Author Topic: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG  (Read 10995 times)

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Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2014, 07:02:16 AM »
A relatively low hydration 7 day old dough (68%), topped with hand sliced pepperoni, w.milk mozz, mandolin sliced white onions and oregano post bake. For the sauce I used passata seasoned with minced garlic (lots!), marjoram, salt and sugar.

Sliced party style, this was a hit with the family.
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Offline dellavecchia

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #26 on: February 15, 2014, 07:10:21 AM »
That is stunningly beautiful. I don't think I have ever used a 7 day old dough before - is there a noticeable sourness?

Johh

Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #27 on: February 15, 2014, 07:52:04 AM »
Thanks John. I should have mentioned that I used IDY for this pie. No perceptible sourness - just a mildly complex, flavorful dough. Below is the formula I used. The 68% hydration is overall, including oil.

100% water
66% brazilian AP flour, Globo brand
2% brown sugar
1.8% salt, non iodized
2% EVOO
.17% IDY
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Offline jsaras

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #28 on: February 15, 2014, 10:11:32 AM »
That looks fantastic.  Having a variation that works with AP flour makes it a great recipe to share with friends who want to wade into the world of pizza making.
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Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #29 on: February 15, 2014, 10:18:58 AM »
That looks fantastic.  Having a variation that works with AP flour makes it a great recipe to share with friends who want to wade into the world of pizza making.

Thanks jsaras. I agree with you. Many here have achieved good results with AP/low protein flour.
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Online Pete-zza

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #30 on: February 15, 2014, 04:23:16 PM »
Sliced party style, this was a hit with the family.
Johnny,

I can see why. Those are screen saver photos but risky to have if you are hungry :-D. FYI, I put a link to the photos at Reply 5 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=7799.msg67003#msg67003.

Peter

Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #31 on: February 16, 2014, 04:50:44 AM »
Thanks Peter! Pepperoni and onions is a favorite topping combo of ours.
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Offline dmcavanagh

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #32 on: February 16, 2014, 02:35:16 PM »
Great looking pie @Johnny, I too am a fan of AP flour for thicker style pies. What was your oven temperature and cook time?
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Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #33 on: February 18, 2014, 07:55:26 PM »
Thank you! IIRC, approx 12 min bake at 300deg celsius.
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Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #34 on: February 18, 2014, 08:09:45 PM »
10 day old dough, from same batch as the last pie (15 feb).

A smaller doughball, so not as thick as the last. Still came out great. Topped with potato, EVOO, bacon, w.milk mozz and chives post bake, this was a delicious pizza, a definite standout.
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Offline jsaras

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #35 on: February 18, 2014, 09:05:36 PM »
Gorgeous.  How did you prepare the potatoes?

Since you seem tobbe the suthority on this pizza, have you tried this with just room temp fermentation? 

I tried the variation of Bonci's formulation that specified 10% nartural starter (which included overnight refrigeration) and I got no rise whatsoever.

Also, have you done a 100% Kamut flour version of this pizza.  I have some white Kamut flour (14% protein) that I think would be good with this.  If so, what hydration do you suggest for thatvflour?
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Offline dmcavanagh

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #36 on: February 19, 2014, 06:50:04 PM »
Thank you! IIRC, approx 12 min bake at 300deg celsius.

That's app. 575F, not many oven will go that high.
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Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #37 on: February 23, 2014, 06:30:32 PM »
Gorgeous.  How did you prepare the potatoes?

Since you seem tobbe the suthority on this pizza, have you tried this with just room temp fermentation? 

I tried the variation of Bonci's formulation that specified 10% nartural starter (which included overnight refrigeration) and I got no rise whatsoever.

Also, have you done a 100% Kamut flour version of this pizza.  I have some white Kamut flour (14% protein) that I think would be good with this.  If so, what hydration do you suggest for thatvflour?

Thanks jsaras for the compliment, but trust me, I'm no authority on this style of pie. Always learning... I have tried RT fermentation, usually in the range of 16-20 hours, but for the most part I use the fridge.

No, I haven't tried a 100% Kamut flour version. I'm unfamiliar with the characteristics of kamut flour.  What type of flour is it similar to?
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Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #38 on: February 23, 2014, 06:37:11 PM »
Wrapping up Sunday with a pizza...24 hour cold rise dough.

100% flour ( 15% sifted whole wheat flour, 85% AP flour)
80% water
2% EVOO
2% non iodized salt
.4% CY

Topped with EVOO, whole milk mozz, homemade pork sausage, red onions and escarole. Good combination!
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Offline jsaras

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #39 on: February 23, 2014, 06:59:58 PM »
The white Kamut khorosan flour I have is 14% protein.  It is an "ancient grain" flour and  some people compare it to spelt flour.  Apparently it's fairly common in Italy where they even have Kamut pizza competitions.  Unfortunately, I've yet to get a definitive operational hydration for it.  There's only one pizzeria on the US that uses it to make an excellent American-style pizza, but they will not part with that information.
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Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #40 on: February 23, 2014, 07:13:42 PM »
The white Kamut khorosan flour I have is 14% protein.  It is an "ancient grain" flour and  some people compare it to spelt flour.  Apparently it's fairly common in Italy where they even have Kamut pizza competitions.  Unfortunately, I've yet to get a definitive operational hydration for it.  There's only one pizzeria on the US that uses it to make an excellent American-style pizza, but they will not part with that information.

OK, considering the 14% protein content, I'd start at 70%, with subsequent bakes using 75% and 80% hydration.  I'll take the liberty to suggest a formula:

100% kamut flour
70% water
2% EVOO
2% salt
.5% compressed yeast

I'd incorporate a 100% hydrated poolish (for a couple hours), then slowly incorporate the remaining flour, followed by salt and lastly oil.  Give the dough a good 4/5 slap and folds (at 10 minute intervals) on the bench before allowing to bulk ferment for a couple hours. Divide, stretch & fold and ball, and place in the fridge for 24 to 72 hours.   Allow dough to come to room temp and triple in size before shaping to fit pan.
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Offline Gags

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #41 on: February 24, 2014, 02:18:53 PM »
Wrapping up Sunday with a pizza...24 hour cold rise dough.

100% flour ( 15% sifted whole wheat flour, 85% AP flour)
80% water
2% EVOO
2% non iodized salt
.4% CY

Topped with EVOO, whole milk mozz, homemade pork sausage, red onions and escarole. Good combination!

Johnny,

Your mastery of Pizzarium-style is inspiring and these look amazing (as usual)!
Great stuff and thanks for posting the pix!!

"I'd trade it all for just a little bit more"


Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #42 on: February 25, 2014, 07:46:43 PM »
Johnny,

Your mastery of Pizzarium-style is inspiring and these look amazing (as usual)!
Great stuff and thanks for posting the pix!!

Gags, thanks for the compliment! Far from mastery- but I'm enjoying the journey  ;)
Il miglior fabbro

Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #43 on: March 01, 2014, 08:04:14 AM »
Starting off my low-key Carnaval holiday on the right foot.

8 day old 80% hydrated dough (15% sifted whole wheat, 85% AP flour).  Baked naked, rested for a few minutes, sliced in half and filled with custardy scrambled eggs, deli-sliced turkey breast and escarole quickly sauteed in EVOO.
Il miglior fabbro

Offline norma427

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #44 on: March 01, 2014, 08:58:05 AM »
Starting off my low-key Carnaval holiday on the right foot.

8 day old 80% hydrated dough (15% sifted whole wheat, 85% AP flour).  Baked naked, rested for a few minutes, sliced in half and filled with custardy scrambled eggs, deli-sliced turkey breast and escarole quickly sauteed in EVOO.

Johnny,

Looks delicious!   :drool:

Norma

Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #45 on: March 01, 2014, 09:04:57 AM »
Thanks Norma! I almost added some cream cheese as well, but ditched the thought, thinking it might have been a little too busy. It was a good breakfast.
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Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #46 on: March 24, 2014, 08:41:48 PM »
This was a 73% hydration dough. I incorporated a 4 hour long autolyse, and I don't think I'll be doing that again :o. The dough was extremely slack and I had real difficulty in developing the dough strength (upwards of 10 stretch and folds, spread out over the first couple hours, with a couple S&F's performed on the cold refridgerated dough. Diminished returns with extended autolyse? Anybody else who's experimented with an extended autolyse notice this?

3% sourdough starter (maintained at around 90-95% hydration, fed with a mixture of whole wheat and rye flour), 2% salt, no oil. Dough made using 9.8% AP flour (Vilma brand).

Topped with tomato sauce (Mutti tomatoes with minced garlic and marjoram) and parbaked, then laid on the w.milk mozz, mushrooms, onions and strips of ham rubbed in sweet paprika and EVOO. Despite the hard work, this pie came out good - so in the end it was worth it.

Il miglior fabbro

Offline jsaras

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #47 on: March 24, 2014, 09:00:05 PM »
Your dough "mistakes" are better than most people's successes.
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Offline Johnny the Gent

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #48 on: March 25, 2014, 07:46:03 PM »
Thanks jsaras. In the future I'll probably stick to a 1:30 hr autolyse max. I'm just glad that I didn't give up on the dough, that would have been a waste.  ;)
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Online Pete-zza

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Re: Pizzarium style pizzas made with AP flour supplemented with VWG
« Reply #49 on: March 25, 2014, 08:34:57 PM »
In the future I'll probably stick to a 1:30 hr autolyse max. I'm just glad that I didn't give up on the dough, that would have been a waste.  ;)
J,

I have long been curious about the "best" or "most desirable" length of autolyse rest periods, especially since the duration is a question that properly comes up from time to time. We have had members use as little as ten minutes to overnight for pizza dough. But, in the bread world, autolyse periods tend to be quite short, especially in relation to the amount of dough made. I examined this facet for several dough recipes in Professor Calvel's book The Taste of Bread given that he was the "father" of the autolyse method as applied to French bread. For my findings, see Reply 15 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=3220.msg74624;topicseen#msg74624. As I have noted before, autolyse is one of those things where people conclude that if a little is good, then using much more must be a lot better.

Peter