Author Topic: My evolving NY style  (Read 2488 times)

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Offline Musky

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #20 on: December 03, 2013, 07:49:26 PM »
Do you know what the thickness factor is for your formula?  I know you're very meticulous from reading your posts.  Yours look a little thicker than the first two I made, but about the same as my third.  I'll be making a couple more this weekend.  Maybe a deep dish, too.

Kevin


Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #21 on: December 03, 2013, 09:21:01 PM »
Thanks Gotbags. I've never bought anything from RD, nor can I. But I know the RD in Columbus has all or most Stanislaus products and Full Strength flour. Walter may be able to let you know some other pizza products they carry.

Kevin, to determine thickness (or to determine how much dough I should use for any particular pizza size), I use a spreadsheet that allows me to enter four different numbers to define, theoretically, the thickness of my pizzas and how much dough is necessary to create a crust that meets the various criteria I enter. Here's what I have entered in the spreadsheet right now:

Pizza size:
14 inches

Main dough density/thickness (or thickness factor):
0.076 oz of dough per square inch

Rim density/thickness:
0.115 oz of dough per square inch

Width of rim:
0.75 inch(es)

With those numbers entered, I'm basically telling the spreadsheet I want a 12.5" flat pizza of TF=0.076, plus a thicker rectangular-shaped circle of dough around that, with a width of 0.75" and TF=0.115. I created this spreadsheet so it would be easy for me to figure out how much dough to use for different-sized NY style pizzas. You can't just describe a NY style skin as TF=0.80 (or whatever) because NY style pizzas aren't made of a perfectly flat sheet of dough. I don't know if the numbers I've entered are perfect, but I know they're close to what I want. Still, I intend to make some changes.

With the above criteria entered into my spreadsheet, it's telling me I should use 12.92 oz of dough (366 grams) for each 14" pizza. If I change the pizza size to 16", it tells me to use 16.68 oz of dough (473 grams). If I change the pizza size to 18", it tells me to use 20.92 oz of dough (593 grams).

I think I have a little tweaking to do. But like I said, I think my definitions are pretty close. Definitely much closer than any math using a single thickness value for the entire pizza.

I don't know if that helps, but that's probably about the best I can describe or explain my system. Maybe I'll copy the data from each spreadsheet cell and share it in a follow-up post soon. Perhaps some screen captures, too.

Offline gotbags-10

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #22 on: December 03, 2013, 09:46:19 PM »
If you ever want to buy from RD you can purchase a membership to the Kansas City BBQ society. It runs 30$ for a year membership and will grant you access. That's what I do.

Offline pythonic

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #23 on: December 03, 2013, 09:47:50 PM »
Great looking pies Ryan! Alright so I have to ask. What are you guys getting at RD for your pizza making if I may ask? I always go there for my briskets, pork butts and ribs for my other cooking/ smoking passion. Never thought they had stuff for pizza though. Thanks nick.

Nick,

I believe RD has real good commercial mozzarella cheese there for pizza.  Probably good crushed tomato brands as well.
If you can dodge a wrench you can dodge a ball.

Offline pythonic

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #24 on: December 03, 2013, 09:50:36 PM »
Ryan,

Awesome pies.  64% hydration?  Wish I could taste this one.  How far off I80 are you?  LOL.
If you can dodge a wrench you can dodge a ball.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #25 on: December 03, 2013, 10:06:17 PM »
Here's today's pizza. It ended up being about 15" x 13", partly because it was a wetter dough than I like (which makes it difficult to peel onto a stone that's not much bigger than the pizza), but also because I try to use as little flour on the peel as possible (except for that one pizza I made the other day). This was 48-hour dough, using the following formula:

100% All Trumps flour (bleached and bromated)
64% Water
0.5% ADY (was 0.4%)
1.75% Salt
1.5% Oil
1% Sugar

I can already tell tomorrow's dough ball is gonna be overfermented. I don't have enough cheese left for one more pizza, so this may be the last one I bake for a while. (I do intend to make one more, but it will be really light on the cheese.)

One interesting thing about today's pizza: I raised the stone two rack positions. I was worried that doing this would end up giving me too much top heat (or the wrong kind of top heat), but I'd say this worked better than baking on the bottom rack, which is how I've always baked before today. I'm sure you can tell that I got much better browning on the top of today's pizza than any other pizza I've shared in this thread. Also, check out the far edge of the pizza. That part of the pizza baked in the rear of the oven (and I didn't rotate the pizza).

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #26 on: December 03, 2013, 10:08:34 PM »
Ryan,

Awesome pies.  64% hydration?  Wish I could taste this one.  How far off I80 are you?  LOL.

Thanks Nate. I'm a long way from I-80. At least two hours, but probably much closer to three.

Offline Needssalt

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #27 on: December 04, 2013, 02:38:27 PM »
Nice top heat,...

Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #28 on: December 04, 2013, 02:45:50 PM »
Awesome pies Ryan
Bert,

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #29 on: December 04, 2013, 06:35:36 PM »
Thanks, guys. It makes a pretty big difference, doesn't it? It's amazing how many life-changing things there are to learn about pizza even after you've made thousands of pizzas.

I decided to abandon the one dough ball I have left in the fridge. Since I don't even have enough cheese left for one 14" pizza (and because I'm probably not gonna get any more for a while), I'm gonna go ahead and make another batch of dough for my temporary-farewell pizza, then give it two days in the fridge. Gonna decrease the hydration just a tad, and probably not use any sugar, now that I realize I can get better browning by baking on a higher rack.


Offline pythonic

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #30 on: December 05, 2013, 08:38:25 AM »
Thanks, guys. It makes a pretty big difference, doesn't it? It's amazing how many life-changing things there are to learn about pizza even after you've made thousands of pizzas.

I decided to abandon the one dough ball I have left in the fridge. Since I don't even have enough cheese left for one 14" pizza (and because I'm probably not gonna get any more for a while), I'm gonna go ahead and make another batch of dough for my temporary-farewell pizza, then give it two days in the fridge. Gonna decrease the hydration just a tad, and probably not use any sugar, now that I realize I can get better browning by baking on a higher rack.

Wasting a doughball?  Isn't that a sin?
If you can dodge a wrench you can dodge a ball.

Online norma427

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #31 on: December 05, 2013, 08:55:40 AM »
Ryan,

I am enjoying your thread.  Great looking pizzas!  8)

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #32 on: December 05, 2013, 10:09:32 AM »
Ryan,

Maybe you have already seen the thread at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6585.msg56478.html#msg56478 but you can see how one member, Pete Waldman, described his experience moving the stone (a Fibrament stone) to the upper third of his oven.

Peter

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #33 on: December 05, 2013, 12:15:17 PM »
Thanks y'all.

Nate, usually it is a sin for me to throw away dough because, as I've shared elsewhere somewhat recently, there is a lot of tightwad in my genes. But since I knew my last dough ball was gonna be overfermented before I was ready to use it, as well as a couple other good reasons, I felt it would be stupid for me to use that dough ball. (I still haven't made dough for my next pizza, though.)

Also, I missed your question about 64% hydration several posts back when I initially read it. Yeah, all my dough has been 64% hydration since I increased it to 64% (about ten days ago). I'll probably drop it to 63% for my next batch, though, because I just don't like how the almost-wet dough turns out.

Walter, the search for a new home is mostly over, finally. Yesterday I found out that our offer for a condo in Grove City was accepted. (For the rest of y'all, that's about 10 minutes south/southwest of downtown Columbus, off I-71.) This place is not as close to Newark as I originally thought I'd end up, but it's still 10 or 15 minutes closer than I live right now. More importantly, though, there are no steps in the place (or outside it), which is huge (because it's difficult for me to step over obstacles as small as garden hoses). Also, the kitchen should work well for pizzamaking classes/chowdown sessions I intend to host if I can generate any interest.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: My evolving NY style
« Reply #34 on: December 09, 2013, 08:08:57 PM »
Today's pizza was made of 48-hour dough using the following formula:

100% All Trumps flour (bleached and bromated)
63% Water (was 64%)
0.5% ADY
1.75% Salt
1.5% Oil
0% Sugar (was 1%)

I decreased the hydration 1% with this batch because I didn't like the wet-looking crumb I was getting (even though I think most other members love that kind of crumb). With such a small change, I didn't expect to be able to notice much of a difference, but I ended up noticing quite a positive difference.

I mixed for 5 minutes. I feel like I should mix a little longer, but I'm a bit hesitant considering I'm using All Trumps flour.

Since baking higher in the oven gave me much more top browning with my previous pizza, I omitted sugar from this dough.

Interesting characteristics about today's pizza:
  • It came out 15.5" x 14". (I was shooting for 14", but I'm glad I finally ended up with a pizza that was a little too big, rather than a pizza that was a little too small.)
  • I got a consistent thickness for once. I feel like the thickness was just about right, too. So considering I used 13 oz of dough for this one, this suggests I should probably use a little less than 13 oz for that perfect 14" pizza. Maybe 12.5 oz.
  • Not much cheese on this one because that's all I had left. I think it was about 150 grams.
Now that I've used up all my cheese, this might be my last pizza for a while.


 

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