Author Topic: Tom Lehmann's dough tips for the amatuer pizza maker at home ? (Read 55990 times)

occifer19 · « **Reply #80 on:** July 11, 2009, 09:54:10 AM »

Peter..........I want to thank you for all your help, I had no idea how precise you need to be to make dough you want all the time. I'll start over and crunch the numbers and methods better. I want that perfect crust, and with your help I'm getting close.

I wish I knew you when I lived in Texas, I would have loved to try your pizza..............Mikey

I'll start over today.........and thanks a Gazillion..............inflation..............Mikey

Pete-zza · « **Reply #81 on:** July 11, 2009, 02:13:26 PM »

Mikey,

The important thing is that you like the results that you have been getting. It doesn't have to be a true Lehmann NY style. However, if you become hooked on pizza making, you might consider getting a digital scale, if only to increase the chances of getting a consistent product, whether it is a Lehmann NY style or some other style, even your own "interpretation" of the Lehmann NY style.

As far as my pizzas are concerned, I tend to jump around a lot and do a lot of experimenting, so I am never quite sure what I am going to end up with and how they will taste until I pull the pizzas from my oven. Even my Lehmann pizzas are all over the lot, as you can see from the Lehmann Roadmap at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1453.msg13193.html#msg13193. Fortunately, it is hard to do much damage to the Lehmann dough formulation if you stay close to it.

Peter

occifer19 · « **Reply #82 on:** July 12, 2009, 08:02:28 PM »

Pete....I made the pizza you gave Pizzagirl, by the numbers, volume method, didn't have to add any flour or water. Smokin Pizza, I tried to send some pics but it is too large. I see my nephew and send some tomorrow........Mikey

Pete...............here are the Pics I've been trying to send, Hope you like them................

Everybody loved the Pizza.................You know your beans.............Thanks again Mikey

Dragonborn · « **Reply #83 on:** July 27, 2009, 12:06:53 AM »

what size is that... thats one damn good looking pizza. Now im going to have to make one

DB(Mike)

occifer19 · « **Reply #84 on:** July 27, 2009, 09:35:15 AM »

DB...........That is a 12 inch Pizza. It came out great. I'm making one today with 2 day cold ferminting and 30 minutes kneeding. If I find my memory card for my camera I 'll take a pic and post it........

Thanks.....Mike Hoffman

Matt...........Just finished the Pizza, it came out awesome I 'll put up pics tomorrow..I think u will like them

Mikey

MozzaMatt · « **Reply #85 on:** July 27, 2009, 03:41:46 PM »

Hello...first time poster here.

I wanted to mention that I came across this great forum a month ago and have made 3 attempts at the Lehmann recipe for NY Style. The first 2 came out dense, yet still edible. The third attempt last week using the modified recipe from Pete-zza came out dramatically better!! Still some tweaks here and there, but I was finally able to get closer to NY pizza crust which I miss now that I am in LA.

I wanted to thank Pete-zza and the rest of the people on the forum who contribute and upload their images as it helps me alot in learning. I absolutley love a good pizza and learning to make it at home is my new recession obsession. I look forward to sharing my results as I master this process.

Best!

MozzaMatt

occifer19 · « **Reply #86 on:** July 27, 2009, 04:16:50 PM »

Matt
I'm new here Too, and it is a great place to learn about pizza, The first time I made the dought it was good, but not exactly NY Lehmanns recipe. so I went back and tried again I will get one made later today and let you know. ALOT of things matter, temp. how much you use how you measure it. Ect.

I bought a digatal scale and instant read thermometer, Makes all the differance in the world.

I like a chewy crunchy crust and haven't got that exact on yet, but I'm workin on it......

I'll let you know more tomorrow.....................Mike Hoffman

Pizza was great now I have to figure out how to load the pics. lost my memory card...........Mikey

jonesyb · « **Reply #87 on:** February 02, 2011, 05:21:37 PM »

I've tried the recipe at the start of this thread. What I've realised is the hydration of the dough is not far off what I was doing anyway. It's just what happens afterwards and the amount of yeast that differs massively. There was no problem with my original dough it just had about 4 times the amount of yeast and I made it about 3 hours before I needed it.

I made this dough by hand.

Made enough dough for 5 x 12" pizzas.

Dough is in the fridge in zip lock bags.

Look forward to taking some pictures and starting my own thread to track my progress.

jonesyb · « **Reply #88 on:** February 05, 2011, 05:00:46 AM »

Here's a picture of the dough made from the recipe at the start of this thread.

It's been in the fridge since Wednesday night (3 days by the time I use it tonight). Would ideally like some plastic tubs to keep it in but these zip lock bags seem good enough. And I think the way forward based on my limited space.

Used strong bread flour. Can't seem to find any flour labelled as 'high gluten' here in the UK. I'm hoping the flour I used is high gluten.

When I make pizzas tonight I will start my own thread. I make pizza regularly. Documenting my experiments is something I definitely want to do.

scott123 · « **Reply #89 on:** February 05, 2011, 11:16:16 AM »

Benjamin, that dough, as pictured, is ready to bake. Perhaps even a little bit past ready. Next time, either use it in 1-2 days, lower the water temperature a few degrees or scale back the yeast a bit.

'Strong bread' flour = 'High gluten.' I think you should be fine there. You're probably going to need to fine tune the hydration based on the actual protein content of the flour, but, from the photo, I think you're in the right ballpark.

jonesyb · « **Reply #90 on:** February 05, 2011, 11:45:50 AM »

Quote from: scott123 on February 05, 2011, 11:16:16 AM

Benjamin, that dough, as pictured, is ready to bake. Perhaps even a little bit past ready. Next time, either use it in 1-2 days, lower the water temperature a few degrees or scale back the yeast a bit.

'Strong bread' flour = 'High gluten.' I think you should be fine there. You're probably going to need to fine tune the hydration based on the actual protein content of the flour, but, from the photo, I think you're in the right ballpark.

Thank you for your comments. I was a little worried that it had been in the fridge too long. I made it on Wednesday simply because I had a window of free time. I hope it will be OK anyway.

Pizzas will be being made in a few hours. I shall post my results tomorrow some time.

capamando · « **Reply #91 on:** December 20, 2011, 07:47:07 AM »

Hello,

My wife and I followed the recipe that Pete-zza gave the Pizzagirl. We just took a look at the dough ball after 24hours in the fridge (38 degrees) and found that it has not increased or puffed up that much. Is this normal? Please advice.

Thanks

Pete-zza · « **Reply #92 on:** December 20, 2011, 08:08:25 AM »

capamando,

Yes, that is something that can occur, especially if it is cool where you are this time of year and you have not adjusted the amount of yeast or water temperature accordingly and/or you plan to use the dough before it has undergone sufficient fermentation. Also, a dough will often rise but unless you have a way of measuring the increase in volume, you may not be able to tell, especially if the dough slumps and spreads in its container. Unless you did something wrong, you should see a more noticeable rise in the dough, with increased softness, as it tempers at room temperature before using. The temper time will depend on how warm or cool your kitchen is or whereaver else you will let the dough warm up. The Lehmann dough is a low yeast dough that is intended to provide up to a few days of cold fermentation so you will not see it exploding in volume before your very eyes.

Peter

capamando · « **Reply #93 on:** December 20, 2011, 11:04:27 AM »

Pete-zza,

We live in Massachusetts and probably the inside temp is around 68-72 degrees. Here is a pic of the dough ball taken out of the oven five minutes ago after 27hours in the fridge. Thanks we will let it rest in room temp and keep an eye on the results. By the way we used the exact formula that you gave Pizzagirl.

Quote from: Pete-zza on December 20, 2011, 08:08:25 AM

capamando,

Yes, that is something that can occur, especially if it is cool where you are this time of year and you have not adjusted the amount of yeast or water temperature accordingly and/or you plan to use the dough before it has undergone sufficient fermentation. Also, a dough will often rise but unless you have a way of measuring the increase in volume, you may not be able to tell, especially if the dough slumps and spreads in its container. Unless you did something wrong, you should see a more noticeable rise in the dough, with increased softness, as it tempers at room temperature before using. The temper time will depend on how warm or cool your kitchen is or whereaver else you will let the dough warm up. The Lehmann dough is a low yeast dough that is intended to provide up to a few days of cold fermentation so you will not see it exploding in volume before your very eyes.

Peter

capamando · « **Reply #94 on:** December 20, 2011, 12:27:20 PM »

Here is the same dough ball at room temp after 1 1/2 hours out of the fridge.

capamando · « **Reply #95 on:** December 20, 2011, 02:54:33 PM »

Hello Folks,

I am not sure if anybody is interested in my investigation...but I am having fun doing it!

So... the next photo is the dough after 3hour/50mins after being taken out of the fridge. Room temp is 74.. dough temp 71.5. What do you guys think? I think it looks ready for shaping and baking..

Pete-zza · « **Reply #96 on:** December 20, 2011, 03:05:11 PM »

capamondo,

If the dough has expanded in volume while at room temperature and feels soft, you might go for it. Once a dough ball is ready to be used, it will last for two or more hours longer depending on the flour used, so there is no real rush to proceed. In fact, the older the dough is before using, the better the pizza usually (provided the dough has not overproofed).

Peter

capamando · « **Reply #97 on:** December 20, 2011, 04:22:50 PM »

Pete-zza and others

Here is the shaped pie.... easy to as pie!

capamando · « **Reply #98 on:** December 20, 2011, 04:29:25 PM »

Hello,

The final product

11 minutes 550

Cman710 · « **Reply #99 on:** January 13, 2012, 08:09:55 AM »

Hi everyone,

I hope everyone is well. I have been lurking on this forum for quite some time, and then last week, finally decided to give my shot at a NY-style pizza. I am originally from Staten Island, NY, which is one of the best places for pizza in the NY area. My favorite pizza place is Denino's, which makes a traditional NY style, with a particularly crunchy crust (some might say "well-done"). Since I now live near Boston, MA, the NY-style pizza offerings are very weak. Despite my wife's skepticism about making a pizza in a home oven, I proceeded anyway.

For the dough, I used the recipe at the beginning of this thread.

100% King Arthur Organic Bread Flour, 7.15 oz (my scale only rounds to the tenth of an ounce, so I did the best I could to approximate)
63% Water at 100 degrees (Cambridge, MA tap water)
1% oil, 0.07 oz.
1.75% salt, 0.13 oz
0.40% IDY (Fleischmann's rapid rise)

I made the dough in a Kitchen Aid stand mixer and followed Pete's instructions as closely as possible. I forgot to weigh the final dough ball, but the final dough temperature was 80 degrees (room temperature was about 71 degrees, btw). It then stayed in the refrigerator for 19 hours until I took it out to come up to room temperature.

Following the video posted earlier in the thread, I dusted my dough ball with a flour/semolina flour mix, and then stretched out the dough. I ended up with an oblong pizza, but I decided not to try to fix it to maintain the integrity of the dough. I then got the rest of the pizza ready (just sauce, cheese and pepperoni, on half).

I baked the pizza in my electric oven at 505 degrees. With 45 minutes of pre-heating, I got the oven to about 505 degrees, but then had a mishap getting the pizza in the oven. (My peel is coming this week, but I was impatient and wanted to make a pizza anyway. I got what I deserved, I guess). I also dusted my makeshift "peel" with semolina. Despite the mishap, which involved slightly reshaping the dough, the dough held up really nicely. The pizza cooked for about 12-14 minutes, probably at 475 degrees, because I had lost so much heat during my mishap. I cooked the pizza on a stone I had seen recommended here, but now I forget the name, as I purchased it months ago and then never used it until now.

My "sauce" is described below, and for cheese, I used a local mozzarella from Burnett Farms in Vermont that I got at Whole Foods. It was basically the only choice besides Calabro or Belgioso, and I it was the right choice. Once I give it a few more shots, I plan to order some Grande from Penn Mac.

Despite my mishap and the non-ideal cooking conditions, the pizza came out surprisingly good. The crust was crunchy and had a nice NY style texture. In this respect, I think that the semolina really helped. Tonight, I am going to try another go at this recipe with the hope of making a pizza Sunday, and I had a few questions:

(1) My wife and I both thought the crust lacked a little flavor. We both figured that I should add more salt. Does this make sense, or is longer fermentation the answer? I have read that salt can toughen a dough, and I do not want to overly-toughen the dough, either.

(2) For sauce, I got a can of Cento San Marzano whole peeled tomatoes, and hand crushed them. Then I added some salt, oregano, italian seasoning, garlic powder, and a touch of fresh garlic that I had around from a dish my wife was cooking. The sauce was okay, but had a little bit of a "raw" taste to it. Do you think I should lightly cook the sauce next time? I am also planning to puree it in the food processor, as I just did not get it smooth enough with hand crushing.

(3) The crust came a golden brown, rather than the slightly darker brownish color I am accustomed to in a NY-style pizza. Could this have been a result of cook time and the lower than ideal temperature? I have also read some people add sugar to help a crust brown. Is this something that would be helpful? If so, how much sugar?

Any thoughts or comments would be great. I will post some pictures later. Thanks!