Author Topic: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base  (Read 555 times)

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Offline kevcampbell

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Hi all i bought a packet mix today to see how gluten free pizza tasted and after making this from the packet i found it to be a very delicious pizza and would like to try copying it

What i would like to know are the measurements in the ready made mix, the ingredients are cassava starch which i bought today, milk powder, salt and flavourings, i suppose we will not know the flavourings or the exact measurements of cassava starch and milk powder

But can anyone try to guess?

In the packet you get a mix that weighs 300 grams, how many grams of cassava and how many grams of milk powder is that going to be?

Below is a link to the product itself, obviously cassava starch and milk powder do not make a pizza base but on the back of box it says to use 3 tbsp of oil and 200ml water which i did obviously to make the pizza i made earlier

http://www.isabelsfreefrom.co.uk/products/pizza-base-mix/


Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2014, 02:46:01 PM »
To make the nutritional information (sort of) work, it must be close to this:

294 - 295g cassava starch (a.k.a. tapioca starch or tapioca flour)
3.3 - 4.5g nonfat dry milk (my guess is that they use a dry milk with a fat content between non-fat and whole, but I don't think such a retail product exists).
1.5g salt

All the fat and protein has to come from the dry milk as cassava starch has neither. Using this assumption led me to the numbers above. I don't see how they could end up with the exact nutritional data they posted, but this isn't too far off.

Pizza is not bread.

Offline kevcampbell

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2014, 02:58:23 PM »
Yes i do wonder why it has so many names :-D

But before i carry on, thank you so much you are amazing

An asian store near me sells something called nestle nido, never tried it myself but here is a link to it http://www.tesco.com/groceries/Product/Details/?id=260148289 do you think that would be suitable to use if i was to use the recipe you have provided me with? I am not sure of the fat content but on the link it states percentages of fat content if you wanted to look at the link?

Thanks again

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2014, 03:06:39 PM »
Yes i do wonder why it has so many names :-D

But before i carry on, thank you so much you are amazing

An asian store near me sells something called nestle nido, never tried it myself but here is a link to it http://www.tesco.com/groceries/Product/Details/?id=260148289 do you think that would be suitable to use if i was to use the recipe you have provided me with? I am not sure of the fat content but on the link it states percentages of fat content if you wanted to look at the link?

Thanks again


I suspect it would be fine, but just pain nonfat dry milk might be better.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline kevcampbell

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2014, 03:14:32 PM »
I suspect it would be fine, but just pain nonfat dry milk might be better.


I found this http://groceries.asda.com/asda-webstore/landing/home.shtml#/product/19246 is that the sort of thing you are talking about?

Offline TXCraig1

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Pizza is not bread.

Offline kevcampbell

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #6 on: June 11, 2014, 03:36:31 PM »
Yes.


Awesome thanks will try that recipe you provided tomorrow and let you know how it goes if i manage to get to the shop to buy that milk powder

Just wondering if you could do the grams for this too? http://www.isabelsfreefrom.co.uk/products/yorkshire-pudding-mix/ i know it is asking a load as you just helped me with the other recipe for the pizza baze, but its fine if you do not know or something, i am very happy with that pizza base recipe you just did for me

Thanks again

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2014, 04:21:42 PM »
Awesome thanks will try that recipe you provided tomorrow and let you know how it goes if i manage to get to the shop to buy that milk powder

Just wondering if you could do the grams for this too? http://www.isabelsfreefrom.co.uk/products/yorkshire-pudding-mix/ i know it is asking a load as you just helped me with the other recipe for the pizza baze, but its fine if you do not know or something, i am very happy with that pizza base recipe you just did for me

Thanks again


Potato and corn flour are both about 7% protein, and this mix is 0.3% protein, so it must be mostly Cassava flour which has none. All the fat most come from the corn flour.

I think it must be something like this for a 200g box:
189g cassava flour
6g potato flour
5g corn flour
3g salt

Pizza is not bread.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2014, 04:22:15 PM »
Awesome thanks will try that recipe you provided tomorrow and let you know how it goes if i manage to get to the shop to buy that milk powder


I'll be surprised if you can't find powdered/dry milk locally.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #9 on: June 11, 2014, 04:26:05 PM »
Note that the pizza base nutritional information listed "0.5g salt" while the Yorkshire pudding had "0.6g sodium" listed.

I suspect that listing salt rather than sodium in the pizza base nutritional info was a typo. If so, you should up the salt to 4g from the 1.5g in the first formula I gave.
Pizza is not bread.


Offline kevcampbell

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2014, 05:33:48 PM »
Potato and corn flour are both about 7% protein, and this mix is 0.3% protein, so it must be mostly Cassava flour which has none. All the fat most come from the corn flour.

I think it must be something like this for a 200g box:
189g cassava flour
6g potato flour
5g corn flour
3g salt

Oh my, is that all? Just 6g and 5g of potato and corn flour, so looks like these isabels packet mix are over 90% tapioca flour then and they are not that cheap considering it costs about 2.50 for one packet of the pizza base mix which is 300g and 1kg of tapioca flour costs 2.29 which i bought earlier

I have loads of shops near me anyway, all within walking distance so most likely will be buying some ingredients tomorrow, not sure if i will find potato flour though

Ok thanks i will keep that in mind and remember to use 4g of salt

Thank you very much again for all the continued help and advice

Offline kevcampbell

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2014, 06:03:39 AM »
To make the nutritional information (sort of) work, it must be close to this:

294 - 295g cassava starch (a.k.a. tapioca starch or tapioca flour)
3.3 - 4.5g nonfat dry milk (my guess is that they use a dry milk with a fat content between non-fat and whole, but I don't think such a retail product exists).
1.5g salt

All the fat and protein has to come from the dry milk as cassava starch has neither. Using this assumption led me to the numbers above. I don't see how they could end up with the exact nutritional data they posted, but this isn't too far off.

Hi i tried this earlier and did not turn out too well, mixture was very wet when i added all the other required ingredients, not sure if quantities were wrong or if it was the ingredients i bought, but it come out too wet and it was not possible to roll out into a dough ball

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2014, 09:46:37 AM »
I don't know what to tell you except to try cutting back on the water - you can always add more water if it's too dry. If everything was measured correctly, then there must be something different about their cassava starch. Perhaps yours has higher a moisture content. You are at about 98% starch in the recipe I calculated. Even if you used 300g cassava and no milk or salt, it would have still been wet from how it sounds.

Did you measure your water by weight (200g)? The box says to use add an egg, but you didn't mention it earlier. Did you add an egg?

I'd cut back on the water to 150g then add more as needed to get the right texture. Be sure to measure whatever you add so you know how much you need in total for future use.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline kevcampbell

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #13 on: June 17, 2014, 03:00:46 AM »
Hi there yes i added everything as required, so added eggs and all the other stuff

Is it possible they used a different cassava flour to me and thats why mine did not turn out right? Are all cassava flours different? I wonder if she uses a popular one like bobs mill cassava flour which is only available on import here but i wonder if she uses that because apparently the cassava flour bobs mill sell is finely ground, and the isabels packet mix is very finely ground it looks like, and the cassava starch i bought did not look very finely ground at all, just ground but did not look finely ground

And possibly a different milk powder or would the milk powder brand make no difference?
« Last Edit: June 17, 2014, 03:05:08 AM by kevcampbell »

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Trying to copy a packet mix, isabels gluten free pizza base
« Reply #14 on: June 17, 2014, 06:07:31 PM »
I think it is much more likely that the difference is in the starch. There is so little milk powder. I think the grind probably would make a difference as it would affect the rate at which water is absorbed. The moisture content of the starch would also make a difference. Who knows what they use. There are probably many different cassava starches with different specs available to food manufacturers that we will never see at retail stores. I think you just need to play around with the ratio - adding a bit more starch until you find a formula that works. It probably won't take much additional starch to stop it from being sticky. If your starch is a coarser grind, you might also want to let it sit for a while after you mix everything together to give the starch time to fully hydrate. This might in and of itself solve the problem.
Pizza is not bread.


 

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