Author Topic: Home Run Inn "butter" crust (Read 1343 times)

netdirector · « **on:** January 03, 2013, 11:59:31 AM »

Hi All!

So I'm using the Home Run Inn recipe from here: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6112.msg52467.html#msg52467

but with the variation of using a stick of butter (4oz) in place of 4oz of oil. My measurements came out like this...

20oz King Arthur AP Flour
8oz Water
5oz Corn Oil (or butter)
.5oz ADY
.5oz Salt

although I did use Bouncer flour instead of AP flour... not sure how the extra gluten might impact the butter... but anyway... it all blended up nicely in the Kitchen Aid and I popped it into bags and into the refrigerator. Now, when I made Bubba's crust for New Year's Eve, the dough rose like gangbusters despite being in a freezing cold refrigerator. My HRI crust with butter... notsomuch. In fact, it's fairly hard... like the butter froze back up and is preventing any rising...

That said, do you think this will affect the final product? I'm actually going to make one tonight just to see if I horked up the whole thing. I really wanted a butter flavored, flaky crust... I thought substituting butter for oil might do the trick. I completely forgot that oil stays liquid when refrigerated... butter does not.

Any thoughts from the experts?

Garvey · « **Reply #1 on:** January 03, 2013, 03:35:44 PM »

When did you make this dough?

There may be a couple different things going on here. First off, how are you measuring--with a scale, I presume? Secondly, I don't think it's unusual for a high oil dough to retard yeast activity, according to the Dough Doctor (or was it someone else here?). The recipe you linked called for a warm rise, not a cold one, so that is another variable...in addition to the butter variable you introduced. And unless I'm looking at the wrong recipe you linked to, you also used less water (42 vs 40%) and less oil/fat (24 vs 20%). IOW, it's not really that recipe anymore at all, but perhaps you have stumbled upon something new and awesome. Take pix and report back!

But regarding the butter, was it softened first? Did it get well incorporated into the dough? If so, the butter shouldn't really re-form itself and harden: it would now be part of the dough. Since butter has a lower smoke point than other oils, I would suggest cooking this pizza at a slightly lower temperature for a bit longer. 400? 425? YMMV.

Cheers,
Garvey

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #2 on:** January 03, 2013, 03:41:53 PM »

Butter contains water so your hydration % is going to be a bit higher but I think you will be fine as long as it was incorporated well in your mix. Fermentation occurs with or without oil/butter but it has been my experience with these "big oil" doughs that you will not see the typical amount of rise as you would with the previous recipes you have been working with...give it a go netdirector,and post a pic or 2 if you can.
Bob

netdirector · « **Reply #3 on:** January 03, 2013, 03:42:43 PM »

Thank you, Garvey! Chicago Bob recommended I look up your posts... your Giordano's recipe looks epic and is on my list to try...

I melted the butter and added the oz of oil to bring it up to 5. I used a digital kitchen scale for measurements. I didn't realize I was off... I used a gram to ounce converter online.

I saw the warm rise... but that wouldn't negate a cold rise, would it? Can some recipes not be cold risen?

I just made the dough last night and checked in on it this morning. I pulled out one bag (I separated it into two) and I'll make one tonight. If it's something new and awesome, I'll take pictures and make more!

Garvey · « **Reply #4 on:** January 03, 2013, 11:19:37 PM »

Thanks for the kind words.

The cold rise is fine: it simply keeps the yeast in check. Like Bob has experienced, I've never had big yeast action in a high fat dough. I'm guessing it will all be fine.

I hope you have stumbled upon a good recipe there! I have been disappointed in my HRI trials, so I'm interested to see if you've found the key.

Cheers,
Garvey

netdirector · « **Reply #5 on:** January 04, 2013, 10:28:23 AM »

Well, my son neglected to pull the dough out of the refrigerator (teenagers!) so it only had about an hour to warm up... but I made it anyway!

The dough was moist, and quite honestly finger lickin' good! Can't beat the flavor of butter. I pressed it out on a cookie sheet, and there was no sticking, and no ripping. Very easy to handle and press out. I added my sauce and then a heavy topping layer of sausage, onions, green pepper, and mushroom. A Chicago deluxe.

Then a heavy layer of shredded mozzarella. I'm less that satisfied with the Roundy's whole milk mozzarella, but it works until I find some Polly-O that isn't $7 a lb. I also used my Tuscan seasoning grinder (which I use when making a parmesan/olive oil dipping sauce) on top, for a bit of flavor.

I cooked at 450 for about 10min... the crust looked fine but the cheese wasn't brown enough, so I upped it to 500 for a few minutes more. And voila! Pizza time!

Now about the crust... it was definitely buttery. Very yummy. Not quite as flaky as HRI, but the pieces in the middle (I cut into squares) were absolutely spot on flavor wise and consistency wise. I went a bit too heavy on the toppings as compared to HRI... I think I'll try a straight up pepperoni tonight... but I really enjoyed the middle pieces immensely. The only problem, with a typical HRI I always prefer the end pieces cause the crust is so good I could eat it plain! Although my crust was good... it's still missing a flavor... I still taste flour. Maybe it's the bouncer and I need to use the KAAP.

All in all though... this makes an incredible Chicago thin crust. I'm pretty happy with it. I'd have to try the original recipe to compare, but I really like the flavor that the butter imparts.

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #6 on:** January 04, 2013, 10:58:03 AM »

Thanks for the pic netdirector...pie looks good but since we're discussing HRI crust so much here did you by chance take a crumb shot you could share with us...really interested in how this turned out. Maybe next one?
Bob

netdirector · « **Reply #7 on:** January 04, 2013, 11:30:31 AM »

Definitely the next one. I'm curious to see how "aging" it another day in fridge affects things. Plus I want it to warm up fully. And then use less toppings... lol...

I wish I had leftovers! Darn teenagers! They're like locusts or something...

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #8 on:** January 04, 2013, 12:27:37 PM »

Yep, they sure do get pretty hungry.

I think you will see a difference on your next one that you allow the dough to rest/warm up longer....good luck!

Garvey · « **Reply #9 on:** January 04, 2013, 02:15:51 PM »

Quote from: netdirector on January 04, 2013, 10:28:23 AM

heavy topping layer of sausage, onions, green pepper, and mushroom.

Ah, a "garden" pizza, Chicago style. Sausage, plus a bunch of other stuff.

Looks and sounds like a great pie! I know what you mean about the crust of HRI. There is a certain flakiness to it like no other. A yeasty, oily, crunchy, flaky, crackery goodness.

Cheers,
Garvey

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #10 on:** January 04, 2013, 02:26:54 PM »

Quote from: netdirector on January 04, 2013, 10:28:23 AM

sausage, onions, green pepper, and mushroom. A Chicago deluxe.

Don't know if you were jus making that up but I have actually seen that term used on many a Chicago pizza joints menues....a good 'ol "Deluxe". S,M,ON,GP....a little sum'in for when you want a change from straight sausage.

netdirector · « **Reply #11 on:** January 04, 2013, 03:07:46 PM »

I can't take credit for it... I've seen it as well. Throw on some pepperoni and you've got yourself a "Supreme"...

I love the sauté I did. First went the onions and green peppers with some butter and olive oil, and then about 5 minutes later I added the mushrooms. Just grabbed it by the handful (after it cooled a bit) and spread it atop the pizza. Mmmmmmmmm...

mrmojo1 · « **Reply #12 on:** January 04, 2013, 09:12:30 PM »

Nice going on that HRI pie!!! i want some!!! love hearing about your trials!! thanks for the pic!!

yeah, i think i know what you are talkin about with that buttery flakiness. i also remember it was dense? it had a good bite to it? sadly ive had more frozen HRI pizzas than restaurant pies by orders of magnitude....but i still loved them.. the only pizza i every microwaved from frozen and i still freaking loved it. that crust, that sweet sauce and excellent sausage!!! i remember fondly my dad if he was home would always make me share it!!! 4 little slices, 2 each....but it was worth it. after a while he didnt have to ask or remind. i loved sharin it with him!!! had rosattis down in surpise AZ with him around xmas! it was awesome!!!

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #13 on:** January 04, 2013, 09:28:07 PM »

Quote from: mrmojo1 on January 04, 2013, 09:12:30 PM

Nice going on that HRI pie!!! i want some!!! love hearing about your trials!! thanks for the pic!!

yeah, i think i know what you are talkin about with that buttery flakiness. i also remember it was dense? it had a good bite to it? sadly ive had more frozen HRI pizzas than restaurant pies by orders of magnitude....but i still loved them.. the only pizza i every microwaved from frozen and i still freaking loved it. that crust, that sweet sauce and excellent sausage!!! i remember fondly my dad if he was home would always make me share it!!! 4 little slices, 2 each....but it was worth it. after a while he didnt have to ask or remind. i loved sharin it with him!!! had rosattis down in surpise AZ with him around xmas! it was awesome!!!

Dense....good descriptive word for HRI crust mojo. It is something special!
As my German girlfriend says...it is "ribs sticking food".
Luvs me some 31st.Street pie man!

netdirector · « **Reply #14 on:** January 05, 2013, 04:22:49 PM »

MMMMMMM... MUCH BETTER... leaving the dough to warm made it easier to work with and a more consistent crust. Albeit, I *really* need to get either a pizza stone or quarry tiles... next on my list!

Crust was flakier this time around, and a nice mixture between a crunchy bottom and doughy middle... I think I want to try an all-purpose flour next, and of course a better mozzarella, althought this time around I made a pepperoni with a light topping of cheddar atop a mozzarella/provolone mix.

The kitchen SMELLED exactly like Home Run Inn. The taste... extremely close. Probably too much cheese, but I like me my cheese!

I really love this crust. The butter is delicious and there's not so much crust as to overwhelm the other flavors. I'm also going to try just making it without cold fermenting this time... just to see if it rises.

Quote

that sweet sauce and excellent sausage!!!

OMG... yesssssssss... no idea yet how to recreate the HRI sausage, but it is delicious. Pretty sure it's got fennel.

Thank you all so much for the pointers and encouragement. If anyone wants to try my recipe and let me know where improvements could be made... I'm all ears!

And I have to apologize for the weird coloring of the pics... my kitchen at night is not the best place to take pics... and I didn't have time to PhotoShop!

mrmojo1 · « **Reply #15 on:** January 05, 2013, 10:02:55 PM »

nice pizza!!!! you are inspiring me to give makin a hri another try!!!

CDNpielover · « **Reply #16 on:** January 06, 2013, 02:44:47 AM »

Just curious -- does HRI actually use butter in the dough? I would expect oil or shortening before butter.

netdirector · « **Reply #17 on:** January 06, 2013, 11:09:17 AM »

well, they do offer a garlic/butter crust option... but i believe the traditional "butter" crust flavor is simply corn oil. i haven't tried solely corn oil *yet*, but i will be.

i love hri crust. and i love butter. i'm thinking about adding a tsp or 2 of garlic powder to the dough to see how that works. but so far... sooooooooo good...

Pete-zza · « **Reply #18 on:** January 06, 2013, 11:32:58 AM »

According to the Nutrition Facts given at the HRI website, the only fat used in the dough is corn oil.

Peter

CDNpielover · « **Reply #19 on:** January 07, 2013, 01:51:38 AM »

Thanks Pete!