Author Topic: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake  (Read 2274 times)

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Offline Camaro10

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Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« on: June 07, 2013, 07:06:58 PM »
I'm using Classico ground tomatoes while baking ny pies in my home oven. Before the bake my sauce is tasty both sweet and salty. After my back for some reason the sauce is so bland. I thought about adding more salt but to taste it would be salty.

28oz can

1tbsp basil
1tbsp evoo
1tsp pepper
1tsp salt
1tsp sugar

Maybe it's just me but the flavor I get before is so much stronger then after the bake.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2013, 08:31:22 AM by Camaro10 »


Offline norma427

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2013, 09:20:45 PM »
Gin,

You might want to look at what Tom Lehmann posted at Reply 165 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3735.msg237549.html#msg237549

I also did experiments with what was my regular pizza sauce awhile ago with the Great Value tomato products from Walmart for a comparsion.  If you want to see that experiment it is at Reply 2 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9744.msg85554.html#msg85554

I still microwave the garlic with olive oil and other herbs. 

November uses an extraction process with his ôRed November Pizza Sauce (#2) at Reply 7 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3735.msg32136.html#msg32136   I think you could use the use one of those methods to make your sauce more tasty after baking.

Norma
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Offline Camaro10

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2013, 08:41:09 AM »
Thanks Norma. I've read all the references you've sent me. Still can't figure out a reason, I do not cook my sauce in advance, I use oil, so I'm trying to pinpoint an exact reason. Maybe I need to add more salt but my sauce before it goes on the pie is already salty to taste.


Offline mkevenson

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2013, 09:18:03 AM »
Gin, if your sauce needs salt after the bake, perhaps the taste before the bake is misleading? I sprinkle a bit of salt on top of the sauce when dressing my pies, even tho the sauce tastes fine on it's own before bake. The MAGIC of cooking!
Do. An experiment next time, add a bit of salt to the pie as you dress it. You may like the result.


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Offline waltertore

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2013, 09:32:34 AM »
try going a lot lighter on the basil if it is dried.  Once a lot of herbs get added it dimishes the the tang of the tomato to my taste buds.  I don't  add any salt, pepper, or sugar.  If you taste the sauce right after you mix it all it will still retain most of the original tomato flavor but once it sits and or is cooked all the other stuff blends in.  The key is to find what works for you.  You can read volumes about what are the "best" practices but your taste buds should be the final word.   Keep experimenting.  Most people lack this quality.  They want to read a tried and true thing and reproduce it.  I prefer to experiment and find my own masterpiece :)   I use 7/11 tomatoes and for me they need no salt, sugar, or pepper.  I do add a bit of fresh crushed garlic, small amounts of dried basil, oregano, and olive oil.   I use less than a  tablespoon of basil in a 6 pound can and grate DOP Pecorino Romano into the sauce.  Walter
« Last Edit: June 08, 2013, 09:35:21 AM by waltertore »

Offline dmcavanagh

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2013, 09:43:02 AM »
I'm much like @waltertore, go easy on spices. You mentioned you're using Classico's, there is absolutely no reason you would need any sugar in those tomatoes, they are already sweet. Cheese contains a large amount of salt, so I never use salt in tomatoes. I like oregano in my NY style sauce and a little finely grated fresh garlic, but you have to find the balance that works for you. Basil can overpower sauce, i find that canned tomatoes with a basil leaf added are often too strong for my liking. I prefer to finish my pizza with fresh basil leaves added post bake. No magic formulas, you have to experiment and create your own.
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Offline Camaro10

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2013, 10:14:18 AM »
Thanks Walter maybe I will cut down on my basil and add Garlic. Figuring out how much fresh garlic is the problem. I could try garlic powder and give an exact tsp and start from there.

Offline jeff v

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2013, 10:49:12 AM »
Eating hot (temp) foods makes it harder to taste subtleties. Do you notice the same after the pizza cools? Also, have you considered how the sauce is competing with other flavors on the pizza?

This thread is a good indicator of the vast difference in personal taste. I for example always use salt in my sauce and sometimes sugar if needed. I also forgot there was such a thing as dried basil because think it tastes like...  :-X  :-D
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Offline JD

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #8 on: June 08, 2013, 02:22:53 PM »
I'm not sure how to link directly to my post, but on this thread http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,25419.0.html
 I had the exact same comments as you.

Am I the only one that isn't blown away by the Classico's? They taste really nice straight out of the can, but after cooking I feel these qualities vanish.

I keep it simple for NY style... uncooked sauce on the skin, a pinch of oregano, maybe salt & sugar depending on the taste out of the can. I've also had some disappointment with my Sunday gravy.


Glad to know I'm not alone. I'm going to try them again though now that tomatoes are coming into season.
Josh

Offline Camaro10

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2013, 02:43:48 PM »
Out of the can they taste good. Its after the bake, they almost taste like paste.


Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #10 on: June 08, 2013, 03:09:52 PM »
Its after the bake, they almost taste like paste.
Camaro10,

It doesn't have to follow that the Classico tomatoes will become pastelike after baking. That condition might follow if the pizza is baked too long, or it gets too much top heat, or the amount of the sauce is too little and it dries out. In other words, there may be reasons independent of the tomatoes themselves.

Peter

Offline dmcavanagh

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #11 on: June 08, 2013, 03:16:16 PM »
Are you using ground, crushed, or whole tomatoes, or perhaps the heavy puree or tomato sauce? Classico cans ALL these products in their Walmart line, and each one is different in taste and texture.
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Offline Camaro10

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #12 on: June 08, 2013, 03:42:38 PM »
I believe ground. You know over-baking did cross my mind but no other components of my pizza burn.

Offline dmcavanagh

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #13 on: June 08, 2013, 04:37:52 PM »
The ground are a little on the "thin" side, you may need to use more, and it may well be drying out during cooking. The crushed are chunkier and I prefer them over the ground. Sometimes the crushed will be a bite watery, I like to run then through some sort of strainer to get rid of a little of the excess liquid. If you don't find Classico's to your liking, give Sclafani crushed tomatoes a try. They are much thicker and taste great, but they aren't available at Walmart and they aren't on sale for a buck!
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Offline Camaro10

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #14 on: June 08, 2013, 04:52:26 PM »
I appologize, they are crushed I just checked. And yes I did get them on sale at walmart for a buck. I will just have to experiment and see what happens.

Offline dmcavanagh

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #15 on: June 08, 2013, 05:05:09 PM »
I take the Classico crushed and let the extra liquid grain off through a mesh like coffee filter. They can have a lot of excess moisture compared to the Sclafani's I mentioned above.
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Offline Glutenboy

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #16 on: June 09, 2013, 05:21:23 PM »
Please keep in mind that, unless you're using a rather salty topping,  the sauce is the vehicle that delivers most of the saltiness to the pie.  I always make my tomatoes saltier than they need to be when they're alone.  The amount is surprising. On the finished pie, it's perfect.
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Offline caymus

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #17 on: June 10, 2013, 05:18:22 PM »
The ground are a little on the "thin" side, you may need to use more, and it may well be drying out during cooking. The crushed are chunkier and I prefer them over the ground. Sometimes the crushed will be a bite watery, I like to run then through some sort of strainer to get rid of a little of the excess liquid. If you don't find Classico's to your liking, give Sclafani crushed tomatoes a try. They are much thicker and taste great, but they aren't available at Walmart and they aren't on sale for a buck!

Some Walmart's do carry Sclafani. Today they were $1.54.  This store did have whole peeled Classico for $1.00 but no crushed/ground

Regards

Offline gfgman

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2013, 11:59:46 AM »
Ditto on the Sclafani's.  I just tried them for the first time, and they are quite nice.  I can't get them locally, and normally use SMs, which also have a great strong, sweet tomato flavor, but are chunkier.  The Sclafani's were great right out of the can. I didn't have to do anything except add spice.  There are two different brands though.  The one packed by Don Pepino is the right one.
I use a small amount of fresh basil in my sauce, with a pinch of sugar and salt, and little dried garlic and oregano.  It works for me.  The only time I've had a sauce where the flavor went away or morphed into something I didn't like, there was olive oil in it.  So for me, I don't do oil. 
The other thing I started doing, because the SMs are so expensive, is only making enough sauce for whatever I'm making, such as a half pie, or small pie.  That way if I don't like the outcome, I haven't wrecked a whole can.  I can separate some out, taste it and decide what to do with it.  I freeze the rest and thaw it in the fridge whenever I need to use it.  It's been working for me. 
Your recipe sounds good.  I've tried the Walmart tomatoes, so I don't know what they taste like.  I tend to think that you get what you pay for, but the Sclafani
s are proof that a good sauce can be had without the $3.69 price tag of the SMs.     

Offline caymus

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Re: Flavor of sauce goes away after bake
« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2013, 06:50:51 PM »
.  There are two different brands though.  The one packed by Don Pepino is the right one.


The ones I just bought were Don Pepino. Are the packers regional?

Thanks


 

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