Why Does My Dough Taste Like Sour Dough?

[pythonic]

Could over fermented dough taste a little like sourdough?

[TXCraig1]

Could over fermented dough taste a little like sourdough?

It might get a tiny "sour" flavor from the ethanol - maybe, but it's never going to be anything like the sour of a sourdough. The sour comes from lactic acid bacteria which you just don't have in meaningful amounts in a baker's yeast leavened dough. Maybe if your flour was contaminated with some sort of bacteria, maybe.

[Jet_deck]

BBC Supertaster test:   http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/body/interactives/supertaster/

[PizzaEater101]

Could over fermented dough taste a little like sourdough?

Maybe but I did have a cold fermentation of 1 day only for the first pizza and I think it was 3 days for the second pizza. But could be.

[PizzaEater101]

BBC Supertaster test:   http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/body/interactives/supertaster/

Thanks for the test. Did you take it or any other people here take it? What did you rate? I was found to a Supertaster.

[PizzaEater101]

It might get a tiny "sour" flavor from the ethanol - maybe, but it's never going to be anything like the sour of a sourdough. The sour comes from lactic acid bacteria which you just don't have in meaningful amounts in a baker's yeast leavened dough. Maybe if your flour was contaminated with some sort of bacteria, maybe.

Not sure if it's contaminated or I'm just tasting things that most normal tasters would not. I say this because I asked my wife if the pizza I gave her the other day if the crust tasted like sour dough and she said no.

I guess I'm just picking up something she is not due to my super taster ways. Also super tasters have a heightened sense of both taste and smell.

[PizzaEater101]

PE101,  been reading this thread from the beginning,  starting to wonder if maybe you are not a super taster?  Try making a dough with a sourdough starter and see if it tastes like sourdough.  Also,  as you do not like beer,  maybe you are objecting to the beery taste of a well fermented yeasted bread dough.  Certainty there are similarities.  Not trying to give you a hard time,  but from what you have described,  it seems to me your taste may be a bit off. -Marc

No offense taken Marc, I am positive my taste is off. I taste things in food that others who have normal taste don't taste which causes me to dislike many foods that most people like.

I should make it with a sourdough starter. I don't even know how to do that but I'm sure there are plenty of threads here about that so I should research some and learn how and make some and see how the result taste.

I made some more dough yesterday and plan on making a pizza tomorrow and I did it the same way as I always do and the same formula as the last one so I'll see if it taste that way too.

I think you are onto something about the beer. It might be the dough is well fermented. I wonder if I should make a dough with .2% instead of .5% yeast. I usually us .4% but recently started .5 because I like the Luigi formula that either Essen1 or Pete came up with, I forget which and the one I picked that they came up with is .5 something %.  I am not sure how dropping to .2% would affect the taste and the quality of the dough though.

[PizzaEater101]

As others have noted, there is nothing in your formula or workflow that should give you a sour taste no matter what you do - effortlessly or otherwise. I have to agree with Marc that you are likely confusing a yeasty, fermented taste for a sour taste.

Most likely. I'm tasting more yeasty flavor than most normal tasters would so it gives a sour dough vibe to me.

[Pete-zza]

James,

As I noted at Reply 17 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21181.msg214864/topicseen.html#msg214864, it takes a fair amount of yeast to be discernible in the finished crust. Also, since ADY contains more dead cells than IDY, some people may be able to taste the difference between those two forms of yeast. In your case, I suppose it is possible that your unique taste sensitivity allows you to taste the IDY even at lower relative levels and be perceived as being sourdough in nature even if isn't a true sourdough flavor.

Peter

[PizzaEater101]

James,

As I noted at Reply 17 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21181.msg214864/topicseen.html#msg214864, it takes a fair amount of yeast to be discernible in the finished crust. Also, since ADY contains more dead cells than IDY, some people may be able to taste the difference between those two forms of yeast. In your case, I suppose it is possible that your unique taste sensitivity allows you to taste the IDY even at lower relative levels and be perceived as being sourdough in nature even if isn't a true sourdough flavor.

Peter

Thanks for the info and the link to Reply 17.  Yes, could be it's because of my heightened sense of taste that I taste the yeast even though the amounts of IDY is low enough where I most should not be tasting it. So either my sense of taste or maybe something else.

I will try a sour dough starter and see how that goes too.

[PizzaEater101]

Check this out. This member says his dough has a sour flavor to it.


http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21481.0.html

[Chicago Bob]

How long have you been making pizzas...did this just now start happening? What about other peoples pizza...do you ever eat out or have you ever had a store bought frozen pizza...same peculiar taste?

[PizzaEater101]

How long have you been making pizzas...did this just now start happening? What about other peoples pizza...do you ever eat out or have you ever had a store bought frozen pizza...same peculiar taste?

Those are good questions.

I have been making pizza for about 7 years now but have not been making on a regular basis for about 5 years.

I do eat out and there are some fine pizza places I go to.  When I first started this thread I asked about this because I didn't think it was because of my tasting abilities. I am a supertaster that's for sure but I thought it had nothing to do with that and thought it was something in the way I was doing things because in the past my own pizzas didn't give me the sour flavor and when I go to pizza joints I didn't get that flavor too. I thought it must be something I am doing wrong but then I didn't do anything different than anyone who does make pizza does so why does it taste sour so I thought maybe it's because I am a supertaster but truthfully I don't think it is the supertaster thing but I can't figure out what.

[PizzaEater101]

Oh wait I figured it out.

Can the type of sugar cause the dough to taste sour? Maybe it reacts differently with the yeast?  See I first noticed this about 5 pizzas ago.

I ran out of sugar, regular C&H granulated sugar but I did have some C&H granulated sugar that is super fine so I used that since I ran out of regular granulated sugar. I was planning on going out and buying some regular granulated sugar but didn't get around to it yet so have been using super fine granulated sugar. Can that cause a strange reaction between the yeast and the super fine sugar to cause it to ferment differently and give a sour dough like taste?

I made some dough the other day so this afternoon I'll make a pizza and let you know if it gives that sour dough taste. Then I'll make some dough in a day or two and make a pizza with regular C&H granulated sugar and let you know if it taste sour dough like.  That might be it because it's the only thing that changed recently and that's when it started tasting sour dough like.

Then again my wife does not taste the sour dough like flavor to it. Maybe the super fine sugar does do something to it to the point that I, a supertaster can taste the sour dough like flavor but she can not but if I used regular granulated sugar then the flavor of sour dough will go away to my heightened sense of taste and of course she'd never be the wiser either way.

[Chicago Bob]

Check this out. This member says his dough has a sour flavor to it.


http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21481.0.html

I think he was misunderstood in that thread.And I believe he was meaning "smell" when he would say "flavor".
Also, what the other posters didn't seem to understand was that he already used a purchased dough(which didn't smell) and he was now looking to start using his own dough but needed help getting his dough to not smell. His sentence structure was a 'lil confusing...
Bob

[PizzaEater101]

I think he was misunderstood in that thread.And I believe he was meaning "smell" when he would say "flavor".
Also, what the other posters didn't seem to understand was that he already used a purchased dough(which didn't smell) and he was now looking to start using his own dough but needed help getting his dough to not smell. His sentence structure was a 'lil confusing...
Bob

I see, yes smell and taste are related in our senses but they are two different things.

[PizzaEater101]

If any of you want to use my dough formulation that I posted and use C&H super fine sugar then let us see if you get a sour dough like flavor. The IDY I use is saf-instant brand. I use Power Flour high gluten. If you don't have that or saf that's okay but still give super fine sugar a go. You can get it at those dollar type of stores so it won't cost much and will last a long time.

[PizzaEater101]

Made another pizza yesterday and had the sour flavor to it but less. I used Crystal Geyser Water since I was trying to mimic the Pizzeria Luigi pizza since Luigi uses Crystal Geyser.  The sour was there but not as much so I wonder if the mineral content  of the water which is different than my municipal tap water I have been using for years might react differently to the yeast so it gives less of a sour taste although there. Also like I say I use super fine granulated sugar so I wonder if that has something to do with it because before that I never had that issue of sourness.

I will have to do some controlled experiments to see how the results are and I'll post them. I can't make pizza all the time but you know I'll have to give it a try.

Thanks

[norma427]

James,

I have played around with sour dough pizzas and also the Luigi’s pizza.  Steve and I never tasted any sourdough taste when I made the Luigi’s pizzas and I used Crystal Geyser water and other waters.

I really think your taste buds are a little different (which really isn‘t a bad thing, but might make you taste differently than others).  I really don’t think the type of sugar you use has anything to do with the sourdough taste either.

I have tried NY water, my well tap water, markets well water and other bottled waters in my different pizzas and really never tasted a sourdough taste without really using a starter.

What type of controlled experiments do you want to try? 

Norma

[PizzaEater101]

James,

I have played around with sour dough pizzas and also the Luigi’s pizza.  Steve and I never tasted any sourdough taste when I made the Luigi’s pizzas and I used Crystal Geyser water and other waters.

I really think your taste buds are a little different (which really isn‘t a bad thing, but might make you taste differently than others).  I really don’t think the type of sugar you use has anything to do with the sourdough taste either.

I have tried NY water, my well tap water, markets well water and other bottled waters in my different pizzas and really never tasted a sourdough taste without really using a starter.

What type of controlled experiments do you want to try? 

Norma

Thanks for your input Norma.  Just in terms of controlled experiment I mean take notes of different waters and different sugar and flour types as well as fermentation times and bake times to see what different results I might have. This could take months because I won't be making pizza every week.  Maybe more weeks than others but not all weeks.