Author Topic: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway  (Read 42520 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #75 on: February 13, 2013, 03:06:53 AM »
From the start i was planning to either a buttress with insulation concrete or something similar to what tom did. But, i had never worked with mortar really before and it looked to complicated so i went for a steel reinforcement. We will see how it goes but i will defenitely put som tension on the steel harness and make it fit tightly to the soldiers.

Jeff, i dont really understand why a more ellipse shape would cause more problems in the steel harness design than a lens shape would?
Is it that the forces from the dome will be more directed to the lower parts of the soldiers compared to a lens shape?

In my build i did already plan to have a metal band both in upper part of angle-soldiers and one extra at 2/3 distance up on the lower part soldiers. I dont know if it will be  nessesary but i figured it would not hurt either. This second metal band will be connected to the oven door.


Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #76 on: February 13, 2013, 05:40:00 AM »
I dont know exactly how the forces from the dome will affect the soldiers?
This is what i can think of but is it correct, and is this what you mean Jeff?
Maby this is of no big matter but iam just curious...

Offline shuboyje

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 1213
  • Location: Detroit
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #77 on: February 13, 2013, 11:00:23 AM »
I made a simple drawing to explain the issue I'm mentioned earlier.  Like I have said, I do not think this is an issue with your current plan.  I made the arch in the drawing exaggerated to better show what I am talking about. 
-Jeff

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #78 on: February 13, 2013, 12:52:25 PM »
Ok thanks, now i understad and it makes sense.
Will try to make the sandform during this weekend.



Offline TXCraig1

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 15424
  • Location: Houston, TX
    • Craig's Neapolitan Garage
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #79 on: February 13, 2013, 01:10:35 PM »
I agree it is not a problem with your current design. The Line of Thrust (“LT”) in an arch follows the inverted shape the corresponding catenary curve. That is, if you freely suspended a length of chain from the center points of the angled buttresses on top of your solders, the LT through the arch would follow this same (inverted) curve. The closer you keep the LT to the center of the voussoirs, the more stable the arch. As the LT moves away from the center, it creates tensile stress on the opposite side.  That is what Jeff noted as “outward force” on his drawing in Response 77 – you can see that the inverted catenary curve would be well inside of that point creating tensile stress there. As long as the LT is within the center 1/3 of the thickness of the arch, you should be fine. My guess is that the truncated ellipse fairly closely approximates a catenary arch.

I think your drawing in Response 76 is incorrect in a couple ways. First, the LT, or “Force” as you called it, is independent of the shape of the dome arch. As noted above, it is a function of the corresponding catenary curve.  Second, the force is not going to be directed into the solider as indicated. My guess is that the LT vector will be on the opposite side of the solider.  I think this is important as it what likely necessitates a minimum of two bands (above and below the mortar line on top of the soldiers.

The solider is part of the arch. As you can see below, the LT exits the arch somewhere near the top of the solider. Clearly, this creates an extremely unstable condition.  The Thrust vector is the resultant force of the Horizontal Thrust and Weight vectors.  The soldiers will bear all the weight of the dome, but the direction of the Thrust vector is not orthogonal to the long axis of the brick, hence the need for reinforcement in the form of the bands or some other reinforcement.
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #80 on: February 15, 2013, 03:06:19 PM »
Thank you so far guys.
I even think and hope these discussions will help other builders since it is high level stuff at least for me.
Iam waiting for my vermicrete mix over the door to dry. I want make sure it will be stable before i move on.

Offline TXCraig1

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 15424
  • Location: Houston, TX
    • Craig's Neapolitan Garage
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #81 on: February 15, 2013, 03:08:25 PM »
I'm excited for you. I think you are going to have an awesome oven.
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline andreguidon

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 1169
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Sao Paulo
  • Hot WFO always !!!
    • www.andreguidon.com
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #82 on: February 15, 2013, 03:19:37 PM »
faglia have you seen this video?

"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." Leonardo da Vinci

Offline TXCraig1

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 15424
  • Location: Houston, TX
    • Craig's Neapolitan Garage
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #83 on: February 15, 2013, 03:32:36 PM »
faglia have you seen this video?



Looks like it is blocked in the US darn it.
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage


Offline andreguidon

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 1169
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Sao Paulo
  • Hot WFO always !!!
    • www.andreguidon.com
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #84 on: February 15, 2013, 03:54:15 PM »
Looks like it is blocked in the US darn it.

really? thats weird, iam in Brazil, and everything is blocked here, and i can see it just fine...
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." Leonardo da Vinci

Offline TXCraig1

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 15424
  • Location: Houston, TX
    • Craig's Neapolitan Garage
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #85 on: February 15, 2013, 04:58:17 PM »
This is how it comes up for me. I'm not sure I've ever even seen this screen before.
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Jet_deck

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 3045
  • Location: Corpus Christi, Texas
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #86 on: February 15, 2013, 08:03:31 PM »
That is the exact screen I got this afternoon. EMI is a music company?
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends

Offline Tscarborough

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 3767
  • Location: Austin, TX
    • Pizza Anarchy
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #87 on: February 15, 2013, 09:51:15 PM »
Yeah, matched content, I have that problem with some videos, they are blocked in various countries, though not here (mine that is).

Offline shuboyje

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 1213
  • Location: Detroit
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #88 on: February 15, 2013, 10:26:36 PM »
Load the page through proxfree with a french IP and it works. 
-Jeff

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #89 on: February 16, 2013, 06:02:47 AM »
Thanks andre.
Havent seen it so thanks som good fotage about the vent cap.
Actually first time i found pizzamaking was on the beach of barra rdj.
I was so angry since the rio pizza tasted like crap. I intended to build a wfo on the beach there but then ifound braz and it was desent. Actually i spend at least 2 months a year in rio training bjj.

Offline andreguidon

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 1169
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Sao Paulo
  • Hot WFO always !!!
    • www.andreguidon.com
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #90 on: February 16, 2013, 07:45:55 AM »
Faglia i live in São Paulo, and i know that pizza in RJ is not as good as pizza in SP, but still, there is allot to learn here... you come to Brazil every year?
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." Leonardo da Vinci

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #91 on: February 17, 2013, 05:45:42 AM »
Yes at least i try to make time to come. Unfortunately i couldnt go this year because i did a knee surgery.
Mas este ano eu vou com certeza.
I have never been in sau paulo maby i should go? I get so lazy in Brazil I have never even visited the corcovado even though i have been in rio for at least 1 year in total:)
Actually my ultimate dream was to start pizzeria in Brazil but it is defenitely crazy business compared to swedish systems.


Offline andreguidon

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 1169
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Sao Paulo
  • Hot WFO always !!!
    • www.andreguidon.com
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #92 on: February 17, 2013, 05:56:03 AM »
you did not visit the corcovado? that is one amazing view!
São Paulo is totally different from Rio de Janeiro, there is no natural beauty like Rio, it more of a business/cultural city, but you eat much better here that in Rio. Its very hard for a foreigner to open a business... but not impossible!
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." Leonardo da Vinci

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #93 on: February 19, 2013, 02:31:34 PM »
Some updates on the build.
I made a sandform by cutting the right arch in a piece of plywood. I controled the hight at the top as well as the hight on the soldiers to get an even dome.

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #94 on: February 19, 2013, 02:33:19 PM »
The finished sandform.
By the way its my friend besmir who is on all pictures. For some reason he got all exited about the oven and now he is in charge of the mortar:)

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #95 on: February 19, 2013, 02:39:40 PM »
I was supposed to ask questions here before making the actual first course, but my friend pusshed me to it today so we did.
I had some questions about the positioning of the bricks that Tom did mention was important, and i was wondering more exactly what he meant?

When laying down the bricks we just put down the bricks onto the sandform as close to the angled soldiers and the brick next to it as possible. We placed home brew mortar on the lower half of the brick before putting it in place. Then we filled the rest of the gap with some more homebrew 3:1:1:1.

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #96 on: February 19, 2013, 02:41:31 PM »
One more picture of the first course. The sandform is just sand that we tapped down with our hands bit by bit. Then we used our tool to make it even. No water or portland or clay. Dont know but it seems to work.

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #97 on: February 19, 2013, 02:43:48 PM »
here is a video of how we pushed mortar into the gaps :-\
Only took 45 minutes to do almost the whole first course.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEJdnKrtxwk&feature=youtu.be

Offline kiwipete

  • Supporting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 251
  • Location: New Zealand
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #98 on: February 19, 2013, 02:52:08 PM »
Looking good!

Like the idea of doing video, which often tells/shows so much more than just pictures. Keep it up please!

Peter

Offline fagilia

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 394
Re: Finally a Swedish neapolitan WFO underway
« Reply #99 on: February 19, 2013, 02:55:49 PM »
The biggest concern i have is to even out the brick courses of the dome close to the door so it becomes totally circular.
Now it is not circular close to the door as you can see in the picture.
I am thinking to even out this circle in to steps so after the second course is finished the cicle should be almost perfect.
Any ideas if this is a good plan?


 

pizzapan