How to make dough with the ingredients I can get in the Philippines

[sammybotz]

Wow that's perfect. They have a plant close by:
"With two modern plants; one serving the Visayas and Mindanao"

I am in Mindanao, definitely give them a call tomorrow. Well, I will let my girlfriend call and speak their language first so they don't take advantage of the foreigner (me). Then when she gets prices I can take over.

Thank you so much Scott

[scott123]

Sweet.  While you're discussing their product lines, see if any of their flours are malted. Malted barley flour (aka diastatic malt), an additive in most American flours, is an important part of the NY style equation.

[sammybotz]

Got , will do. I never knew how involved the dough was in our old restaurant. My brother used to make it look so easy to make when I was just a kid. He made the pies and I pushed them out via cutting them, taking cash and answering phones.

Thanks again.

[sammybotz]

Hi Scott and everyone on Pizza Making,

I just wanted to let you know Scott that the last link you gave me had a distributor in my city for the flour which is unbelievable. Thanks for that link.

Another question please. I found a company here that builds ovens. I was wondering what I should ask for. My large pies are 16" so I figure with a 3' X 3' inside deck I can get 4 pies going at once. Then I want a dual deck oven. I also want dual temperature gauges and it will be gas.

Are the above inside oven dimensions okay?

What temperature is an optimal one but not unreasonable for a custom built gas pizza oven?

What type of material should I ask the inside deck be built with?

Any insulating factors I need to know about?


That's about it, sorry for all the questions and I'm almost there. Thanks again, Salvatore

[scott123]

Salvatore, that's fantastic news about the proximity of the distributor.

Custom built ovens are sketchy proposals. There are massive safety concerns when working with gas, and, even if those are addressed, ensuring good heat balance (top heat matching bottom), takes some major engineering know-how.

I would start off by reading this entire thread:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,19848.140.html

The information found there is far from complete, but it's a good jumping off point.

As far as the company you're looking at, I would either inquire as to whether or not schematics of the internal oven structure can be obtained and/or see if they'll let you take a look at an oven in person and take a boatload of photos. If you can post those schematics and/or those photos here, we should be able to give you a good idea of whether or not the thermodynamics are sound. In addition, find out as much as you can about the materials that they are using, especially for the hearth.

A custom-built oven may have an appealing price tag, but, at the end of the day, this may not be something that you can cut corners on.

[sammybotz]

I see, I will check in depth about that oven tomorrow I'm hoping.

What do you think about something like this ?

My other alternative is in the below pdf file. Hopefully the local large hardware store has the materials to build it or if not possible alternatives to whatever is specified on the below pdf file Instructions:
http://salvatores.org/pompeii_oven_plans2.0.pdf


Thanks for your response as always.

[scott123]

Salvatore, for New York style in a commercial setting, I'm not sure a WFO is viable. In order to accommodate 4 16 inch pies along with a fire, you'd be looking at upwards of a 50 inch oven, which will be a considerable undertaking. If you have access to very inexpensive hardwood, and craftsmen with considerable oven building experience, then perhaps this might be an option– perhaps, because of the size, a vaulted oven rather than a Pompeii, but if you're considering doing this yourself, I think an oven of this size is pretty ambitious.

The thread that I posted earlier involves a member in Burma. Burma is not the Philippines. You should have access to quality deck ovens. They won't be cheap, but, as I said before, an oven is not an area where you want to cut corners.

How about electric? Do you pay a lot for electricity? When you're dealing with obscure/unknown ovens, electric tends to be a bit safer than gas, and if selected carefully, can produce comparable results.

[sammybotz]

Hi Scott,

Sorry for the delay while I ponder all this information in my brain.

A 50 inch oven would be too large. Unfortunately there is a funds issuer also. I guess I could always have them build it to accommodate 2 pizza;s at a time instead of 4.

So down to a couple options now. A home oven which can cook one pie at a time and goes around 500 degrees total and/or a home built local oven they do here in Butuan City. I went yesterday and will get you pictures soon. There basically sheet metal boxes with insulation and use firebricks as the inside deck where the pizza goes. They use gas but there is no city gas lines here, it's the old fashion propane in a tank like a BBQ. Also I think they can build the hearth with sheet metal instead of firebrick. Hard to understand them as the language barrier, will bring my girl next time.

I shall get you some images also soon and post them online and see what you think. So it's kinda like starting out from nothing but it has been done before and I'm pretty confident. If worst comes to worst after some people I know get a bite of some really good pizza I'm sure I could secure a loan from them.

Oh about the electricity question, yes electric cost a small fortune over here for some reason so that's out of the question.

Anyways that's the news of the day and thank you as always for trying to help me in this new start-up business over here, Salvatore

[scott123]

Salvatore, I think it would help us help you if you could flesh out your plans a bit.

How soon do you plan on opening up shop? Are you planning on selling pizzas out of your club or a separate location? How many pizzas are you planning on selling on your peak days?

What kind of competition is there in your area?

If money is tight, and you're working with propane, you might want to consider a little black egg (LBE) or two:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,4753.0.html

When you reference the 500° oven, is this an oven you have at home already, or is it something you're considering purchasing? A 500° oven is far from ideal for New York style, but as long as there is a broiler/top element/top burner in the main oven compartment, you should be able to work with it. The first thing you'll want to do is to confirm how hot it can actually get. To do this, you'll need an IR thermometer:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21951.msg230464.html#msg230464

Before you go stone shopping, you'll want to see how hot the oven can get, as that will dictate the stone material that you'll require. Before you dive into a professional setting, I'd like to see you doing pies at home first.

[sammybotz]

My plan is to perfect the pizza from home before I even consider opening shop. And when I do open shop I will do it gradually meaning I can easily offer a free delivery service over here with the proper advertising right from my apartment (of course nobody will know my location at this point). My only competition is one "pizza hut", which is no competition. I found fresh mozzarella but have to pay for shipping from manila but its worth it. I perfected the sauce already so I got that covered. And the flour thanks to you.

I did not buy any ovens yet, I just figured since I have credit in a store here that sells home ovens, my girl could use that to perfect her desserts which will be part of the business and I could practice with that to taste something at this point.

The big picture is I do all this from home, perfect it all, then move into a new very large mall that is being built over here in approximately 6-8 months. At that time dinners will be added that is easy for me and it will go from pizza and desserts to a brick and mortar Italian Restaurant.

So I'm hoping my plan isn't too bad or far fetched. Also as previously stated I do know people with money over here but of course they would need to taste the product before any negotiations could take place. But I might not need that route. I would hope that after perfecting the pizza from home and getting some type of local built oven to start I could easily save up enough money within 3 months via the free delivery service to buy a professional oven, mixer and pizza prep unit.

I will make sure to get an oven thermometer and test the highest temperature the home and local built ovens will go. I do remember when I was just a kid that our pizza ovens in our restaurant only went up to like 600 degrees and we did like 3-400 pies just during dinner time on a Friday night. So even know we were on long island and not in the actual new york city I guess that counts as new york pizza.


Thank you for all your help and feedback as it's a big help, Salvatore

[sammybotz]

Maybe I could ask you a different question Scott please,

Let's forget about the term "New York Pizza" for now.

There are good shops here that work with welding torches that could pretty much make anything I ask them.

The local hardware store says they have fire bricks, granite, marble, and tiles. As far as the stone material nobody has it.

I would like a design that would make good tasting pizza using the materials I have available to me over here. Say just cooking (2) 16" Pizza's at a time. If there is a way to save on propane and still work that would be a plus I would think. Also I would assume we are going to be in the 550 degree temperature range with what I've described.

Also tailored to fresh mozzarella, the kind that only last about a week in your refrigerator and very soft and hard to slice. Kinda chewy and can hardly taste the salt. Tastes great on the chicken and eggplant parmigiana I made (future dishes for the restaurant in the mall).

So obviously making pizza is not my thing and thanks so much for teaching me. Should have paid attention a lot more when I was younger, oh well.

Thanks again and maybe we can tailor a different style of pizza for what I have available to me over here.

Can wait for your answer on this one

Thanks again, Salvatore