Author Topic: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(  (Read 2794 times)

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Offline 3.14 Guy

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I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« on: November 25, 2012, 06:03:29 PM »
I'm a HUGE pizza fan, worked at a few pizza places when I was a teenager (a hundred years ago) and would someday like to open my own little restaurant, serving that "perfect" pie!  One little problem: I can't even make a decent pizza at home nowadays.

I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong, but my dough is horrible.  Bland, no good rise, no crumb.  I would prefer an "American" style (like Dolly's, Hungry Howie's, Papa John's, etc) or a good "pan" style (like Pizza Hut), and I especially love "Detroit" style (Louie's, Jet's, Cloverleaf, etc.).

I'm not well versed in the vernacular of baker's proportions, so I haven't tried any recipes here (except the pan, a long time ago - it was very good).  Can anyone help?!  I want to make a great homemade pie this week, so if I need to allow some extra time I can.  I have a nice round 14" black pan, pizza screens, pizza stone so anything that would work with that would be great.

Thanks in advance!
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!


Offline norma427

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2012, 06:21:23 PM »
I'm a HUGE pizza fan, worked at a few pizza places when I was a teenager (a hundred years ago) and would someday like to open my own little restaurant, serving that "perfect" pie!  One little problem: I can't even make a decent pizza at home nowadays.

I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong, but my dough is horrible.  Bland, no good rise, no crumb.  I would prefer an "American" style (like Dolly's, Hungry Howie's, Papa John's, etc) or a good "pan" style (like Pizza Hut), and I especially love "Detroit" style (Louie's, Jet's, Cloverleaf, etc.).

I'm not well versed in the vernacular of baker's proportions, so I haven't tried any recipes here (except the pan, a long time ago - it was very good).  Can anyone help?!  I want to make a great homemade pie this week, so if I need to allow some extra time I can.  I have a nice round 14" black pan, pizza screens, pizza stone so anything that would work with that would be great.

Thanks in advance!



3.14 Guy,

Maybe one of these threads might be of interest to you if you want to try a pizza in a pan and do like Detroit-style pizzas or Jet‘s pizza. Most of the formulations are for rectangular steel pans, but round pans should work if you plug what size pan you want to use in the expanded dough calculation tool. http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html  If you get yourself a scale for any formulations that are posted there shouldn’t be many problems with want you want to achieve.  What don’t you understand about bakers percentages?  I think different members can help you understand them.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3783.0.html

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21559.0.html

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8247.0.html

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Offline pizzaneer

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2012, 10:08:27 PM »
I started off making pizza using a high-hydration recipe and a cast-iron skillet for sicilian style.  You hardly even need a scale for that kind- it's so forgiving to mistakes that almost any result will taste great.  My skill level got much, much better once I got a scale, and I was able to move on to other styles successfully.

Start easy- Here's one to get you off the ground... you could double it for a 14".

My original notes from years ago:
2 cups flour (King Arthur Bread Flour works best, but AP works too.)
1/2 cup water
1 Tbsp oil
1 tsp salt
1 tsp sugar
small pinch of yeast - a little goes a looong way

mix by hand in bowl with wooden spoon
Turn out onto floured surface (sprinkle more flour as needed as you go along)
Press out flat, roll up into tube, then roll tube into ball.  Repeat 2 more times, letting it rest 15 minutes each time.
cover bowl with plastic wrap and let rise in warm place until doubled.
press out to sides in oiled pan or skillet
cover with wrap and stick it in the fridge until ready to make  (let it warm up while the oven is preheating)
top with your favorite sauce and lots of cheese - get the cheese all the way to the pan sides for extra yum
bake for 12 minutes at 475 or until cheese looks right to you
for more bottom crisp, remove from pan before cheese is completely done and bake directly on oven rack or stone

hope this helps until you get a scale

I'd rather eat one good meal a day than 3 squares of garbage.

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2012, 08:29:35 PM »
Great info everyone, thanks!  I guess I just never use a scale so I always rely on cups, teaspoons, etc.  I'm going to check out the threads posted and shoot for trying out Pizzaneer's recipe, for this Saturday.  I'll post some pics and hopefully start getting this monkey off my back!

Thanks again!!
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2012, 08:35:17 PM »
By the way I do have a scale, but I think I was confused as to how to read through the recipes correctly.  Looking through them again, I think I see now what was confusing me.  I was hung up on percentages, and trying to figure that into overall weight I think.

Out of curiosity, and I'm sure there's a million threads explaining it, but why the weights/% versus cups, etc?  More accuracy equaling consistency?

Thanks.
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline norma427

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2012, 10:01:08 PM »

Out of curiosity, and I'm sure there's a million threads explaining it, but why the weights/% versus cups, etc?  More accuracy equaling consistency?

Thanks.


3.14 Guy,

To try to explain a little about why weights are used instead of volume measurements, a cup can weigh different weights all depending on how you scoop the flour into the cup.  Even water can weigh different weights if using volume measurements.  You will be able to achieve more consistent results in your dough if you use a scale to weigh out the flour and water and if something goes wrong, you know exactly how much flour and water you used and then might know how to change things easier. 

All members don’t use weight measurements though and they do get good results. 

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2012, 10:38:41 PM »
Thanks Norma!  I will definitely start using this method, especially when I start getting the results I'm looking for.  Consistency has been my biggest flaw in the years I've been making pies at home.  One is great, the next sucks, the following is the best ever, etc.

I think part of my problem is I want too many different types too often, so I don't get settled in on a recpie for one type that I like and stick with it.  I also experiment too much and add, delete, substitute on a whim, so that definitely doesn't help.
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline norma427

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2012, 10:50:35 PM »
3.14 Guy,

I also have the same problems sometimes with trying too many experiments at once.  I find if I stick to one formulation for a little while I can get the results I want much quicker.

Maybe if you pick one style and a proven formulation it might give you better results. I know trying different formulations is fun, but sometimes they can be confusing with the results I get. 

Good luck!  :)

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2012, 05:05:05 PM »
I made this last week with my new black metal 12"x17" pan I got from Roselli's in Fraser, MI for about $7 (yes that's correct).  It turned out great, I used the following recipe taken from Hog's post (sorry forgot which one - it began "Finally the basics are all together so here is my recipe for Detroit Style Pie..."

00.2 oz SALT – Table
10.5 oz WATER – Room temp
14.0 oz FLOUR – All Purpose
0.07 oz IDY – Jar

Dissolve salt in water in KA bowl
Add flour
Sprinkle yeast on top
Using dough hook, mix until incorporated, then mix low speed for 8 minutes.  Remove hook, using spatula to scrape dough off hook.  Use spatula to scrape dough away from sides of bowl into middle “ball”
Allow dough to rest for 20 minutes

Add 2.25 tsp of olive oil to pan, use brush to spread oil around bottom and up sides of pan
Using rubber spatula dipped in olive oil, scrape dough into 12X17 metal pan
Oil fingers and use fingertips to spread dough around bottom of pan
Set pan aside, cover with towel and allow to rise for 4 hours

After rise time add pepperoni atop dough.  Sprinkle sharp cheddar around edges of pan and a little on top of pepperoni (white cheddar would probably be better and not burn as much).  Add mozzarella on top of pepperoni (Kroger brand low moisture part skim).  Add ham, canned mushroom slices, sliced red onion, sliced green pepper (or any other combo of toppings).

Dei Fratelli canned pizza sauce, ladle out 3 strips of sauce over pizza
Place pan on bottom rack of oven at 475 degrees, for 15 minutes, move to top rack for 10 minutes, then back to bottom rack for 10 more minutes (may not need to move, check for doneness)

The crust was almost perfect and the crumb was nice and open.  I only let it rise 3 hours, whereas I put 4 hours in my recipe above.  That extra hour would probably make the difference I'm looking for.  Also, I used sharp cheddar which burned a bit; I will try tonight's with white cheddar I bought at Target (block which I will grate).
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!


Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2012, 05:11:44 PM »
1
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2012, 05:12:10 PM »
2
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2012, 05:12:30 PM »
3
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2012, 05:12:56 PM »
4
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2012, 05:13:15 PM »
5
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2012, 05:13:34 PM »
6
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2012, 05:13:51 PM »
7
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2012, 05:14:12 PM »
8
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2012, 05:15:01 PM »
I had to reduce the size of my pictures way down to meet the 128k limit here.  It may be hard to see everything.  Looking forward to tonight's pizza!
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!

Offline 3.14 Guy

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Re: I need help! Disgusted with my recnt pizza making attempts :(
« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2012, 05:17:25 PM »
Oh, and I forgot: I sprinkled the finished pizza with garlic powder (not salt) lightly, and a light sprinkling of dried Italian seasoning.  I think that made a nice finished taste to it.
Making great pizza, outstanding beer and fantastic BBQ.  This is my passion!


 

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