Author Topic: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?  (Read 1232 times)

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Offline BeerdedOne

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Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« on: August 22, 2013, 01:05:04 PM »
I've been making pies in a mod home oven with 600-650F heat and 100% KAAP @ 65% hydration with good results.

Now I have an LBE.  KAAP @ 65% hydration and 2:30 cook times yield nice, evenly cooked pies with good browning.

70/30 Caputo/KAAP or KABF @ 65% hydration with 1:45-2:00 cook times yield perfectly cooked bottom but only modestly browned cornichone (white pie pic, here : http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,4753.msg273784.html#msg273784).

I know that deflector mods, etc., might be warranted, but perhaps just lowering the hydration will get me a slightly faster cook time and better browning?  Is it likely to result in over cooked bottom?

I'm thinking 63% but many seem to like 60% hydration with 100% caputo.  Any advice?


Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2013, 01:58:57 PM »
Having baked a lot of 2ish minute pies on a modified grill, I think you'd be better off with 100% AP or at least cut back the Caputo to something in the 0-35% range. All of my best grill pies were 100% KAAP. 

I think 64-65%HR is appropriate for that time range. You could certainly go down as low as 60% if you like and see how it works for you. I doubt it will help much with the top browning. My guess is that all you can really do for that is cut back the Caputo - or even better - increase the top heat somehow.

I noticed you were contemplating using KABF instead of KAAP. I think all that will do is make your pie tougher. I'd stick with AP.
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Offline BeerdedOne

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2013, 06:40:19 PM »
Thanks for the reply, Craig.  Since the KAAP is apparently lower protein than the Caputo, is it a high enzymatic activity or more damaged starch in the KAAP that increases the browning tendency of these pies?

All other things equal I would expect it to perhaps make a lower gluten dough than 100% Caputo, but I'm not clear in why AP flour is commonly used in the LBE recipes to increase browning?

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2013, 06:44:39 PM »
Thanks for the reply, Craig.  Since the KAAP is apparently lower protein than the Caputo, is it a high enzymatic activity or more damaged starch in the KAAP that increases the browning tendency of these pies?

All other things equal I would expect it to perhaps make a lower gluten dough than 100% Caputo, but I'm not clear in why AP flour is commonly used in the LBE recipes to increase browning?

Caputo is not malted, so it has a lower sugar content and is thus more difficult to brown at lower temps. KAAP and most, if not all, other flours you find at the grocery store are malted and will brown easier. KAAP and Caputo Pizzeria are very similar in protein content.
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Offline BeerdedOne

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2013, 07:02:34 PM »
Yes, I had forgotten that the supermarket brands are malted     :-[

When I made two side-by-side batches of dough, one 70/30 00/KAAP and the other 100% KAAP, I noticed that the 00/KAAP mixture had more gluten development than 100% KAAP. The dough ball was a little more elastic but still opened nicely, just requiring a bit more stretching to get it to the same skin size as the 100% KAAP.

That is when I read the data of Norma and Pete-zza on the wet gluten mass of these flours, which seemed to confirm that the protein content between the two is different enough to be felt in the dough (I'm normally hand mixing/folding):

Caputo 00 Pizzeria: 2.54 ounces, or 72.12 grams (11.5-12.5% protein)
KAAP (King Arthur All-Purpose): 2.297 ounces, or 65.11995 grams (11.7 +/- 0.2% protein)

« Last Edit: August 23, 2013, 12:09:45 AM by BeerdedOne »

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2013, 02:17:06 PM »
I found that 100% KAAP is much more elastic and difficult to open than 100% Caputo Pizzeria - and this is not a once or twice thing - I've made 100's of batches with each (including side-by-side), and every time without exception this has been true.

The protein quantity is only one of several important protein-related flour specifications. My guess is that KAAP is a stronger flour than Caputo Pizzeria (higher W).
Pizza is not bread.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2013, 02:21:15 PM »
That is when I read the data of Norma and Pete-zza on the wet gluten mass of these flours, which seemed to confirm that the protein content between the two is different enough to be felt in the dough (I'm normally hand mixing/folding):

Caputo 00 Pizzeria: 2.54 ounces, or 72.12 grams (11.5-12.5% protein)
KAAP (King Arthur All-Purpose): 2.297 ounces, or 65.11995 grams (11.7 +/- 0.2% protein)

I'd have to disagree that the difference in protein content is meaningful. I think there is probably a difference in the protein strength however.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline clg763

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2013, 03:37:14 PM »
Flour and dough is about as complex as it gets in the culinary world, there is a lot to learn. When it comes down to it, the protein isn't the only thing that dictates how strong the dough is, unfortunately, the W factor is a hard spec to come by sometimes as it isn't readily published in the nutrition information like the protein.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2013, 04:38:29 PM »
Knowing the W isn't going to do anything for most pizzamakers. Either a flour works for you or it doesn't.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2013, 05:51:24 PM »
I am no expert but I can get a lot of different flours to do things people say is impossible.  Yet, I have no idea what the W factor to any of the flours are.   ;)


Offline BenLee

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Re: Moving to Caputo 00.. how should I alter hydration?
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2013, 06:10:25 PM »
I switched to King Arthur AP years ago when the price of flour went up and BJ's only sells the big bags of AP Flour.  It's much easier to stretch and creates a lighter crust then the bread flour.  The protein content is more than enough IMO.


 

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