Author Topic: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments  (Read 35519 times)

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Offline zymurgymaster

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #40 on: August 09, 2013, 06:40:01 PM »
red kiosk,

I would love to have that template....

RED


Offline red kiosk

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #41 on: August 09, 2013, 06:43:59 PM »
red kiosk,

I would love to have that template....

RED

Ok, that was quick! :o I'll scan it this weekend and try to get it up by Sunday. Take care!

Jim
The pathologically precise are annoying, but right!

Online Chicago Bob

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #42 on: August 10, 2013, 01:49:35 AM »


I do think there may be merit to red kiosk's "scooped up" argument suggesting that more heat flows as the stone height increases.


With all do respect to Red, I just don't think I can get behind that argument.

 This oven is built too "loose" and with much varying degrees of tolerances. Lets take a look at my first pic. With Reds glow bar removed it is easier to see just how much this thing leaks and that leakage continues all the way around the perimeter of the heat shield. Now, with so many channels for the rising heat to travel I don't see; even with burner directly under turntable, the potential for this platter to perform a "squeeze" effect of the flame against the opposing heat shield, thereby increasing velocity of flame and subsequent upper chamber heat increase.

Looking at pic #2(thank you communist,and wish you would post your tech here cause good stuff gets lost over there) doesn't it become obvious, eazzy peasy if you will, that this is all just a matter of burner psi and deflection off of upper stone. I almost fear to think of what a beast this grill would be if a small strip of material was fitted and seam welded, to close the gap, between the bottom leading edge of the heat shield and the exterior panel.  Momma Mia!  :o

Anyway that's jus my $.02 worth....or should I say; "The Theory of Bob" !  >:D
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Offline Tampa

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #43 on: August 10, 2013, 09:26:03 AM »
Quote
With Reds glow bar removed it is easier to see just how much this thing leaks
Bob, I don't see how the first picture shows leakage.  Pls explain.  I do agree with your seam weld idea, but that changes the manufacturability for BS.


Quote
red kiosk, I would love to have that template
Great idea, Red.  I'll hold off posting rustic so you won't have competition  ;D

Online Chicago Bob

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #44 on: August 10, 2013, 09:53:51 AM »
The entire heat shield, along it's bottom edge while sitting in it's U brackets allows heat to go 2 ways...either into cooking chamber or up behind it into outer grill area. The pic isn't the greatest but my red marker line that I drew in is directly over where the burner is blasting and I'm saying that with all that leak/blow by there is no structure to force "pressure" anywhere. The flame just comes up, bounces off ceiling and, of course, the higher you stick the platter up in there the more charing you will have.
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Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #45 on: August 10, 2013, 10:03:51 AM »
Bob I would estimate 90% or more of the flame stays within the shield.  That flame is funneled as it rises because the shape of the shield.  There is some concentration effect going on there.  Just as how the chauflector works.  when you bend or funnel the heat and flame you can concentrate its' effect.  Regardless of what is causing the crust to brown,  it browns quicker as we decrease the gap between the 2 stones (or increase the gap between the steel plate and the metal lip).

Offline red kiosk

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #46 on: August 10, 2013, 10:29:11 AM »
Yep, the BS is quite loosey-goosey when it comes to keeping the heat in the cooking chamber. Actually, that small gap between the heat shield and the body is why I refrained from putting ceramic blanket insulation behind the heat shield. I feared that there might be some of the flame working it's way up there, contacting the insulation and causing it to release toxic particles.

Maybe this gap is a design feature of the BS. Since the probe of the front thermometer sits ABOVE the aluminum cover for the top stone, how else would they get enough heat up there to make it register anything?  :-D

Take care!

Jim
The pathologically precise are annoying, but right!

Online Chicago Bob

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #47 on: August 10, 2013, 10:48:16 AM »
Bob I would estimate 90% or more of the flame stays within the shield.  That flame is funneled as it rises because the shape of the shield.  There is some concentration effect going on there.  Just as how the chauflector works.  when you bend or funnel the heat and flame you can concentrate its' effect.  Regardless of what is causing the crust to brown,  it browns quicker as we decrease the gap between the 2 stones (or increase the gap between the steel plate and the metal lip).
Exactly, you have concentration not pressure/speed. And concentration slows down the heat path. Light bulb moment.  ;D
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Offline italdream

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #48 on: August 10, 2013, 11:13:51 AM »
Here's what happened in the Gap Test (adjusting the collar which sets the platter height).  Many thanks to Bobino for his contribution.

Setup notes Unmodified BS Setup
1.   Cold start (no topside radiant heat) then full flame on for 2 minutes 30 seconds.
2.   Rotisserie off
3.   00 Flour, docked, and skin slid into place on tinfoil
4.   1/8", 3/8", 5/8", & 7/8 Gap between the SS deck and steel cordierite tray.

Dave
Tampa, what did you use for the test dough? I'd like something quick to run my test. I guess it is a no fermentation, no yeast dough? can you confirm? I am going to run personalized Tampa tests on my oven. I  will start with 3/8 (~1cm gap).

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #49 on: August 10, 2013, 11:18:52 AM »
Exactly, you have concentration not pressure/speed. And concentration slows down the heat path. Light bulb moment.  ;D

Maybe you can explain it to me because something doesn't make sense here.  We have a shield that funnels/concentrates the flame.  Is the pressure higher or lower here?  And the speed of flame or heat flow is increased according to the Venturi effect.  Maybe that doesn't apply here because of all the open space.   ???


Offline communist

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #50 on: August 10, 2013, 11:21:15 AM »
of course, the higher you stick the platter up in there the more charing you will have.
That is my theory after my experiment last night.  The "gap" increase did not cause flames to shoot across the top.  Then I thought if you raise platter towards top stone and flame, it will char faster.  A more simple explantation.   Mark

Offline red kiosk

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #51 on: August 10, 2013, 11:36:29 AM »
Hey, I have that .pdf of the Chauflector template, but have no idea how to post it here. Attachments are only jpg, gif or png. Maybe someone can tell me or I can email it to someone who knows how to do it. Thanks and take care!

Jim

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Online Chicago Bob

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #52 on: August 10, 2013, 11:49:41 AM »
Maybe that doesn't apply here because of all the open space.   ???
That is precisely what I have been pointing out Chau. The complex is made simple here because of the loose tolerances/ fit of everything. And might I add that this is probably the "magic" of the BS oven. Tighten/seal up everything and you would more than likely have an extremely difficult to balance bear on your hands.
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Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #53 on: August 10, 2013, 11:53:28 AM »
I hear ya but I'm not seeing how the heat path or heat flow is slowed down.  If anything it should speed up no?
« Last Edit: August 10, 2013, 11:55:28 AM by Jackie Tran »

Online Chicago Bob

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #54 on: August 10, 2013, 12:01:58 PM »
I hear ya but I'm not seeing how the heat path or heat flow is slowed down.  If anything it should speed up no?
I don't know where folks are getting all this speed from man. If your car is rolling down the street and hits a speed bump(Chauflector,edge of platter or heat shield) does your car then speed up?  ;)

You said yourself that it is concentrating...ie. mometarily slowing down.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2013, 12:03:31 PM by Chicago Bob »
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Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #55 on: August 10, 2013, 12:11:54 PM »
I'm thinking more along the lines of a water hose.  You put your finger over the end and the increase back pressure drives the water out at higher speeds.  But that is more or less a closed system.

Online Chicago Bob

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #56 on: August 10, 2013, 12:18:34 PM »
I'm thinking more along the lines of a water hose.  You put your finger over the end and the increase back pressure drives the water out at higher speeds. But that is more or less a closed system.
And the BS is faaar from that...the potential complex has been simplified because there is no (hose)enclosure present to speed things up.  :)
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Offline Bobino414

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #57 on: August 10, 2013, 12:28:48 PM »
Tampa, what did you use for the test dough? I'd like something quick to run my test. I guess it is a no fermentation, no yeast dough? can you confirm? I am going to run personalized Tampa tests on my oven. I  will start with 3/8 (~1cm gap).

The dough used for our tests was an "emergency" dough using San Felice 00, 62% hydration, IDY, and salt 2.5%.  Total fermentation/proofing time was 6 hours at room temp.  I wanted to simulate a real dough even though we knew we were not going to eat this experiment.  The dough was docked to avoid puffing, as there were no ingredients, which might affect the heat flow pattern.

Bob

Offline Papageorgio

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #58 on: August 10, 2013, 01:19:28 PM »
Place this post here also as it is a useful mod.

Added a toggle switch to turn the platter on and off from the face plate instead of reaching under and fishing around for the switch. Went to Radio Shack and got a small 3A toggle (part #275-602) and some small crimp on clips. (could be soldered also)

Measured proper length of wire and carefully slit the wire long ways. Inside there is a red and black wire. Don't cut them both. I cut only the red in half and skinned the wires. Crimped on the ends and plugged it on to the toggle.

Drill a hole on the face plate and slide it in, tighten it down and your done.

A very worthwhile project and costs around $5 and takes only a few minutes to accomplish. Thanks to Bobino for the idea!


Online Chicago Bob

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Re: Blackstone Mods and Adjustments
« Reply #59 on: August 10, 2013, 01:34:32 PM »
Place this post here also as it is a useful mod.

Added a toggle switch to turn the platter on and off from the face plate instead of reaching under and fishing around for the switch. Went to Radio Shack and got a small 3A toggle (part #275-602) and some small crimp on clips. (could be soldered also)

Measured proper length of wire and carefully slit the wire long ways. Inside there is a red and black wire. Don't cut them both. I cut only the red in half and skinned the wires. Crimped on the ends and plugged it on to the toggle.

Drill a hole on the face plate and slide it in, tighten it down and your done.

A very worthwhile project and costs around $5 and takes only a few minutes to accomplish. Thanks to Bobino for the idea!
Thanks Papa and Bob for this great mod. Papa, got a pic showing where you mounted your switch and how it looks?

For outdoor easy, quick wire connections I have had good results with the following 3-M jell filled(water tight) product. No soldering hassles and they work great! Check out the video @ 3:30 min. in.  ;)

http://www.etrailer.com/Accessories-and-Parts/3M/804C.html?feed=npn&gclid=CK6clO-y87gCFZKk4AodgB8A4w
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