

Online TXCraig1

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #36 on: November 01, 2012, 10:40:37 PM »
I dug some of Gene's spilled dough out of the trash and have it hydrating to use as a starter.  How often should I feed it?

Every two or three days or so should be fine. Once it is good and active, put it in the fridge and it can go for maybe 6 months without any feeding.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #37 on: November 01, 2012, 10:54:43 PM »
I can't believe how crass Adam and Kenji were with their language and comments - especially given the very thoughtful responses people made here.

Maybe something like don't bite the hand that feeds ya?

Thanks for your post, I rarely visit that site but that is very interesting.
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #38 on: November 01, 2012, 10:57:55 PM »
I dug some of Gene's spilled dough out of the trash and have it hydrating to use as a starter.  How often should I feed it?

Tom, it is going to get pretty "hoochey" before it gets good.  Just stay the course with feeding and dumping and feeding.  At my home, Craig's starter prefers a bit stiffer meal than 50/50 water flour.  Miss Ischca likes a 60/40 flour water meal here.
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends

Offline weemis

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #39 on: November 02, 2012, 12:18:34 PM »
The pizza in question looks to me like it missed the prime window of fermentation without crossing into too over-fermented. Usable, but not optimum. But it's a business, and with that comes times when they will both nail it and miss the mark. The nature of the beast. Consistency is probably the hardest part once you get it all figured out.

Nick Gore - just a dough eyed wanderer

Offline I Have Feet

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #40 on: November 02, 2012, 02:28:11 PM »
I just read through that whole exchange on Slice. It was amusing and I agree that Adam Kuban and Kenji's initial comments were really disrespectful. I discovered Slice before this forum and I continue to read both. While I love the "My Pie Mondays", "Top This" and "Daily Slice" columns for getting ideas for flavour combinations, when it comes to learning how to improve my pizza making skills I've gained exponentially more knowledge from this forum. Sure a small minority of posters can come across as rather zealotish in their preaching (one stands out in my mind...  ::) ) but in terms of the weath of information available here, Slice cannot hope to compare. Some of the advice Kenji gives in his Pizza Lap column is just downright bad. (Sugar in a NP dough???)

The Slice commenter "Godot" who brought all the attention to this thread seems to have a real hate on for this forum. I've seen many times where he pops on just to ridicule and insult this community. Is there some back story to this? Is he some disgruntled former member who takes the Internet way too seriously?

Anyways, I want to say a big thank you to all the "experts" who I've learned from by reading your threads and following your advice and encouragement. Many of you are posting in this thread, and the vast majority have been friendly and encouraging.

Cheers,

Brendan

Offline The Dough Doctor

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Re: Super long fermentation
« Reply #41 on: November 02, 2012, 03:00:21 PM »
My own personal comments:
From the look of the picture (white colored crust with highly contrasting char, actually beyond char. My gut feel is that the dough may well have been over fermented to the point where the acidity formed as a result of fermentation is inhibiting the browning reaction, hence the only place where the crust can actually develop any color is at the site of the bubbles/blisters, where the surface of the crust gets exceptionally hot, while the remainder of the crust doesn't actually get hot enough within the allowed bake time to develop color (remember the acidity), hence the strong contrasting of colors. As for the bottom bake, I would guess that it might have been rather spotty and inconsistent.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor