Author Topic: My Favorite Sauce Recipe  (Read 6632 times)

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Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #25 on: August 16, 2013, 09:22:05 PM »
Walter, that pepperoni pizza is a thing of beauty.  :drool:

Yeah, definitely.

Also, I didn't mean to indicate that I add any puree to the 7/11. When I said "with puree," I just meant to clarify that 7/11 ground tomatoes are packed in puree. It's not something you consciously notice, though (because it's a not remotely thick tomato product).

Now that I've taken the time to write this, I'm not sure exactly where (or if) I'd seen it written that 7/11 is packed in puree. In fact, I just looked at a 7/11 can, and it doesn't say "packed in puree" anywhere.

I guess the point is that 7/11 straight out of the can = good.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.


Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #26 on: August 16, 2013, 09:22:17 PM »
I have not used 7/11 tomatoes yet, but I do see them often here in NJ. In my 1st walk through Restaurant Depot, I noticed they carry 6 in 1(which I never had either). So,  those of you who had both, which do you prefer? As of this moment, I'm a Sclafani user  ;D
I like both a lot but give an edge to the acid added 7/11 product....great tang.


ps. "packed in puree" is consistent with whole tomatoes.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2013, 09:24:31 PM by Chicago Bob »
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Offline Chaze215

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #27 on: August 16, 2013, 09:50:19 PM »
Ryan, I will be curious how the 7/11 out of the can performs on you 4 minute bake.
Chaz

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #28 on: August 16, 2013, 11:53:00 PM »
I'll be curious if the NY style dough I made last night will even be usable by tomorrow. For some reason all my NY style dough (7 dough balls, from 3 different batches/3 different flours) fermented so fast that as early as noon-ish today, when I checked to make sure the dough balls weren't drying out or anything, they had already fermented so much that I considered them almost unusable. This is the first time I've ever had this problem (after thousands of pizzas), and my procedural changes with this dough should have had the opposite effect, because for the first time in my life I used almost entirely cold water (excluding about 30 g of warm water for each batch, to prove the ADY). Like always, I scaled and rounded the dough almost immediately after mixing, then refrigerated immediately. Also, my ADY percentage was only 0.6%, which usually makes a dough that's best after about 72 hours in the fridge.

I thought for a while that maybe this happened because I used a different brand of yeast than normal. I even took a look at the yeast jar to make sure I hadn't mistakenly bought IDY instead of ADY. But after having some time to think about it, I'm inclined to think the refrigerator just isn't doing its job. Here's why: I made three other styles of dough, and none of them show any signs of overfermenting. The one thing they all have in common is that they're all in a different refrigerator than the NY style dough.

So I made another batch of NY style dough tonight (2 dough balls), with 0.9% ADY, and put them in the same refrigerator as all the dough that hasn't done anything weird. Hopefully some of last night's dough will still be usable tomorrow. If it doesn't look good in the morning, I might re-ball some of the dough and give at least one of the overfermented dough balls a try. (I'm very anti-bulk-ferment and anti-re-ball with NY style, but this disaster may have presented me a good opportunity to open my mind a little, or at least experiment.)

Like you, I am curious to find out how the 7/11 will perform under those conditions, too. But that stuff is so good straight out of the can that I expect my pizzas to be considerably better than pizzas I've made lately with the 7/11 plus Full-Red. (Next question is whether the grill will cooperate with me.)

Yeah, Bob, there's definitely a bit of tang to these tomatoes. It seems to be a bit sweeter after baking, though, which I like.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline dmcavanagh

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #29 on: August 17, 2013, 12:25:10 AM »
I have not used 7/11 tomatoes yet, but I do see them often here in NJ. In my 1st walk through Restaurant Depot, I noticed they carry 6 in 1(which I never had either). So,  those of you who had both, which do you prefer? As of this moment, I'm a Sclafani user  ;D

IMHO, Sclafani blows away 7/11 and 6 in 1's!
Rest In Peace - November 1, 2014

scott123

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #30 on: August 17, 2013, 12:46:07 AM »
IMHO, Sclafani blows away 7/11 and 6 in 1's!

Ditto ;D

Embarassing story:  At the NH Tour on Wednesday, I called Sclafani's 'Scalfani's.' I forgot the name of my favorite tomato.  You know how the scientists are saying that people are getting dumber because we don't have to remember anything because it's all online?  Living proof *taking a bow*

Scalfani's *shaking my head*

Offline pythonic

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #31 on: August 17, 2013, 01:34:21 AM »
That's pretty much exactly how I feel, which is why I'll be making a change-up tomorrow.

Last night I made sort of a deep dish pizza out of scrap dough left over from my first Giordano's attempt a few days ago, using a pretty simple 7/11 sauce:

28 oz of 7/11
1 tsp oregano
1 tsp basil (or maybe 1/2 tsp)
1 tsp crushed red pepper

This sauce didn't taste very good when I tried to clone Giordano's (due to the 35-minute bake), but it tasted awesome on the scrap dough "deep dish" pizza (23-minute bake). So I can't wait to find out how 7/11 straight out of the can performs on my 4-minute NY pizzas (baked in the grill) tomorrow.


Giordanos uses 6-1 sauce.
If you can dodge a wrench you can dodge a ball.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #32 on: August 17, 2013, 07:56:14 AM »
Giordanos uses 6-1 sauce.

Yeah, well I have a case of 7/11, so 7/11 it will be for most of my pizzas for a while. (I'm even gonna use 7/11 on Malnati's style today because my coarsely chopped Alta Cucinas got moldy. Besides, Alta Cucina is not really right for Malnati's style anyway.) I also have a can of Tomato Magic, which is I guess is the equivalent of the 6 IN 1 variety Giordano's uses (without peels, right?). I've never even had Giordano's, and I've only attempted to clone it once so far, so I'm not too worried about all the little details quite yet.

Man, I really want to know what "7/11" and "6 IN 1" mean. It must mean something, right? Anybody have a clue? Also, are Sclafani tomatoes ground like 7/11 and 6 IN 1, or are they whole tomatoes or what?

Time to go find out if Thursday's dough is still dough.

Thanks for the tip, Pythonic.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #33 on: August 17, 2013, 08:33:59 AM »
I think the "6in1" stands for 6 different uses in one product/can. I believe Peter knows what the #'s stand for...the 7/11 might have something to do with weights. Sorry, not much help.
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Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #34 on: August 17, 2013, 08:57:49 AM »
Well, after turning the fridge to its coldest setting yesterday, the potentially-overfermented NY style dough doesn't seem much worse than it did when I first noticed the problem, about 20 hours ago. Still, I re-balled one dough ball of each flour type (All Trumps bromated, All Trumps unbromated, Power Flour), then put them in a covered dough box, and will leave them in the dining room for the next several hours. (Hopefully that won't be too long.) Also, the two semi-emergency dough balls I made last night look really good.

Hopefully some people will show up for my party today. I got very little response from Facebook friends this time, so it looks like I might end up having to throw out a bunch of good dough tomorrow or Monday. I made enough dough for nine 14" NY style, two 15" Tommy's style (+1 with scraps), two 14" Malnati's style, and two 10" Giordano's style (+1 with scraps). That's enough dough for 17 or 18 pizzas. Right now I'm only expecting enough people to make about 5 or 6 pizzas.

Walter, you up to making a 45-minute (or hour) trip for a good cause? There's a link to party details on the "Are you from central Ohio" thread. If you do come, bring anyone you want. (Anyone else from central Ohio who may see this is welcome, as well.)
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Online waltertore

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #35 on: August 17, 2013, 10:20:48 AM »
Ryan:  thanks for the invite.  I will have to pass.  I hate driving.  I ride my bike in all weather except ice and snow.  We live in Granville and the bike trail takes me right to work from our street, to the grocery store, pharmacy, and village, with never hitting a car road.   I toured the world with my music for many years and I have done enough road miles to last the rest of my life and then some.  I go into Columbus probably a dozen times a year.  Sorry.  If there was a bike trail to your place I would take it.  I have been hit by a car and no longer do car roads.   I hope the party is a success.  Invite the neighbors.  That is always a good thing for community.  You are welcome out here anytime.  Walter

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #36 on: August 17, 2013, 11:51:09 AM »
I have been hit by a car and no longer do car roads.

I hear that. After the many thousands of miles I've walked on roads (opposing traffic), there is no way I'd go out and ride a bike with auto traffic coming from behind me. No way! Even though I always had a bit of visual warning whenever a driver turned their vehicle into a prospective death machine, as they occasionally veered toward me (as if the driver was asleep or something), I've had to run for my life a couple times, with a heavy backpack slowing me down, escaping certain death by inches.

Music?
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Online waltertore

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #37 on: August 17, 2013, 11:58:52 AM »
I hear that. After the many thousands of miles I've walked on roads (opposing traffic), there is no way I'd go out and ride a bike with auto traffic coming from behind me. No way! Even though I always had a bit of visual warning whenever a driver turned their vehicle into a prospective death machine, as they occasionally veered toward me (as if the driver was asleep or something), I've had to run for my life a couple times, with a heavy backpack slowing me down, escaping certain death by inches.

Music?


Ryan:  Sadly you know the reality of body vs. auto.........  Yes I played music for 25 years around the world, doing about 300 dates a year.  Here is a link to my music.  I am now a real 1 man band playing all the instruments at once.  I also am the only person in the world doing all words and music spontaneously.  I call it SPONTOBEAT.  I use to have actual musicians in my band when I was doing it full time.  Here is a link to my bio, about 5,000 songs.   Walter

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=157137

most current 200 songs streaming
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=157137&content=widgets

some photos of me in action and an old album from the early 80's recorded in Brussels. I based my band out of there for 2.5 years and learned a lot from the french bread maker on the corner.  His shop was way cool and I would hang out whenever I was not on the road. 

Offline PizzaEater101

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #38 on: August 17, 2013, 01:07:42 PM »
I know we are diverting a little from the original topic but I must add that the second picture shows a guitar and I have the same model and make as that. That's a Fender Jazzmaster. I have one and just got it fixed. It was broken for over a year and just got it fixed. I was just playing it yesterday.

Check it out -


Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #39 on: August 17, 2013, 01:19:47 PM »
Cool axe and case man.  8)
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Online waltertore

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #40 on: August 17, 2013, 01:23:32 PM »
nice guitar!  I got mine, a 1963, when I hit Austin.  I was using this old hollowbody guitar and a small solid state amp of some sort.  I was hired by the owner of the black cat lounge to play everynight.  It was on 6th street and had clubs on either side with shared brick walls.  The bands on either side were louder than us.  Then Will and Charlie Sexton walked in and asked to jam with me.  I had no idea who they were.  They were teens and once they got up the place got packed.  I knew nothing of the Austin scene except it opened its arms to my 1 of a kind approach to music.  Charlie was a member of the Arc Angels and has been Dylans main guitarist for about 20 odd years now. Will and Charlie told me I needed a better rig and immediately set me up with a black faced fender pro reverb and the jazzmaster which Lonnie mack gave to Stevie Vaughn when they did their album together.  Lonnie was one of Stevie's heros and rotting on the vine.  That album made him a big chunk of change and the guitar was one he used back in his hit days.  It was a permenant loaner.  When Stevie died I called Lonnie to get it back to him.  He said he dug my stuff and to keep it but never sell it.  Those were great days!  Walter

here is a link to some music pictures.  I was basically groomed to be a baker/pizza maker that got diverted with music.  Now I am back to pizza, music, and teaching school, all joined together as one thing.  A dream come true!

http://s6.photobucket.com/user/waltertore/library/#/user/waltertore/library/spontobeat?sort=3&page=1&_suid=1376760304091017278663469038236

http://s6.photobucket.com/user/waltertore/library/#/user/waltertore/library/?sort=3&page=1&_suid=137676044068009969258572633377

here is what I was playing and still have it.  This is from a gig in Belguim with my adopted father Louisiana Red.  He loved that guitar and always tried to get it from me but it was my first guitar and I still love it.   On a pizza note here is a house get together with Sean Carney and his band. They came by my studio to record a new album and I made pizzas for them. 

« Last Edit: August 17, 2013, 01:42:27 PM by waltertore »

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #41 on: August 17, 2013, 09:30:43 PM »
OK, so back on topic.

I made four 14" NY style pizzas today, all in the grill, all with bake times of 4 minutes or slightly less, all using 7/11 ground tomatoes straight out of the can for sauce.

Since I was so busy making these pizzas, in addition to two Tommy's style pizzas (laminated cracker), two stuffed pizzas, and one deep dish pizza, everything's a blur to me. All I know is that: 1) All the pizza is gone except for 3/8 of the second stuffed pizza; 2) People seemed very pleased with the plain 7/11 sauce; and 3) Although everything's a blur to me, I'm pretty sure I was not let down by the plain 7/11 sauce.

Also, I used each of the three re-balled pieces of dough (which I think I mentioned earlier), and I'd say I was surprisingly satisfied with the results. One big exception, though, sorta: The re-balled All Trumps bromated dough was almost impossible to stretch (60% hydration + 1.58% oil). It was just like trying to stretch a tangled web of rubber bands. I spent probably 15 minutes trying to stretch that dough, and it just would not get any bigger after a certain point. However, I did like the pizza it produced. I wouldn't call it NY style, but it was very good nonetheless.

I still haven't had any kind of wow moment with either the All Trumps unbromated or the Power Flour. In fact, I remember one of them having a very odd taste today. (I'm pretty sure it was the AT unbromated.) And now that I've thought about it a little more, I remember my friend Lisa saying the AT unbromated pizza at my last party tasted weird, although I didn't notice any strange taste with that pizza.

I also used 7/11 straight out of the can for deep dish sauce. Even though 7/11 is not meant to be used for deep dish (mostly because of the tomato peels, I suppose), I thought it worked just fine on the deep dish pizza I baked today. I wouldn't use it in a pizzeria for deep dish, but I will have no problem using it again with deep dish pizzas for guests.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.


Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #42 on: August 18, 2013, 12:59:00 AM »
Also Walter, that's very cool.

I was once a pretty decent musician myself, but I've only dreamed about doing what you've done. After not playing my drums for nearly a decade, I recently started playing them again, as a form of physical therapy (mostly in hopes of strengthening my hip flexors so they'll more readily lift my feet), but also as mental exercise. Just a bass, snare, ride, hi hat, and a crash. I must admit that I'm a very bad drummer now, but I'm not sure how much of it is a lack of chops and how much is neurological. And sometimes I'm not bad, or maybe even kinda good. Strange feeling. Regardless, drumming clearly helps with my condition, and I should make an effort to do it more regularly.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Pauley

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #43 on: August 18, 2013, 02:29:47 AM »
Walter and Ryan,
Based on this thread, as well as a number of others, I am now leaning towards 7/11 sauce for use in a new pizza shop (small) I have been asked to assist in running. I've used a few different Stanislaus products before, 7/11s perhaps once. I have a recipe that was handed down to own family from a nearly 50-year old pizza/sub shop in OC, MD.
It calls for the addition of oregano, garlic powder, sugar, olive oil, crushed red peppers, salt and pepper to taste. I also like adding basil to the mix.
Based on your use with 7/11s, do you think it would need either the sugar or salt?

Online waltertore

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #44 on: August 18, 2013, 07:57:24 AM »
Thanks Ryan and keep up that drumming.  It is good for the body and soul.  Good drummers and bassists are the hardest instruments to keep filled in a band.  That is why when I quit playing full time I went back to my roots to a real time 1 man band.

Pauley:  IMO any food making experience is 100% personal.  I was raised in the NJ/NYC pizza culture so my influences are way deep there.  It is my benchmark so to speak but with my pies I make them to what I like.  Are they 100% authentic to that style pie?  I have no idea because within that style there are tons of variations with sauce, cheese, toppings, bake temp, dough.  I put a bit of dried oregano/EVOO/DOP Romano/fresh crushed garlic.  The romano adds the salt and I taste no need for sugar. I like a tang vs. a sweet.  The exception with following your own taste buds is when one is trying to clone anothers recipe.  I would decide which way you want to go and start baking.  Have fun.  Walter

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #45 on: August 18, 2013, 12:05:07 PM »
Pauley, I don't think I'm really qualified to advise on what to include in sauce. My sauce philosophy has always been to use the best tomato product available and don't mess with it; keep it simple. Especially with NY style. For many years I preferred DOP San Marzanos for NY style sauce. But nowadays I want something with the right consistency straight out of the can, that requires less processing (or no processing), even if it sacrifices a little quality. And even though 7/11 tomatoes require considerably less work than any whole tomato, I'm not sure there is any noticeable drop in quality with the 7/11 tomatoes. Right now all I can say is the more I use 7/11, the more I like them. And so far I don't see any reason to add anything to them for NY style. But that may just be a reflection of my tastes.

Also, I didn't make or eat any pizza between January and July, nor did I think about pizza much during that time, so lately I've been experiencing pizza from a totally different perspective than I have in the past. But oddly, these several months of pizza inactivity seem to have refreshed my brain and somehow created pizza knowledge or insight that I didn't possess when I stopped making pizza in January. For example, I spent two years trying to clone Tommy's pizza (Columbus, Ohio cracker crust), and I came close but I was still pretty far off the mark. Then a couple weeks ago I tried again, having not made this kind of pizza in nearly a year, with at least four pretty major changes from my previous best-yet dough, and I nailed it.

I've learned a ton lately about sauce; things I never thought about since I started making pizza in 1997. For example, if you bake a stuffed pizza for 35 minutes at 450 with a pretty simple sauce (7/11 with a hint of oregano, basil, and crushed red pepper), you really taste the oregano, and the tomatoes end up tasting very cooked. But if you use the same sauce on a deep dish baked for 23 minutes at 450, it's a totally different experience: fresh tomato taste and no heavy oregano presence.

Since I've learned so much about sauce lately, it stands to reason that I'll continue learning. And if I ever deem myself qualified to answer the questions you asked, I'll answer them to the best of my ability. But right now I don't think I am qualified.

I guess the hard part sometimes, for us home pizzamakers, is just being able to acquire the ingredients we'd like to try without having to buy 40 lbs of it. Fortunately for me, I had an accidental conversation with the guy who does all the ordering for an Italian specialty shop that carries a very wide variety of canned tomato products (including Stanislaus, Escalon, and Redpack products). Since I didn't see 7/11 on the shelves, I asked him if they ever carry it. He said no, but he said he'd order some. When it arrived, I bought two cans. After trying it, I was impressed enough that I went to a distributor and bought a whole case. (The case only cost $25.)

In an attempt to answer your question: I don't feel any need to add salt to 7/11, and although I don't like adding sugar to sauce, I can see how adding some sugar might make 7/11 more appealing to American taste buds.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline PizzaEater101

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Re: My Favorite Sauce Recipe
« Reply #46 on: November 14, 2013, 03:10:45 PM »
Bought the last Alta Cucina at Costco Business today. Costco stopped selling many of the tomato products it used to sell, including Alta Cucina. I have enough to use from my last can but the issue is that they stopped, so I did buy the last can today so I can use it when my current can is used up. I love these tomatoes they work great for what I do. Too bad Costco stopped.

I can see why because the employee said that many of the pizza related products were not selling very well so they had to discontinue. It makes sense because most pizza operators already have their own suppliers of products and don't need to go to Costco Business for pizza products.  It's usually the casual home pizza maker like me who buys this stuff at Costco. I can get 7/11 at Smart & Final though but I get better sauce made up by using whole tomatoes especially Alta Cucina, so the 7/11 will be my last resort. I might just end up buying 28 OZ cans of DiNapoli which is very good too.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2013, 03:12:36 PM by PizzaEater101 »