Author Topic: Different Genres of the NY Pizza  (Read 467 times)

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Offline Arctic Pizza

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Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« on: November 09, 2014, 01:17:54 PM »
Having discussed the matter on Norma's Frank GiaQuinto thread, I wanted to explore the history and evolution of the NY pizza, it's different styles, process, taste and history.  I read a few other threads regarding the evolution, one in particular here:  http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14920.0.html

Was curious as to what other people's recollection of NY pizza was in the past decades, where they lived, what style of pizza they grew up with. 

I grew up in Pelham Bay/Co-op city in the Bronx as a child, and our family would frequently stop by places like Louie & Ernie's, my father drove into the city every day through South Bronx and recall stopping by his favorite places.  There were so many pizzerias back then serving a different pie than today's standard NY slice.  I remember each had their own unique approach to their process.  Everyone made their sauce a little different, a different combination of cheeses, very sharp aged Parmeggiano Reggiano or Grana Padano in their cheese mix. 

My heritage on my father's side is half Calabrese, half Campania from Salerno.  He was second generation.  I distinctively recall our food had a regional bias, much spicier and oilier than what I remember eating at some of my friend's family's homes.  And lots of pork.  I still eat Frittuli, which is boiled pork bones, pork meat and rind that is simmered in even more pork fat and stock and have fond memories of that particular food.  My father made sauces like that as well.  What I remember most is the amount of red pepper, peperoncino in nearly everything.  Lot of fiery spice and strong flavors.  Salty and sharp cheeses like Caciocavallo.  I always felt Calabrian food pushed flavors to extremes, I remember dried cod, anchovies and didn't shy from oil and fat.  My father used to preserve fish in bottles of olive oil and salt. 

The pizzerias, my parents took me seemed to reflect that.  My family were friends with several pizza shop owners, and I clearly remember a particular style of pizza.  A more sturdy thin crust, cooked at much higher temperature gas ovens for less time.  I remember the cracking crust, the gobs of cheese and orange oil dripping down my hands and pooling on my paper plate.  Lots of sausage, pepperoni, sometimes anchovies.  The pizza sauces then were very robust, and spicier.  My parents moved to NJ later on, and those times became memories.  I went to college at NYU, and recall seeing those pies still available at places off Bleecker St, and north of Canal.  I know there have always been the standard NY pies and slices that we all know today, but back in 90's, several places were still making those special "Neapolitan" pies that I remember, not to be confused with the Wood Fire Oven Naples pies.  Back then, when NY pizza was evolving, there was a time when pizzas baked in hotter ovens in a particular style were differentiated from the standard slice and labeled as "Neapolitan".  I feel that somewhere along the way, that particular pie got diluted, and slowly disappeared.  Alot of those places actually closed down in the 90's when corporate gentrification took over..... This is when the likes of Dominos, and Sbarros entered the fabric of NY pizza culture.

So I found pizzamaking.com forum one day and after reading, had a flashback of a great pizza moment more than a decade ago when I first tried Di Fara.  What struck me was how much it reminded me of pizza I ate when I was younger.  In particular, the extra dosage of olive oil, tons of whole milk and bufala mozzerella. extra heaping amounts of Grana Padano. 

What are your personal memories of NY pizza?  I had a similar discussion with someone regarding Chinese cuisine lately.  As most people would recognize Chinese food as chicken and broccolli at a local takeout place, there are quite a few variations to their cuisine. There are differences such as Shanghai, Hunan, Cantonese, Sichuan each catering to a sort of specific region immigrants came from and thought it was similar to what pizza and Italian food was back in the day.  Today, I see much more convergence in pizza, and Italian food as one can easily pick 10 random pizzerias in NYC and 8 of them will pretty much taste exactly the same.

« Last Edit: November 09, 2014, 09:12:46 PM by Arctic Pizza »


Offline norma427

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2014, 04:58:26 PM »
Arctic Pizza,

I really liked your opening post.  I am wondering if you ever visited Artichoke Basille's Pizza.  I am not sure why, but it seemed to me when other forum members and I were at Artichoke the square slice had such a good blend of flavors.  http://www.artichokepizza.com/ourstory.html 

It seems like the cousins also like Lee's Tavern in Dongan Hills.  In the below article it says Lee's Tavern is was one of their all time favorites.  http://www.silive.com/news/index.ssf/2013/04/staten_island_cousins_living_p.html 

Norma
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Offline Arctic Pizza

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2014, 06:10:02 PM »
Arctic Pizza,

I really liked your opening post.  I am wondering if you ever visited Artichoke Basille's Pizza.  I am not sure why, but it seemed to me when other forum members and I were at Artichoke the square slice had such a good blend of flavors.  http://www.artichokepizza.com/ourstory.html 

It seems like the cousins also like Lee's Tavern in Dongan Hills.  In the below article it says Lee's Tavern is was one of their all time favorites.  http://www.silive.com/news/index.ssf/2013/04/staten_island_cousins_living_p.html 

Norma

Thanks Norma,

Artichoke has always been on my list of places to try, but never have.  People have told me good things about their sicilian slice and I'm sure it's good if they're from Staten Island, where there is a minimum standard for things pizza.  I know they charge $4.50/slice within context of good reviews.  Seems overpriced, but maybe that's the real price to pay for good ingredients these days in the city.  When I do, I will let you know what I think.   

I had the pizza at Lee's Tavern last week and was blown away with the balance of flavor and texture.  You could tell they use the best products. The crust is crunchy, not too thin, still a good bit of tenderness there, and the cheese is top notch, good flavor and saltiness from the cheese,  and sweet sauce finishes it off.  I think these days, sauce is such an underrated component to pizza, often pulled out of cans with some salt and pepper and applied as an afterthought.  I ordered their fried calamari, and the calamari sauce was insanely good.  You could always tell alot about a place by their marinara. We had a plain pie, one with sausage and the clam pie was excellent.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2014, 07:07:35 PM by Arctic Pizza »

Offline norma427

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2014, 10:15:19 PM »
Thanks Norma,

Artichoke has always been on my list of places to try, but never have.  People have told me good things about their sicilian slice and I'm sure it's good if they're from Staten Island, where there is a minimum standard for things pizza.  I know they charge $4.50/slice within context of good reviews.  Seems overpriced, but maybe that's the real price to pay for good ingredients these days in the city.  When I do, I will let you know what I think.   

I had the pizza at Lee's Tavern last week and was blown away with the balance of flavor and texture.  You could tell they use the best products. The crust is crunchy, not too thin, still a good bit of tenderness there, and the cheese is top notch, good flavor and saltiness from the cheese,  and sweet sauce finishes it off.  I think these days, sauce is such an underrated component to pizza, often pulled out of cans with some salt and pepper and applied as an afterthought.  I ordered their fried calamari, and the calamari sauce was insanely good.  You could always tell alot about a place by their marinara. We had a plain pie, one with sausage and the clam pie was excellent.

Arctic Pizza,

You can see what pizzablogger posted about Artichoke in his second paragraph at Reply 303 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg176060.html#msg176060  pizzablogger really knows about pizzas in NYC.

Chau also posted about Artichoke at Reply 276 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg175867/topicseen.html#msg175867 I posted photos of Artichoke's Sicilian slices at Reply 234 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg175810.html#msg175810 and the next two posts. 

I know you told us about Lee's Tavern pizzas on Frank's thread. 

I wish I could have tasted some of those special Neapolitan pies you have posted about.  Do you recall the names of the pizzerias that served that kind of NY style pizza.  At there any places like that in Staten Island that your friends might have told you about?

Norma
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Offline Arctic Pizza

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2014, 10:32:33 PM »
Arctic Pizza,

You can see what pizzablogger posted about Artichoke in his second paragraph at Reply 303 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg176060.html#msg176060  pizzablogger really knows about pizzas in NYC.

Chau also posted about Artichoke at Reply 276 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg175867/topicseen.html#msg175867 I posted photos of Artichoke's Sicilian slices at Reply 234 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg175810.html#msg175810 and the next two posts. 

I know you told us about Lee's Tavern pizzas on Frank's thread. 

I wish I could have tasted some of those special Neapolitan pies you have posted about.  Do you recall the names of the pizzerias that served that kind of NY style pizza.  At there any places like that in Staten Island that your friends might have told you about?

Norma

The pies that I grew up with don't exist anymore beyond touristy joints like Di Fara and some others I won't name here make a really bad version of it.  There used to be many places up to the 90's that did these pies, but they're all gone now.  After the 90's 2000's gentrification, it got lost.  That was the gyst of the first few posts I wrote on the Frank Giaquinto topic.  This is the same for other ethnic cuisines.  My father used to take me to this great Shanghai restaurant in Hell's Kitchen on 32nd street near Madison Sq. Garden.  There is no way to relive that food, because they closed after their lease ended and that food was a function of it's time.  Food is always in flux, it ALWAYS changes.  I believe there was a time between the 60's and 80's that really found a perfect balance between immigrant's original recipes and American influences.  Now, it is skewed extremely to both ends with regard to all international cuisines.  It's either extremely authentic or completely Americanized.

Have you been to L&B?  How does the Artichoke square compare?




Offline Arctic Pizza

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2014, 10:35:26 PM »
Arctic Pizza,

You can see what pizzablogger posted about Artichoke in his second paragraph at Reply 303 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg176060.html#msg176060  pizzablogger really knows about pizzas in NYC.

Chau also posted about Artichoke at Reply 276 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg175867/topicseen.html#msg175867 I posted photos of Artichoke's Sicilian slices at Reply 234 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg175810.html#msg175810 and the next two posts. 

I know you told us about Lee's Tavern pizzas on Frank's thread. 

I wish I could have tasted some of those special Neapolitan pies you have posted about.  Do you recall the names of the pizzerias that served that kind of NY style pizza.  At there any places like that in Staten Island that your friends might have told you about?

Norma

I read some of those topics, and noticed that your crew weren't too into the touristy New American Neapolitan style pies like Totonno's.  It's really difficult to sell a pie that caters to everyone's preferences, it's nearly impossible.  There is alot of Sbarro's and Dominos/Pizza hut influences on many younger people, ie Gen X that is impossible to dilineate even from the subconscious.

Offline norma427

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2014, 10:47:47 PM »
The pies that I grew up with don't exist anymore beyond touristy joints like Di Fara and some others I won't name here make a really bad version of it.  There used to be many places up to the 90's that did these pies, but they're all gone now.  After the 90's 2000's gentrification, it got lost.  That was the gyst of the first few posts I wrote on the Frank Giaquinto topic.  This is the same for other ethnic cuisines.  My father used to take me to this great Shanghai restaurant in Hell's Kitchen on 32nd street near Madison Sq. Garden.  There is no way to relive that food, because they closed after their lease ended and that food was a function of it's time.  Food is always in flux, it ALWAYS changes.  I believe there was a time between the 60's and 80's that really found a perfect balance between immigrant's original recipes and American influences.  Now, it is skewed extremely to both ends with regard to all international cuisines.  It's either extremely authentic or completely Americanized.

Have you been to L&B?  How does the Artichoke square compare?

Arctic Pizza,

I will ask Frank if he recalls any pizzerias like you posted about.  I have been to L&B Spumoni Gardens.  The photos are at Reply 246 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17885.msg175825.html#msg175825 and the next few posts.  This is only my personal opinion but I liked the Artichoke square a lot better than L&B.

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2014, 10:51:04 PM »
I read some of those topics, and noticed that your crew weren't too into the touristy New American Neapolitan style pies like Totonno's.  It's really difficult to sell a pie that caters to everyone's preferences, it's nearly impossible.  There is alot of Sbarro's and Dominos/Pizza hut influences on many younger people, ie Gen X that is impossible to dilineate even from the subconscious.

Arctic Pizza,

I can't speak for the rest of the members, but don't think Totonno's was up to par on the day we had pizza there.  The crust was tasteless in my opinion.  The taste of the crust is very important to me.

Norma
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Offline Arctic Pizza

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2014, 10:53:37 PM »
Arctic Pizza,

I can't speak for the rest of the members, but don't think Totonno's was up to par on the day we had pizza there.  The crust was tasteless in my opinion.  The taste of the crust is very important to me.

Norma

That seems to be the trend these days.  I'm indifferent on Totonno's, but it seems today, more emphasis is given to crust flavor, fermentations, process, than the other things, ie cheese, olive oils, toppings, tomato recipes.  To me, pizza dough/crust is a textural vehicle, it's important but the flavor comes from the other ingredients.  Similar to bread, when I have a great Italian sub, the texture of the bread is important, but the taste comes from the meats and cheeses and oil.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2014, 10:59:34 PM by Arctic Pizza »

Offline Arctic Pizza

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2014, 11:06:38 PM »
Arctic Pizza,

I wish I could have tasted some of those special Neapolitan pies you have posted about.  Do you recall the names of the pizzerias that served that kind of NY style pizza.  At there any places like that in Staten Island that your friends might have told you about?

Norma

Staten Island does their own take on pizza.  What I've heard and the very few times I've tried pizza there was excellent.  Again, regional, and different from other boroughs.  I think Staten Island retained their own, because of lack of public transportation.  Things stay more traditional.  But no, you won't find certain other variations of pizza there that you ask, based on my own research.


Offline norma427

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2014, 08:14:22 AM »
That seems to be the trend these days.  I'm indifferent on Totonno's, but it seems today, more emphasis is given to crust flavor, fermentations, process, than the other things, ie cheese, olive oils, toppings, tomato recipes.  To me, pizza dough/crust is a textural vehicle, it's important but the flavor comes from the other ingredients.  Similar to bread, when I have a great Italian sub, the texture of the bread is important, but the taste comes from the meats and cheeses and oil.

Arctic Pizza,

I think most people have their own preferences on what might be the best NY style pizza.  Many people use the term 'matter of taste' to refer to matters thought to be purely subjective, implying no judgements concerning them have objective authority.  That can apply to almost any foods or drinks.  To give you a simple example I am from “Pa Dutch County”.  Even “Pa Dutch” foods change from cook to cook in many Amish families.  I recently read this blog about forgotten flavors http://www.parlafood.com/forgotten-flavors-found-in-the-alto-casertano/ and the link within, that lead to Pepe in Grani and the Politics of Pizza http://www.parlafood.com/pepe-in-grani-franco-pepe-caiazzo/ I liked the first line.  “Pizza is never just pizza”.  There is history, culture and politics woven into its glutinous strands.  I went on to read and thought to myself I wonder what Franco Pepe's pizzas tastes like since Franco opened in what was then a desolate place and now become a pizza pilgrimage destination. 

I think many people come here to the forum to find how to get those better flavors in the crusts of pizzas.  I for one, have gone on to many different experiments to find those different flavors, no matter what style of pizza it might be.  I do not think the pizza dough/crust is just a textural vehicle.  For me, I think many things have to work together to be able to make a good pizza. 

Memories of what anyone really likes in a pizza could be influenced by many things.

I wonder if you recall more pizzerias in NYC a long while ago using high temperatures to bake NY style pizzas, that did use deck ovens. 

Norma 
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Offline Arctic Pizza

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2014, 10:52:43 AM »
Arctic Pizza,

I think most people have their own preferences on what might be the best NY style pizza.  Many people use the term 'matter of taste' to refer to matters thought to be purely subjective, implying no judgements concerning them have objective authority.  That can apply to almost any foods or drinks.  To give you a simple example I am from “Pa Dutch County”.  Even “Pa Dutch” foods change from cook to cook in many Amish families.  I recently read this blog about forgotten flavors http://www.parlafood.com/forgotten-flavors-found-in-the-alto-casertano/ and the link within, that lead to Pepe in Grani and the Politics of Pizza http://www.parlafood.com/pepe-in-grani-franco-pepe-caiazzo/ I liked the first line.  “Pizza is never just pizza”.  There is history, culture and politics woven into its glutinous strands.  I went on to read and thought to myself I wonder what Franco Pepe's pizzas tastes like since Franco opened in what was then a desolate place and now become a pizza pilgrimage destination. 

I think many people come here to the forum to find how to get those better flavors in the crusts of pizzas.  I for one, have gone on to many different experiments to find those different flavors, no matter what style of pizza it might be.  I do not think the pizza dough/crust is just a textural vehicle.  For me, I think many things have to work together to be able to make a good pizza. 

Memories of what anyone really likes in a pizza could be influenced by many things.

I wonder if you recall more pizzerias in NYC a long while ago using high temperatures to bake NY style pizzas, that did use deck ovens. 

Norma

Hi Norma,

Thank you for those links.  I understand your point, I was making an observation based on what I have read on this forum with regards to crust flavors and I see lots of people doing multi-day 2-4 day ferments on their dough, so to me, it seemed more and more people are obsessed with the dough flavors as opposed to the other ingredients.  Of course, there should be a minimum amount of flavor to the dough via yeast and salt to balance the entire product, but personally, I feel like if I was making say bread or crackers to be eaten with cheese or butter, I would want  it to serve the cheese, as opposed to the other way around.  Meaning, if I was eating a really good sliced Gouda or a Stilton, I'd be eating them with something simple like water crackers and not something like Ritz crackers which have much more "flavor" because I"d want a more neutral base for the cheese.  For that reason, I avoid "sourdough" breads to be eaten with expensive cheeses, as it takes away.  A simple french baguette is nothing more than flour, water, yeast and salt and not fermented for days.  It's texture and spring mostly having to do with the baker's skills.  But that's just me, and thanks for reminding me.  To each their own.  I am just observing trends.  Sometimes I wonder if people add more flavor to pizza doughs to compensate for lesser quality cheeses these days.

I had a conversation with a guy at local pizzeria over in the LES, and we talked about the categories of NY pizza.  Though there is no consensus, it seems the pizzas that were baked in high temp ovens are referred to as "Neapolitan-American".  Another term is "NY-Neapolitan", not to be mistaken with soft wood fire oven Neapolitan pies made in Naples baked less than 2 minutes.  This explains why back in the 90's when I lived over on Jones St. off Bleecker, there were still several places serving their regular NY pies and also making "Neapolitan-style" pies.  These were typically baked hotter and faster and made with fresh bufala mozzerella along with low moisture mozzerella, reggiano and other cheeses, were much oilier due to the higher concentration of buffalo milk butterfat, and the crusts tended to be much darker, and sturdier.   Also, these were definitely not today's "Margherita pies", as the crusts were much more browned nearly charred and much more cheese and olive oil applied. 

So, these are the 3 main categories in NYC.
1) Naples Wood Fire Oven pies
2) Neapolitan-American pies
3) NY slice pies

Sometimes, pies do a hybrid of two and you then get further sub genres and categories.  There's also the square sicilian but I did not include that as part of the round pie classification.

Neapolitan-American pizza is more similar to what was being baked back then in coal ovens.  It seems when building codes changed, and people moved to the deck ovens, it evolved into the NY street slice as we know it today which is a product of a cooler 500-550 deg longer bake time.  This didn't happen overnight though obviously and during the decades of transition, the older Neapolitan-American pies were still being made either via coal or superhot gas ovens.  I've seen old modified deck ovens that can reach 700-800 degrees.  The only reason why your Bakers Pride oven doesn't reach that is because of a temperature safety switch which automatically shuts down the broilers.  Your oven could easily hit those marks if you wanted, and it doesn't take rocket science to know how to do that.  Yes, I've seen ovens hotrodded and modified to get hotter.  If it's mechanical, there will always be people out there trying to achieve more power and output.  Just look at cars and motorcycles.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2014, 11:41:31 AM by Arctic Pizza »

Offline David Esq.

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #12 on: November 10, 2014, 11:19:27 AM »
I was born and raised in New Jersey, but ate pizza in NYC with some regularity.  I then lived in Greenwich Village in 1990 and the upper east side in from 1994-2001, also eating quite a bit of pizza during this time period.

The kinds of pizza I ate ranged quite widely and I would say that the pizza one  most remembers is the pizza one ate the most.  If you lived above Patsy's, that is the pizza you may associate with NYC.  If you lived on the corner of 83rd and 1st Avenue, you no doubt associate the pizza with the joint on the corner.  And if you worked near "the original Ray's" then you may associate NYC pizza with that particular version of the fare.

For myself,  the pizza I ate the most of is the pizza sold by the slice. It folded nicely, was relatively thin, had an orange tint to it and the grease always got the palm of my hand slick.  Invariably, I took a paper napkin and sopped up the oil before eating and while it certainly reduced the mess, it did not eliminate it.  Once slice was often enough for a meal, and two slices was always more than satisfying.

I never liked the "ray's pizza" I ate because it was too different from what I was used to.  Too thick. Too much cheese.

Pizza sold by the slice was very similar whether it was purchased in Manhattan or whether it was purchased in the Bronx.  It was almost always reheated pizza, and seldom did one get a pie fresh out of the oven and a slice cut from such a pie.  But it was cheap.  And it was tasty.

These days, I have no desire to eat such pizza. Not because it has changed any -- I do not believe it has. In my experience, the same type of pizza is readily available throughout NYC and the Bronx.  But I no longer want to eat reheated pizza, period.  The pizza that comes out of my home oven is much better. The ingredients are far better, the taste is far better and I don't feel like I am eating a quart of oil with every slice.




Offline Arctic Pizza

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2014, 11:30:48 AM »
I was born and raised in New Jersey, but ate pizza in NYC with some regularity.  I then lived in Greenwich Village in 1990 and the upper east side in from 1994-2001, also eating quite a bit of pizza during this time period.

The kinds of pizza I ate ranged quite widely and I would say that the pizza one  most remembers is the pizza one ate the most.  If you lived above Patsy's, that is the pizza you may associate with NYC.  If you lived on the corner of 83rd and 1st Avenue, you no doubt associate the pizza with the joint on the corner.  And if you worked near "the original Ray's" then you may associate NYC pizza with that particular version of the fare.

For myself,  the pizza I ate the most of is the pizza sold by the slice. It folded nicely, was relatively thin, had an orange tint to it and the grease always got the palm of my hand slick.  Invariably, I took a paper napkin and sopped up the oil before eating and while it certainly reduced the mess, it did not eliminate it.  Once slice was often enough for a meal, and two slices was always more than satisfying.

I never liked the "ray's pizza" I ate because it was too different from what I was used to.  Too thick. Too much cheese.

Pizza sold by the slice was very similar whether it was purchased in Manhattan or whether it was purchased in the Bronx.  It was almost always reheated pizza, and seldom did one get a pie fresh out of the oven and a slice cut from such a pie.  But it was cheap.  And it was tasty.

These days, I have no desire to eat such pizza. Not because it has changed any -- I do not believe it has. In my experience, the same type of pizza is readily available throughout NYC and the Bronx.  But I no longer want to eat reheated pizza, period.  The pizza that comes out of my home oven is much better. The ingredients are far better, the taste is far better and I don't feel like I am eating a quart of oil with every slice.

My experience in the 90's when I went to school at NYU and lived in the Village is that most students ordered the basic street slice, from the local corner place and that's all they knew.  There were pizzerias back then still offering other styles, like the Neapolitan-American pizzas I described above or fresh mozzerella margherita style pies but kids didn't order them.  They were afraid to order those, because they didn't look like the pizza they had from wherever in America they came from.  At some point, it didn't makes sense for the local places to carry them and/or they slowly closed shop and went out of business due to the corp gentrification of W. Village, Greenwich village.  The last vestiges of the older Neapolitan pies now exist in no slice/pie only sit down restaurants and touristy places like Lombardi's, though they make a strange hybrid of it.  Di Fara's still does it.  Interestingly, those are the places that are packed and crowded now.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2014, 11:32:21 AM by Arctic Pizza »

Offline rparker

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Re: Different Genres of the NY Pizza
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2014, 06:14:24 PM »
I've only visited the city a handful of times, but find it sad to be talking about pizzas that happened after I grew up as being relics. <sigh!> I remember those orange oil dripping pies very well. We even had variations of that in Upstate, but not that hot an oven and not that much orange oil. Back in the early 80's, in the Mohawk Valley, we had our street pizza type of NY pizza in the local malls if owned privately. Being hungry was not a requisite for two slices.

That high temp oily thing is what I've come closest to at home many years later. I hope to be only a few modifications away. (a guy's gotta dream.) I do like the NY pie I ate at the malls a lot too. That's what tonight's is going for. I never saw a straight up Neapolitan back then like what I see on the time on the forum. Not once. Always some form of NY or that Neapolitan-NY combo that I see described here.

Man, I'm hungry now.



 

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