Author Topic: Finally Home and Making pies  (Read 8707 times)

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scott123

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #50 on: May 31, 2013, 06:03:51 PM »
Sharlene, you're welcome for the suggestion. I am happy that it worked out well for you and that you've been able to keep up with Giulio so that we can be informed of his new enterprise.

I experienced this during my training with Roberto. It was impossible for him not to answer the incessant phone calls, computer work, and inevitable interactions with staff when he was at his work place, rather than focusing on the actual training. Roberto is a very talented pizza maker but I think the distractions that take place in a pizzeria took away the value of a (very) costly training for me.

Giulio has the right idea of  designating an area separate from the business, and yet, still give the students the opportunity to experience real setting by going downstairs to the pizzeria and observing.  He spoke of bringing one of his long-time colleague to assist him in teaching the class, and even mentioned of working together with Roberto, perhaps. Though he didn't go into much detail about that.

Giulio is VPN, Robert is APN (his own organization).  These are competing groups, and, as far as I know, they're not that friendly with each other.  I don't think Roberto would ever trashtalk Giulio (or vice versa), but I think teaching together might stress Giulio's relationship with his parent organization. At least, I think that might be the case.

As far as Roberto being busy during your training, in all fairness, at the time, he was part owner of 3 pizzerias, and was actively running 2, one of which was relatively new.  I think it's also worth mentioning, that, within the hierarchy of the NY pizza scene, Keste is royalty while Forcella is a bit of an upstart.  It sounds a lot like you received exponentially more knowledge from Giulio than Roberto, but, for someone looking for a better sounding resume, a distracted and expensive Roberto might be a bit more valuable than an attentive Giulio.  Roberto should definitely have known his limitations and not offered to train you, but there are other factors in play than just transferring of knowledge. I liked Forcella quite a bit and I think it's prospects are great, but, at the time of your training, Roberto was a bit of a rock star.

Quote
All types of pizza will be taught including the pizza al metro, according to Giulio.

Does this mean that he's teaching NY style? I have the utmost respect for Giulio as a Neapolitan pizza maker and teacher, but if he's teaching NY, he and I are going to have a problem  ;D



scott123

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #51 on: May 31, 2013, 06:25:28 PM »
I just re-read your blog entry, Sharlene and noticed this [bold mine]:

Quote
In collaboration with the Associazione Pizzaiuoli Napoletani President Sergio Miccu, and the sponsor of Caputo Flour, the new Pizza Academy will open to pizza professionals as well as home baker chefs.

Apparently Giulio has defected to the APN!  This is huge. No wonder why he's talking about working with Roberto. With Giulio in the APN, that leaves very little teaching talent in the VPN.  They just lost their, imo, only start player. This bodes incredibly poorly for the VPN- at least, domestically.

Sharlene, can you get any inside information as to the motivation behind Giulio's decision?  This move had to be pretty recent.  The VPN still lists him as 'Inspector and Master Pizzaiolo Teacher' on their website.

http://americas.pizzanapoletana.org/aboutus.php

Offline CopperTop

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #52 on: June 01, 2013, 01:20:06 AM »
CopperTop,

I really enjoyed your latest blog post on the One-on-One training with Giulio Adriani of Forcella.   You did a great job!  :chef:

Norma
Thanks, Norma

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #53 on: June 01, 2013, 01:40:34 AM »
Roberto should definitely have known his limitations and not offered to train you, but there are other factors in play than just transferring of knowledge. I liked Forcella quite a bit and I think it's prospects are great, but, at the time of your training, Roberto was a bit of a rock star.

Does this mean that he's teaching NY style? I have the utmost respect for Giulio as a Neapolitan pizza maker and teacher, but if he's teaching NY, he and I are going to have a problem  ;D

Bingo. His daughter and Antonio are out of the country, and he's trying to run two pizzerias on his own.  He should have cancelled our training. I trained with him in the first part of May, and I cut my class short. i am hoping to finish up in August, hopefully he will be less distracted. A rock star? No sure what you mean...

I think Giulio will only be teaching Neapolitan, Pizza al Metro, and the likes.

scott123

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #54 on: June 01, 2013, 02:00:10 AM »
A rock star? No sure what you mean...

Obsessives are familiar with Giulio, but Roberto has national public acclaim. He's not Bianco, and he's probably not quite Mangieri, but he's pretty famous. I think time might be leveling the playing field, but, back then, Roberto probably had students that were more than happy just to be in his presence.

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #55 on: June 01, 2013, 02:55:20 AM »
I think time might be leveling the playing field, but, back then, Roberto probably had students that were more than happy just to be in his presence.
You are spot on.  You could not have said it better.  In the end of the day, marketing hype plays a huge role.

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Offline Chaze215

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #57 on: June 01, 2013, 02:45:11 PM »
Sharlene,

Would you be so kind as to recap the dough ball size and pizza diameter for each of the places you've studied Neapolitan pizza.

Thanks in advance,

Craig

I believe in her blog she stated the doughballs were 250 grams, but didn't mention the pizza diameter.
Chaz

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #58 on: June 01, 2013, 11:37:05 PM »
I believe in her blog she stated the doughballs were 250 grams, but didn't mention the pizza diameter.

Thanks for the reminder. Sorry I overlooked the question, Craig.  The recipe/workflow posted here is for 10 dough balls, at 250 grams.  About 10 inches in diameter.
I reviewed the videos I took during my training with Giulio, and he discussed portioning between 250-285 grams, in that range depending personal preference.  He helped me with a recipe that would work making Neapolitan pizzas at home.  During the training in Forcella, we were stretching the dough to fit a 13 inch metal peel. The dough I used were already pre-made, but I think they were around 260 grams.

I picked up some white plates from Kmart that measured 14 inches. These are the same plates shown in this post.  I balled the dough shown at 260 grams, looks like it's about 12 inches in diameter on the  14 inch white plate. (picture 1)

During my training with Roberto, the other student and I were balling dough balls in the range of 258-262.  Mostly 260 grams. About 150 balls, using an entire bag of Caputo flour. I remembered being challenged in twirling the pizzas while in the oven since I was stretching the dough wider than what I was used to.  I say we were stretching them to 13 inches in diameter. (picture 2)

This week, I will focus on 260 grams with a 13 diameter.  Weather is suppose to cool down to mid-70s this week. Hope this is helpful.


scott123

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #59 on: June 01, 2013, 11:57:37 PM »
Speaking of overlooked questions  ;D Sharlene, please, if you get a chance to talk to Giulio, ask him about the move from VPN to APN.

This is earth shattering news.  This is for pizza what Lebron James's move to Miami was for basketball- except extremely positive, if you're an APN fan.

Offline Serpentelli

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #60 on: June 02, 2013, 07:18:19 AM »
(picture 2)


Sharlene,

Are those "practice pizzas" in the second picture? I'm curious as to how many of those were made, if that's what they are, and whether that's part of the typical "training process"with Roberto and/or Giulio ?

Thanks,

John K
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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #61 on: June 02, 2013, 10:16:03 AM »
Hope this is helpful.

Yes, very much. Thank you.

I've been using 270g for 13" pies, and I was curious how I compared.
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Offline CopperTop

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #62 on: June 02, 2013, 04:43:45 PM »
Sharlene,

Are those "practice pizzas" in the second picture? I'm curious as to how many of those were made, if that's what they are, and whether that's part of the typical "training process"with Roberto and/or Giulio ?

Thanks,

John K

Yes, John K.  Practice pizzas taken during my training with Roberto. This was taken either on Day 5&6 ...for two days,the other student opened the dough while I managed the oven.  Spending the day with Giulio accelerated my oven management skills that even Roberto was shocked when he watched me cook the first pizza and asked if I had worked before in a pizzeria.  We spent two hours doing this. The plan was to switch the next day, i would open the dough, and the other student would manage the oven.  i just couldnt bear another day... i think the 10 days was too long for me.   ??? I did the same practice pizzas with Giulio... First, making one pizza- opening the dough and then cooking it.  Then, two pizzas at once.

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #63 on: June 02, 2013, 04:51:33 PM »
Yes, very much. Thank you.

I've been using 270g for 13" pies, and I was curious how I compared.

I will have to practice unloading the 260-270 g... I think I'm not giving enough of a quick jerk that I'm elongating the diameter, therefore, not retaining the round shape.

Thought of you when I stepped into Motorino the other night.  I remembered you liking the Brussels Sprouts.  We just finished dinner at Frank's, on our way to the movies when we stumbled upon Motorino.  Chatted with Charley, the GM who was really friendly answering all my questions. Will be sure to return and try the Brussels Sprouts in Aug.

Read your postings on the Calabrian chillies, so my radar has been on them and been picking up jars in our trips. Will be trying your recipe on making the paste from the whole peppers.  Thank you.

scott123

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #64 on: June 02, 2013, 05:14:59 PM »
The plan was to switch the next day, i would open the dough, and the other student would manage the oven.  i just couldnt bear another day... i think the 10 days was too long for me.   ??? I did the same practice pizzas with Giulio... First, making one pizza- opening the dough and then cooking it.  Then, two pizzas at once.

This is a big part of why I'm such a big advocate for webcam training.  There's certain aspects of training that lend themselves to training in person, but there's also a lot of repetitive tasks required in order to master a skill- a student shouldn't have to pay a teacher to stretch skins all day, or, for that matter, launch pies all day. With a webcam, the teacher can show them once or twice, make sure they're using the correct form and then leave them to do their repetition on their own. It's a lot more effective use of training resources- and dollars.

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #65 on: June 02, 2013, 05:36:20 PM »
I will have to practice unloading the 260-270 g... I think I'm not giving enough of a quick jerk that I'm elongating the diameter, therefore, not retaining the round shape.

What I find works best is to start the pie slightly oval with the long axis perpendicular to the direction you will pull the peel out from under it. When you do this, the slight stretching from pulling out the peel leaves it nice and round.

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Offline CopperTop

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #66 on: June 02, 2013, 05:58:05 PM »
This is a big part of why I'm such a big advocate for webcam training.  There's certain aspects of training that lend themselves to training in person, but there's also a lot of repetitive tasks required in order to master a skill- a student shouldn't have to pay a teacher to stretch skins all day, or, for that matter, launch pies all day. With a webcam, the teacher can show them once or twice, make sure they're using the correct form and then leave them to do their repetition on their own. It's a lot more effective use of training resources- and dollars.

Roberto does incorporate video in his training.  On Day 3, he set up his computer on a shelf above the pizza prep table.  The video showed Antonio Starita opening up dough, dressing the dough with tomatoes and cheese, about a 1-2 minute clip.  We got to watch that during the training...on Day 4, 5, and 6. Back in October, when I started my quest for learning how to make Neapolitan pizzas, I got to know Roberto's technique through his videos,  available YouTube, and that was free!!  I am hoping to complete the training in Aug. and hope that on Day 7-10, Roberto  will be more hands-ons.


Offline CopperTop

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #67 on: June 02, 2013, 05:58:28 PM »
What I find works best is to start the pie slightly oval with the long axis perpendicular to the direction you will pull the peel out from under it. When you do this, the slight stretching from pulling out the peel leaves it nice and round.
Thanks, I'll keep this in mind.

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #68 on: June 04, 2013, 06:41:56 PM »
This pies look amazing! I love that big cornicione you achieved!

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #69 on: June 11, 2013, 10:26:55 PM »
This pies look amazing! I love that big cornicione you achieved!
Thanks!!

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #70 on: June 13, 2013, 01:28:07 AM »
It's Official!  I have stepped over the line,  professed my love for Neapolitan pizza, and vow to share my passion to Central Virginia ( Charlottesville and Richmond).  I know, it's crazy, but i know you all understand.

Check out my pizza project, gone LIVE:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/bufalapizza/bringing-authentic-neapolitan-pizza-to-central-vir


Excited to see where this new adventure takes me.  Thanks for the great camaraderie and pizza support!!

Offline f.montoya

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #71 on: June 13, 2013, 05:55:54 AM »
It's Official!  I have stepped over the line,  professed my love for Neapolitan pizza, and vow to share my passion to Central Virginia ( Charlottesville and Richmond).  I know, it's crazy, but i know you all understand.

Check out my pizza project, gone LIVE:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/bufalapizza/bringing-authentic-neapolitan-pizza-to-central-vir


Excited to see where this new adventure takes me.  Thanks for the great camaraderie and pizza support!!

That is soooo awesome! I wish you the best of luck!!

Offline deb415611

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #72 on: June 13, 2013, 06:11:56 AM »
Congrats!   If I were still down there I'd be your customer.  Living in Montpelier is what started my own pizza making quest.

Best of luck with the business!

Deb
Deb

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #73 on: June 13, 2013, 08:05:59 AM »
It's Official!  I have stepped over the line,  professed my love for Neapolitan pizza, and vow to share my passion to Central Virginia ( Charlottesville and Richmond).  I know, it's crazy, but i know you all understand.

Check out my pizza project, gone LIVE:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/bufalapizza/bringing-authentic-neapolitan-pizza-to-central-vir


Excited to see where this new adventure takes me.  Thanks for the great camaraderie and pizza support!!

Sharlene,

That is great news. ;D  Best of luck and success in your new adventure!

Norma

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Re: Finally Home and Making pies
« Reply #74 on: June 13, 2013, 10:50:56 AM »
Good luck on your project...


 

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