Author Topic: My 24-hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?  (Read 195 times)

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Offline TurkeyOnRye

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My 24-hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« on: August 22, 2016, 11:55:03 PM »
My same-day dough is way more flavorful than the reserve that I use the next day. Shouldn't the dough benefit from fermentation as opposed to worsen? This is not a one-time phenomenon; the same-day dough is always more flavorful. Typically, when I remove it from the fridge, I let it rest at room temperature for about 20 minutes, then I press it into the baking sheet and throw a towel over it. Then I prep the ingredients (about 10 minutes) before it goes in the oven at 500F for 9 minutes.

3 C. Bob's Red Mill bread flour
1 C. 105F water
1 packet active dry yeast
1 tsp. kosher salt
1 tsp. honey
1 Tbsp. extra virgin olive oil

40 minute proof
Deflate
Ball out two portions
20 minute proof on both
Shape and bake one, refrigerate the other
« Last Edit: Today at 01:52:19 AM by TurkeyOnRye »

Offline tinroofrusted

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Re: My 48 hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« Reply #1 on: Yesterday at 12:50:41 AM »
My same-day dough is way more flavorful than the reserve that I use the next day. Shouldn't the dough benefit from fermentation as opposed to worsen? This is not a one-time phenomenon; the same-day dough is always more flavorful. Typically, when I remove it from the fridge, I let it rest at room temperature for about 20 minutes, then I press it into the baking sheet and throw a towel over it. Then I prep the ingredients (about 10 minutes) before it goes in the oven at 500F for 9 minutes.

3 C. Bob's Red Mill bread flour
1 C. 105F water
1 tsp. kosher salt
1 tsp. honey
1 Tbsp. extra virgin olive oil

40 minute proof
Deflate
Ball out two portions
20 minute proof on both
Shape and bake one, refrigerate the other
In my experience dough does become more flavorful when it's left overnight or longer in the fridge. Your taste might differ though. Forty minutes is a pretty short rise time so I'm guessing you use a lit of yeast (there's no yeast mentioned in your recipe).

You might try a different recipe and make up say four dough balls and leave the in the fridge for different times, say 1, 2, 3 and 4 days. 

I'd recommend trying this recipe for Pizzeria Scholls dough. It's really good dough:

http://doughgenerator.allsimbaseball9.com/recipe.php?recipe_id=8

Offline TurkeyOnRye

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Re: My 48 hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« Reply #2 on: Yesterday at 01:06:57 AM »
In my experience dough does become more flavorful when it's left overnight or longer in the fridge. Your taste might differ though. Forty minutes is a pretty short rise time so I'm guessing you use a lit of yeast (there's no yeast mentioned in your recipe).

You might try a different recipe and make up say four dough balls and leave the in the fridge for different times, say 1, 2, 3 and 4 days. 

I'd recommend trying this recipe for Pizzeria Scholls dough. It's really good dough:

http://doughgenerator.allsimbaseball9.com/recipe.php?recipe_id=8

Oops! Yes, there is one packet of ADY in this recipe. It never occurred to me to be a matter of subjectivity. The yeasty flavor is gone by the second day, and it just tastes flavorless. Like there's less flavor than before, not just different flavor.

Online Pete-zza

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Re: My 48 hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« Reply #3 on: Yesterday at 07:26:52 AM »
TurkeyOnRye,

An emergency dough with a lot of yeast can have a noticeably yeasty flavor. But a part of that yeast is used up during fermentation, resulting in a less yeasty flavor in the finished crust. Also, the natural byproducts of fermentation that contribute to flavor may be subdued and not noticeable on the palate after a single day of cold fermentation. Unfortunately, many high yeast doughs are not particularly suitable for multi-day cold fermentation applications.

Emergency doughs with high yeast usage can also lead to flavors that some people might describe as "off" flavors. But some people might actually like those flavors.

Peter

Offline TurkeyOnRye

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Re: My 48 hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« Reply #4 on: Yesterday at 01:53:04 PM »
TurkeyOnRye,

An emergency dough with a lot of yeast can have a noticeably yeasty flavor. But a part of that yeast is used up during fermentation, resulting in a less yeasty flavor in the finished crust. Also, the natural byproducts of fermentation that contribute to flavor may be subdued and not noticeable on the palate after a single day of cold fermentation. Unfortunately, many high yeast doughs are not particularly suitable for multi-day cold fermentation applications.

Emergency doughs with high yeast usage can also lead to flavors that some people might describe as "off" flavors. But some people might actually like those flavors.

Peter

I just noticed that I actually meant "24 hours." A next-day dough.

Well, that makes sense. The flavor is better the same day, but it is still not particularly complex in flavor. It just retains the yeasty quality.

Going on a 3-day ferment of Glutenboy's recipe. I'll let you guys know how that turns out on day 4.

Offline The Dough Doctor

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Re: My 48 hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« Reply #5 on: Yesterday at 02:07:09 PM »
Actually, most people don't particularly like a "yeast" flavor which is probably best described as that of old, wet newspapers :(
The flavors that most people describe as yeasty are actually those flavors derived from fermentation of the dough which intensify as the dough is allowed to ferment for longer periods of time. However, everyone may not like the flavor of fermentation so that would explain your personal preference for a dough with little or less fermentation. It's the same story with sourdough, some love it, some hate it, just a personal preference. The best thing about making pizzas for yourself is that you can make it the way YOU like it.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

Offline TurkeyOnRye

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Re: My 48 hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« Reply #6 on: Yesterday at 11:15:37 PM »
Actually, most people don't particularly like a "yeast" flavor which is probably best described as that of old, wet newspapers :(
The flavors that most people describe as yeasty are actually those flavors derived from fermentation of the dough which intensify as the dough is allowed to ferment for longer periods of time. However, everyone may not like the flavor of fermentation so that would explain your personal preference for a dough with little or less fermentation. It's the same story with sourdough, some love it, some hate it, just a personal preference. The best thing about making pizzas for yourself is that you can make it the way YOU like it.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

I wouldn't say I prefer a non-fermented dough to a fermented one. I would say, however, that I prefer the flavor of my same-day dough versus my 24-hour dough. That's because the 24-hour dough has almost completely lost its flavor! Still, the same-day dough is pretty mediocre in flavor and texture, which I have learned to accept as an inherent quality of emergency doughs.

I'd like to achieve the flavor and texture profile of some of the premium non-franchise pizza places I've tried, which almost certainly ferment their dough for multiple days, I'm guessing. I'd be impressed if it were possible to make a crust as bubbly/flavorful/tender etc. as theirs in a single day.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 11:21:47 PM by TurkeyOnRye »

Offline tinroofrusted

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Re: My 48 hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« Reply #7 on: Today at 01:22:05 AM »
I think you'll really like the flavors you get with the Glutenboy formula. You'll notice it uses a lot less yeast than your formula. 
 

Offline TurkeyOnRye

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Re: My 48 hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« Reply #8 on: Today at 01:47:17 AM »
I think you'll really like the flavors you get with the Glutenboy formula. You'll notice it uses a lot less yeast than your formula. 
 

Assuming I did it right. I might as well have eyeballed the amount of yeast I used, and made some guesses as to how long I should mix, because I did it by hand. I was really wishing for a KitchenAid mixer right then.  :P
« Last Edit: Today at 01:51:18 AM by TurkeyOnRye »

Offline Jersey Pie Boy

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Re: My 24-hour emergency dough is flavorless, WTH?
« Reply #9 on: Today at 06:24:57 AM »
Hey T-Rye,


You'll have an eye-opening result with the GB dough..very good stuff. Mixer? Sure, but you can do these doughs by hand, especially if you're not mixing a great amount of dough. 


PDX, right?  Get to Apizza Scholl's and/or Ken's. Then visit our new member Tom at Paper Bag Pizza..he does a great pie from mobile WFO at Tidbit food cart pod at 28th & Division.


Take a photo of your GB for us  :)


 

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