Author Topic: I'm done with Kitchen Aid  (Read 14422 times)

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Offline Nathan

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I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« on: December 08, 2005, 06:27:40 AM »
A few months back I kind of "returned" my 6 quart KA 525 watt and got the newer Professional 600 575 watt.  It sort of worked ok at first.  It would at least get through one batch of dough using just under 1700 grams of flour @ 60% hydration.  Now it can't even do that.  It almost makes it but it's not acceptable.  I'd like to know where they came up with this "flour power 14 cups" claim.  What are they mixing cake batter? (http://tinyurl.com/8xayy) (http://tinyurl.com/73moo)

But anyway, I'm getting rid of this junk and getting a Hobart.  Unless I find something better for the money.  I plan on spending up to $900 if I have to.
"Pizza with pineapples?  That's a cake."


Offline PizzaBrewer

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2005, 08:19:28 AM »
My suggestion:  restaurant auctions.  I picked up this 10-qt. beauty for $700:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1832.0.html

It makes a huge difference compared to my KitchenAid.

I've been to about 2 dozen auctions, there's almost always a dough mixer (usually Hobart).  You may need to attend a few to get a feel for the prices in your area, but you should be able to pick up a 10 or 20 qt. mixer for your price.  Make sure it has the right electricity (110 volt, standard plug).  Also I've seen a wide variation in motor size on these mixers.  Everything from 1/6 hp. to 1/2 hp.  Obviously the bigger the better.  With a 1/2 hp motor on a 10-qt mixer you could mix concrete!

---Guy

P.S. If you're anywhere near NE/Central Pennsylvania, check out this auction next Tuesday (I'll be there!):

http://sitarauctions.com/12_13_2005_Metro/12_13_2005_Metro.html

« Last Edit: December 08, 2005, 08:38:08 AM by PizzaBrewer »
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Offline freshflour

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2005, 09:12:13 AM »
1700 grams of flour at 60% sure does sound like a lot for the Kitchen-Aid.  I'd be willing to bet the did mean cake batter, and not bread dough.  I do fine with 880 gram batches.  I may get that up to 1 kg, but I doubt it could do much more.

By the way, doesn't Hobart make the Kitchen-Aid?  Mine is an older model, and it has a Hobart logo on it as well.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2005, 10:13:23 AM »
freshflour,

Hobart used to make the KitchenAid stand mixers. It looks like they are now made by Whirpool: http://www.whirlpool.com/custserv/other_sites.jsp. Curiously, KitchenAid products are not prominently listed on the Whirlpool website as one of their brands. I had to do a site search on the Whirlpool website to glean that tidbit of information, which was buried under "other Whirlpool" brands.

Peter

Offline Nathan

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2005, 10:31:20 AM »
PizzaBrewer, it sounds like you got a good deal.  I wish they had more auctions like that around here (Northern Michigan).  Every once in a while they have some in Grand Rapids but it's 90 miles from me and I haven't been making it down there much lately.  But I'm still trying to find out if there's something around here or a little closer.

freshflour, I think Hobart did used to make Kitchenaid or something but I can't remember the details.

"Pizza with pineapples?  That's a cake."

Offline Randy

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Offline pietradoro

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2005, 05:42:39 PM »
Try this one.
http://cgi.ebay.com/RARE-1931-KitchenAid-Model-F-with-original-Manual_W0QQitemZ6231897204QQcategoryZ11653QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting

What a find!  8)

I wouldn't mind having that one on a shelf just to look at it.  I wonder if there are any pizza dough recipes in that manual  ;)

Offline KAidVerne

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2005, 12:58:02 PM »
Regarding the Flour Power rating on the KitchenAid, this refers to the amount of REGULAR, ALL-PURPOSE flour that the mixer can handle per the Use and Care guide's White Bread recipe.  It definitely does NOT account for high gluten flours, or other recipes with lower moisture content (like Pizza dough).

Offline Bubba Kuhn

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2005, 11:13:57 PM »
Regarding the Flour Power rating on the KitchenAid, this refers to the amount of REGULAR, ALL-PURPOSE flour that the mixer can handle per the Use and Care guide's White Bread recipe.  It definitely does NOT account for high gluten flours, or other recipes with lower moisture content (like Pizza dough).

Boy ain't that the truth.  as I recall from the old mixing recommendations from hobart when using high gluten dry dough recipes the overall flour volume should be reduced by 20 percent so you wont strip the gears. And by the by hobart licensed the kitchen aid line to some foreign manufacturer. There went the goodness that was hobart. If you want to you can join my web site and get a copy of the original New York style pizza dough recipe.  I show you the proper volumes and technique to make it in a kitchen aid and not kill the mixer.

In the for what it is worth all hobarts are not the same. Hobart knows how tough pizza dough is on a mixer and has modified a 60 quart "the most popular shop model for volume" for pizza dough by the 50 pound bag.
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Offline KAidVerne

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2005, 11:24:18 AM »
Bubba,

I can assure you that KitchenAid is NOT licensed out to a foreign manufacturer.  I should know, I work for KitchenAid.  They are owned by Whirlpool Corporation, and our mixers are STILL manufactured in Greenville, OH, as they have been since 1919.

Offline sebdesn

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2005, 04:21:04 PM »
Vern, I have a new  Commericial KM25G 450w. Had the 350w 5qt commericial before.I think the 5 qt had metal gears and a circuit breaker. What is the difference between the current commericial and the run of the mill ones?
   By the way for what its worth KA has one of the best customer service operations I have run across. They fell all over themselves to make me happy,which I am!
Bud

Offline Bubba Kuhn

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2005, 06:17:16 PM »
Bubba,

I can assure you that KitchenAid is NOT licensed out to a foreign manufacturer.  I should know, I work for KitchenAid.  They are owned by Whirlpool Corporation, and our mixers are STILL manufactured in Greenville, OH, as they have been since 1919.

Well now I know that little fact. What then accounts for the shorter life span of "new KA mixers versus old KA mixers.
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Offline KAidVerne

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #12 on: December 29, 2005, 06:19:06 PM »
Bud,  your commercial model is "officially" covered under a 1 year warranty for commercial use.  If  you purchased a "run of the mill" mixer and used it commercially, it would not be covered.  Your  model also comes with a "safety" guard to prevent accidentally turning on the mixer.  It is beefed up (the cord, for instance) for heavy duty use.  Finally, it is "NSF" certified, which means it meets certain NSF standards for minimizing debris collection, invasion by rodents into the column, etc.  And thanks for the comment regarding our customer service.  I don't believe anyone can come close to matching it in the small appliance industry.

Offline KAidVerne

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #13 on: December 29, 2005, 06:29:28 PM »
Bubba,  our engineers have NO data to indicate our current mixers (on average) are failing any faster than they did 30-40 years ago.  I am not claiming they are made the same, but we still have many, many consumers perfectly satisfied with our all metal construction mixers.  What I CAN say is that we have manufactured over 10 million mixers in the last 20 years since Whirlpool bought KitchenAid.  Before that, Hobart made less than 3 million in TOTAL during the previous 65 years!!   So, certainly there is a lot more opportunity to hear "complaints" due to the sheer number of KitchenAids out there.  Our failure rates are still very, very low. 

Offline Bubba Kuhn

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #14 on: December 29, 2005, 08:13:43 PM »
OK now my curiosity is piqued!
My mixer is marked assembled in USA! That does not mean manufactured in the USA! Where are the parts from?
It also claims to have come St Joseph Michigan

When I go to the KA web site and search the model number# KG25h7xwh
or serial# wr4951840
There is no info for it.
Is someone counterfeiting KA mixers?
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Offline KAidVerne

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #15 on: December 30, 2005, 12:13:23 PM »
Bubba,  "assembled" in the USA is a technical label required by the Federal Government.  If there are a certain percentage of individual parts NOT made in the USA, it has to be labelled "assembled" in the USA (and no, I don't know what that percentage is).  Some of the parts are from Korea.  Some are from China.  Some are from Sweden.  Many ARE from the USA.  It is ALL assembled in the USA in Greenville, OH, and there are plenty of manufacturing steps that are done in our plant.  The St. Joseph, MI label is where our corporate headquarters are.  As far as YOUR mixer, is is NOT a copy.  It is a special model made just for Costco.

Offline ELeight

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #16 on: December 30, 2005, 01:01:31 PM »
Hi all,

Just my two cents in defense of Kitchen Aid.  I have had a rather ordinary KSM90 300watt 4 1/2 Qt. KA mixer for just about 20 years.  I have used in mainly for whole grain breads and pizza dough with high gluten flour.  My batches are ussually around 900 grams of flour partly because the kneading action of the hook seems to work best with this size. I have never had a single problem with this mixer and I consider it my most prized kitchen possesion. Like I said just my two cents.
Erik


Offline Bubba Kuhn

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #17 on: December 30, 2005, 02:41:55 PM »
Thanks for the info.  I do miss the good old days when things were made in america and weights were in ounces and pounds.
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Offline Buffalo

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #18 on: December 30, 2005, 04:09:18 PM »
Hello KAidVerne;
Could you please tell me what the "special features" are that the units particularly made for Costco are ??? 
Buffalo

Offline KAidVerne

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #19 on: December 31, 2005, 12:00:48 AM »
Not sure how "special" the features are with the Costco model, but they are unique to them.  Their model is a "narrow" bowl 5 qt (as opposed to our Pro 5 PLUS with a 5 qt. "wide" bowl), with 25 more watts than the Pro 5 PLUS, and we throw in a mixer spatula and stainless steel measuring spoons.

Offline Massimino

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Kitchen Aid Deal via Customer Service
« Reply #20 on: January 04, 2006, 04:20:20 PM »
I called Kitchen Aid customer service because I am in the market for my first Kitchen Aid mixer. I looked at the models my local BJ's Club offered, and they had a model that sold for $269, which was in the 300 watt range, maybe 350.  I asked the customer service rep a little about the various models and what was special about some of them.  The reply was that the motor is much more powerful in some models, and some models have bowl lifts, while others do not. They were mostly the same after that.

They then offered me a 525 Watt, 6 quart model, new, a close out, and in mostly any color I wanted, for $279, and free shipping.  One year warranty. List on this is $429. How could I turn that down? 

There are differences in the new models and the 20 year old model you may have. For one, the old model doesn't have the slow smooth start they incorporated into new models to keep flour in the bowl  on startup. The new models also come with a thermal breaker, not so on the very old models.

The reply to the question about 14 cups of flour is that it translates to 6 cups of bread flour, or dough.   I told her that I could push 6 cups through the $50 ($37 on sale) model I bought in my local Wal Mart. The difference being that the model I used had smaller cork screws in it, they are much easier to turn in dough than the curved hook that Kitchen Aid spins. Plus they rip through the dough, I didn't like it.

As far as buying a Hobart, or any other industrial strength mixer. I have a family kitchen, we cook our dinner in it,  and I make a 1.5 to 3 lb's of dough for rolls and other breads. If you are runing Pizza Hut, or some other business,  you needed more than a Kitchen Aid mixer, that's why you killed it.

Offline chiguy

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #21 on: January 04, 2006, 04:54:57 PM »
 Hello Massimino,
 I upgraded and bought the 525watt KA 6qt. I got mine factory refubished for $189 plus shipping, $221 total. I bought it off www.kitchencollections.com and it came with a 6 month factory warranty which i have exhausted with no problems. The only color avaiable at that price was black, i am not sure if the same deal is avaiable. The $279 that KA offered you was still a very good deal especially since you're wife may not want a black mixer.   goodluck,  Chiguy

Offline Les

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #22 on: January 04, 2006, 07:41:21 PM »
I've had two KA mixers in the last two years, one of them the Pro 5 Plus and the other the Pro 600.  I found them both inadequate for pizza dough if you are making more than one or two pizzas at a time.  I hate to sound like a broken record but the Electrolux Assistant, which you can get for $450 if you look for bargains, was one of the best pizza investments I've made.  It has a relatively high learning curve, but once you figure out it's quirky techniques it works awesomely, has an 8 quart bowl but handles single batches with no problems, and is built like a tank and so should last a lifetime.  And no, I don't work for Electrolux!  ;D

Offline Nathan

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #23 on: January 11, 2006, 10:44:07 AM »
For the record I didn't "kill" anything.  It's just that the thermal protection would kick in after I got into mixing a batch of dough after about 4-5 minutes or so.  It seems to get more sensitive each time it's used.  When I first got this last mixer it would make it through a batch no problem.  But then it started getting to where it didn't like it. 

As for the 14 cups of flour thing...  I never really expected it to be able to handle that much high gluten flour, but they should state on the box that they are talking about all purpose flour.  Personally I wouldn't own a mixer to make cake batter or something like that.  I bought it because I got sick of hand kneading.  Not to make cake or meringue etc. 
"Pizza with pineapples?  That's a cake."

Offline KAidVerne

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Re: I'm done with Kitchen Aid
« Reply #24 on: January 12, 2006, 10:20:51 AM »
Nathan,  the outside of our box DOES state that Flour Power refers to "all purpose flour".


 

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