Elastic Dough - Please critique workflow

[mitchjg]

Hi:

Tonight I made 2 Pizzas in my FGM 700, both cooked with a floor temperature of 850 or thereabouts.  The pies came out very good, especially for only my second try with 00 flour at high temps, but I did have a stretching issue with the doughs, for the first time in a long time.

I suspect it is my workflow since that is what changed, along with the flour.  I usually follow Jeff Varasano's work flow and bake at 700 or so, usually with 80% KABF and 20% Caputo.  I typically wait until day 2 or 3 of CF.

This dough was made with my sourdough starter and a long RT ferment.  The dough formulation was:

100% Central Mills 00 flour (first time using),
64% hydration
2.75% salt
2.25 % starter (50/50 water/flour, water included in total hydration calculation, flour included in flour total)

My workflow followed the process taught to me in the book "How to Bake Bread", by Emmanuel Hadjiandreou (terrific book and so is Emmanuael)

Combined all ingredients in a bowl, stirred together with a dough hook until it is a shaggy mass - no dry spots
Cover and wait 10 minutes and then stretch and fold.  The stretch and fold is through 10 quick motions, each after rotating the bowl a bit - takes about a minute altogether.
Repeat the cover, wait, stretch and fold 3 more times.

I then neatened the dough into a ball and covered it, and left it to ferment all day and night - 24 hours.
At 24 hours, I split the dough into two 260 pieces, balled them up and put them in oiled, covered Glad containers.
I cooked the pizzas about 7 or 8 hours later.  Although the temperature fluctuated a bit, it stayed mostly at around 69 degrees.  I took it outside (62 degrees) for 2 or 3 hours because I was worried it may have been fermenting a bit too quick (probably did not really have to worry about it).

When I follow Varasano's workflow the dough is very extensible - it is very quick and easy to open up the dough into a full size pie.  Never fights, very "floppy."

This dough required about 3 minutes of cajoling to get it to stretch out to full size.  The second dough got a little tear as I, in a very determined way, worked it open.

Perhaps too many stretch and folds (although it took that many, 4, to have it turn into a nice silky dough ball)?  Not enough waiting after balling?  More hydration?  Mix the dough follow Varasano's method and then room ferment?

I do want to experiment more with room temperature fermentation, so I am determined here.........

Thanks!

- Mitch

[mitchjg]

I may have figured it out - it may be the characteristics of the flour and not my workflow.

I found this posting from dellavecchia (John) describing his experience with the same flour: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13473.0.html
In which he said:
"I did a 61% hydration test alongside CP with the exact same workflow. The CM was noticeably yellow compared to the pale white of the CP. And it became very obvious from the outset that this flour was much less extensible than the CP at the same hydration. It was almost stubborn to get the dough stretched – unlike the laid back CP, which nearly stretches itself. This was probably due to the absorption rate being different from product to product, and the protein quality in the CM.

The second test, as outlined below, I did at 64%, which I feel was better suited to the CM. I have been doing “short” mixes lately for Neapolitan pies, according to Suas, and then doing a few folds. The dough felt more extensible and supple.

During the stretch, the CM was again a bit stubborn to stretch, but not as much as before. I think this flour could handle 68% or more. It baked nearly identical to CP as can be seen in the pics."

Seems like if I try (perhaps) 66% hydration then it may stretch a bit easier.  I have 10 pounds of the flour so I will certainly keep dabbling.

- Mitch


The pies:

[dellavecchia]

Hi Mitch - yes, the extensibility is no where near Caputo with this flour. Completely different specs, and one of the reasons Caputo stands on its own in this category. You can lower the bulk down to 8 hours and do the rest balled. This will help with extensibility, in addition to raising the hydration.

John

[mitchjg]

Thanks John,

I am being a little dense.

If I want to cook at 6 pm, are you suggesting mixing the dough in the evening, followed by making dough balls in the am (say 12 hours later) and then cooking (total 24 or thereabouts)?

Or, mix first thing in the morning, bulk rise for 8 hours, ball and wait another 2 to 4 hours?

I did not know that a shorter ferment would increase the extensibility.

Thanks for your help.

- Mitch

[dellavecchia]

Mitch - 8 hours bulk, 24 hours balled.

John

[mitchjg]

Mitch - 8 hours bulk, 24 hours balled.

John

Thanks, got it now.  I will give it a try.