Author Topic: Sue's Pizza Dough  (Read 5079 times)

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Online Pete-zza

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #75 on: December 10, 2015, 10:20:37 AM »
Peter, this has to be a record. 47 days into a thread and not a single pizza made?
Craig,

I am a patient sort ;D. Actually, I was more at fault than Sue for the delays because I insisted on getting the correct numbers out of McCormick's, and that slowed her down as well. But I found my exchanges with McCormick quite hilarious. After I pointed out discrepancies between their products (the garlic powder versus the granulated garlic), I got two answers to the same question and, as it turns out, they finally said they relied on the USDA nutrition data.

As for the dough itself, I have had suspicions about the recipe. The IDY, at about 0.08%, is too small to do much of anything in the period at room temperature and also during refrigeration. It might start to have a meaningful effect much later than three days of cold fermentation. But doughs with very little yeast often do not work out at all because of very low activity levels. The salt (about 1.18%) is also low, which might speed up the fermentation process somewhat by its reduced effect on the yeast performance, but the amount of speedup is unlikely to be much. The amount of granulated garlic arguably should cause the dough to break down and become slack and maybe wet and sticky but with a hydration of 48% and almost 4% oil, that is placing a lot of the burden on the granulated garlic. And if that doesn't do the trick, you can end up with an overly dry dough that is hard to shape and form. Also, I have seen cases where more than 0.44% garlic powder did not cause any harm to the dough.

So, I am interested to see what Sue end up with.

Peter

Offline Jersey Pie Boy

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #76 on: January 27, 2016, 06:01:19 AM »
Came to mind yesterday that, uh...where's the pizza, Sue??? :)

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #77 on: January 27, 2016, 07:50:51 AM »
Bill,

I was wondering about the same thing recently. Sue was last on the forum this past December 11 so she most likely saw my last post.

Sometimes things just don't work out or they drag out. There was a lot of wheel spinning on Sue's dough but I still learned a lot about garlic powders that may come in handy some time in the future.

Peter

Online Jon in Albany

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #78 on: January 27, 2016, 08:09:39 AM »
I started messing with cool room temperature ferments and never got around to trying it either.

Offline Jersey Pie Boy

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #79 on: January 27, 2016, 08:44:18 AM »
Thanks Peter...I have to admit my garlic powder technique is uh, I just sprinkle some in the sauce and good to go..not scientific at all, but tasty. Recently been trying the microwave MAE thing...still measuring by seat of pants but it does do a nice job infusing the flavors. 

Jon,  how are those RT's coming? I also have been doing some in the 62-63 range..pretty nice results. For some of my bread, though, I've had to find the warmest spot in the house..a corner in my son's room and bribe him into letting me park dough there...Pizza bribes  ;)

Online Jon in Albany

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #80 on: January 27, 2016, 10:44:49 AM »
Thanks Peter...I have to admit my garlic powder technique is uh, I just sprinkle some in the sauce and good to go..not scientific at all, but tasty. Recently been trying the microwave MAE thing...still measuring by seat of pants but it does do a nice job infusing the flavors. 

Jon,  how are those RT's coming? I also have been doing some in the 62-63 range..pretty nice results. For some of my bread, though, I've had to find the warmest spot in the house..a corner in my son's room and bribe him into letting me park dough there...Pizza bribes  ;)
They are coming along. I have been trying a few different bulk/ball times. I think I need to up the yeast a little. The dough at 72 hours seemed better to me than 48 hour balls. My only complaint was a little toughness. In another thread Craig suggested that it might be the bromide causing the toughness in a long ferment (currently going through a bag of full strength). Next run will be straight bread flour.

The basement is a solid 62 thus time of year. Only problem is bringing RT dough balls to the garage to cook on the Blackstone. I had a tray of 6 balls. By the time I got to the 6th, I think it was starting to freeze up. Outside temp was in the low teens.

Edit: tapatalk isn't letting me add a picture from my phone. I'll put one up later.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2016, 10:48:51 AM by Jon in Albany »

Offline Jersey Pie Boy

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #81 on: January 27, 2016, 11:42:04 AM »
That's interesting stuff, Jon...a far longer RT than I thought you had going. I'm doing some hybrids...RT and CF in the same dough. I know officially it's not good, but the pizza police haven't banged on the door yet.

This past weekend I made a dough, also GMFS. 30 percent poolish, , then about 3 % spelt in final dough. 65.7% HR, IDY .088% all of it in poolish, 2% sugar, 2% salt. Hand-mixed,  stretch /folds, then bulk  to CF for about a day, then 10 hours RT 63F, back to CF for another day (approx 26 hours) , then balled about 24 hours before bake and and left at RT63 for 4 hours until fermentation appeared complete (and was close to chart prediction)  Balls on counter to warm up about an hour or so prebake (should have been a bit more..had to rest on oven to warm them up)    Baked on steel in home oven launch about 585, (preheated by broiler) and baked about a total of 7 minutes (including a touch of broil at the end for final browning)  Only have a crumb shot of the pie we liked best..sliced mozzarella,  smoked moss, olive oil, arugula dressed with lemon and olive oil ala Craig, Himalyan sea salt, and I think there were some mushrooms under there left over from the first pie. I thought the texture and flavor were really good..light but crunchy/crispy.

Online mitchjg

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #82 on: January 27, 2016, 11:45:45 AM »
Bill,

I was wondering about the same thing recently. Sue was last on the forum this past December 11 so she most likely saw my last post.

Sometimes things just don't work out or they drag out. There was a lot of wheel spinning on Sue's dough but I still learned a lot about garlic powders that may come in handy some time in the future.

Peter

I'm starting to think that it is a good thing that Sue wanted to keep this dough a secret.
Mitch

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Online Jon in Albany

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #83 on: February 03, 2016, 10:10:28 PM »
JPB - I made some dough last Wednesday. Some room temp and some in the fridge. Being someone that can't only change one variable at once, I also used a different flour for the room temp. I have been using Full Strength lately and there was a mention about the bromate possibly causing toughness in a long room temp ferment. I used KA bread flour for the room temp. So combine the flour change with the room being colder than I thought (thermometer said 62, dough temp was 57) and I'm not sure this qualifies as anything worth basing an opinion on. I started the weekend with 8 refrigerated doughs and 12 cold room temp doughs, each at about 330 grams. And with one of the RT doughs, I tried to do my impression of Norma and put on two poppy seeds an inch apart.

I made pizza on Friday for a bunch of guests and didn't snap pictures. The two poppy seeds were still an inch apart. On Sunday, I was using the rest of the dough. The RT balls had flattened out a lot. The poppy seeds were a little further than an inch apart, I'd say less that 1.25 and it looked more like a flattening. Both days, I thought the cold dough stretched better than the cold room temp. Over the course of the weekend, 6 people including myself tasted the doughs side by side and preferred the cold dough. One test was comparing two cheese pizzas. I tried to do everything the same, although with me and Blackstone, that is easier said than done. I asked my wife and kids to taste just the crust and tell me which one they liked better. They were tasting blind and didn't know which one was which. And it isn't that the cold room temp dough was bad. If that was all I had, no one would have complained and I'd argue it was still better than most anything available for sale nearby. The cold dough had a better depth of flavor to it. But I'd still say I changed too much stuff up to be conclusive. The jury wasn't shown proper evidence.

Some pics I did take of the two cheese pizzas, but they aren't very good pics. I'm not sure why, but I only tend to post photos of things I have some pride in on the forum. I should just start a thread and take a picture of every pie regardless of outcome.

The blurry cold ferment cheese pie followed by the cold room temp pie. And sorry to hijack your thread, Sue.

 

Offline Jersey Pie Boy

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #84 on: February 04, 2016, 10:08:25 PM »
Jon, that's pretty interesting. My experiences are that if any dough tastes better and more complex, it's the RT. But the difference between it and the CF is certainly not dramatic. If everything is fermented properly and baked similarly, my results are fairly close. But  I almost always use a RT poolish...whicch I' msure affects my flavor.

I think Sue might have left the bulding :)

Online Jon in Albany

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #85 on: February 04, 2016, 10:45:11 PM »
This didn't have a poolish and I was very surprised with the results too. I had been only been making a variation on the room temp for a few weeks and thought I was getting somewhere. But there's was no doubt that the CF was better...although there is significant room for operator error in prepping the doughs. I think a poolish is the next side to side tasting.

Wherever Sue is, I hope the pizza is good.  :)

Offline Midnightsue

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #86 on: February 06, 2016, 12:38:56 PM »
Hello Jon, sorry I haven't been on for awhile there has been a lot going on here. My hubby had reoccurring Prostate Cancer even though it was removed in 2005. He finished radiation last month and then here recently we almost lost our cat.

What is CF and RT and poolish? I would like to know what you thought of the crusts you made? Be honest ;-) I want to know if its worth making or if I should just make a different dough.
 
If you ever get to Wisconsin go to Madison and try the Pizza Pit  >:D pizza.  There main mascot on the take out box had the Devil on it and it said Devilish. It has been my favorite for well over 25 years. Yes I have tried many others and I have eaten them but... I would love a great thick crust pizza and not Pizza Hut. The person I got the recipe from had his own store and in 1981 he sold it. If you look up www.pizzapit.com you will see what item they have and what they look like. The Italian meatball sandwiches and the pizza are my favs.


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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #87 on: February 06, 2016, 01:06:07 PM »
CF= Cold Ferment...refrigerator. RT=Room Temp ferment. Poolish : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pre-ferment
Hans

Online Jon in Albany

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #88 on: February 06, 2016, 02:57:11 PM »
Sounds like you gave had your hands full Sue. I do hope things are going well. I haven't given your dough a try yet and have been trying to wrap my head around my own dough formulation. It is still on the to do list.

I haven't been to Madison in years. Back then I hadn't caught the pizza bug yet. My only real food memory of the town, besides all the brew pubs, was a scrambler at Mickey's Dairy Bar. I asked the waitress what she recommended. She said they were known for the Scrambler. I said I'd take one.

With bacon? Sure.
Gravy? Ok.

Then I heard her call into the kitchen, "A guy wants a scrambler with bacon and gravy. He doesn't know what it is!"

Out came a big pile of fried potatoes, eggs, bacon, and cheese all covered in gravy. Not recommended by cardiologists, but deliciius.

Offline Midnightsue

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Re: Sue's Pizza Dough
« Reply #89 on: February 13, 2016, 07:06:06 PM »
Sounds like you gave had your hands full Sue. I do hope things are going well. I haven't given your dough a try yet and have been trying to wrap my head around my own dough formulation. It is still on the to do list.

I haven't been to Madison in years. Back then I hadn't caught the pizza bug yet. My only real food memory of the town, besides all the brew pubs, was a scrambler at Mickey's Dairy Bar. I asked the waitress what she recommended. She said they were known for the Scrambler. I said I'd take one.

With bacon? Sure.
Gravy? Ok.

Then I heard her call into the kitchen, "A guy wants a scrambler with bacon and gravy. He doesn't know what it is!"

Out came a big pile of fried potatoes, eggs, bacon, and cheese all covered in gravy. Not recommended by cardiologists, but delicious.

Hi Jon,
I know the place well. At one time they had a Pizza Pit joint across the street. It came down a few years back. They have other PP stores around town. Its funny she would say it like that its something they would say in the south. I too love the Pub foods, I wished they had them here where I live. We were a dry county that became wet three years ago but still no bars  >:( They do however have lots of liquor stores. I miss the steak sandwiches they served, I now make my own which seems to taste better from the bars. When you get the time take a look at the pizza sauce recipe I also posted. Please let me know if you try ether recipe or if you have any questions. The sauce I gave a couple jars to friends and they loved it the wanted more. Pizza Pit when they make the sauce it is still red because they make it everyday where as I don't have room in my freezer for all of the ziplock bags nor room in my refrigerator for 21 pint jars this is why I canned it using the hot water bath method.

Sue


 

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