Author Topic: Laminated Chicago Stuffed  (Read 7819 times)

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Offline Garvey

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2014, 06:23:19 PM »
I used DKM's recipe because it's one of my tried and true recipes. I enjoy the cornmeal texture, and I found that the dough amount was perfect for my 15" deep dish pan. I didn't do the 7 minute knead, it was substantially shorter. BUT, with that said, I'm always willing to try something new. Will you please point me to one of the newer recipes?  :)

Ah, gotcha.  Tried and true means a lot, especially when guests are coming over!

BTB' Malnati's Clone With Semolina, which is a sticky for this forum, is outstanding.  The semolina will provide the texture that you like from cornmeal.  (No Chicago pizza purveyor is actually using cornmeal: that was a myth, an epic red herring.)  Try this one from that thread: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6480.msg157947.html#msg157947

My other favorite recipe is Ed's (VCB).  Maybe he'll chime in with the link to his latest.  It is a very detailed recipe, which is awesome, and the results never fail.


Cheers,
Garvey


Offline dbean415

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #26 on: June 15, 2014, 11:45:43 PM »
Could you provide any more information regarding your lamination method for the bottom crust? I am planning on trying this recipe this week and am unsure about that step. Did your lamination utilize the cultured butter, vegetable oil (as suggested previously by pythonic regarding Giordanos method), or was it a dry lamination? Any input would be greatly appreciated!

David
« Last Edit: June 17, 2014, 11:08:44 AM by dbean415 »

Offline PizzaGarage

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #27 on: June 18, 2014, 08:49:47 PM »
Could you provide any more information regarding your lamination method for the bottom crust? I am planning on trying this recipe this week and am unsure about that step. Did your lamination utilize the cultured butter, vegetable oil (as suggested previously by pythonic regarding Giordanos method), or was it a dry lamination? Any input would be greatly appreciated!

David

Sure, it's a dry laminate.  See pic 6 and 7 simply roll it out fold in half 3 times (I only showed 2 folds)  reball ( will be pretty tough to do) then roll out to size. 

Brad

Offline drmatt357

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #28 on: June 19, 2014, 01:29:29 AM »
Hey Brad,
This looks amazing!  You'll have to forgive me but I'm a little slow on the uptake. The laminate method is for rolling out the dough?  What effect does it have?  Only done on the bottom layer?  What size is that pan and how many grams of flour did you use for top and/or bottom? Cook time?  Are you in Europe because the cultured butter and powder are kinda scarce.

A pic on your technique or explanation on how you achieved that beautiful rolled edge where the top and bottom dough meets would be great also.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 01:52:46 AM by drmatt357 »

Offline PizzaGarage

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #29 on: June 22, 2014, 11:56:20 PM »
Yes, laminating gives the crust some separate layers and is done when rolling out the dough.  Essentially roll out the dough and fold the sheet in half, then another half and once again.  Reball it then roll it out again.

The bottom crust is laminated the top is not.  In the pics, the bottom dough is 17 oz, the top the same but rolled out thinner.  The pan is a 12 inch.   You do not want a thick crust on the bottom, more so thin.  I do not have thickness factor as that would give you the precise information.  Sorry about that, I use a sheeter and roll out to a specific setting.   Next time I make these I will measure thickness and snap some pics.

To get the round edge, you can use sauce or a veggie spray, like Pam.  Fill up the pan with your toppings and cheese,  spray or sauce the inside top edge of the dough.  Place the top dough over the bottom and slightly press the 2 doughs together( don't pinch just press slightly) Take a large rolling pin and roll the top, it will form just like in the pics.

I am in Chicago, the cultured butter is richer and provides a buttery flavor.  You can get cultured butter at Whole Foods and many supermarkets, it's pretty common in my area.  Sacso cultured butter milk is the only brand supermarkets seem to carry, by me it's in most of the stores as well, maybe it's because I am near a large city.....


Offline drmatt357

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #30 on: June 23, 2014, 12:32:38 AM »
Thanks so much Brad. Couple of other things
Does your dough docker put holes in the dough? I have something like this. I don't think it perforates the dough. I guess I'm asking is it necessary for ventilation?

That appears to be Parmesan sprinkled on top. Brand?

Also, you replied about the cultured butter milk, you do mean the powdered form, right?
« Last Edit: June 23, 2014, 09:32:41 AM by drmatt357 »

Offline vtsteve

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #31 on: June 23, 2014, 09:30:57 AM »
Essentially roll out the dough and fold the sheet in half, then another half and once again.  Reball it then roll it out again.

Really? Wouldn't reballing defeat the purpose of laminating (creating distinct layers)?  ???

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #32 on: June 23, 2014, 10:28:55 AM »
Really? Wouldn't reballing defeat the purpose of laminating (creating distinct layers)?  ???
I believe so....plus, it will make the dough much tougher "elastic".

Dr. Matt; your docker is perfect, you do not want to puncture holes in the dough.

CB
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Offline PizzaGarage

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #33 on: June 24, 2014, 12:38:05 AM »
Thanks so much Brad. Couple of other things
Does your dough docker put holes in the dough? I have something like this. I don't think it perforates the dough. I guess I'm asking is it necessary for ventilation?

That appears to be Parmesan sprinkled on top. Brand?

Also, you replied about the cultured butter milk, you do mean the powdered form, right?

You want the docker to punch holes through the dough, otherwise the crust will just form bubbles.  There is another style than the one pictured, they have steel pins as opposed to the plastic "paddles" you have on that docker.  I have one of those and they do not work well for me on the cracker crusts or other dry low hydration doughs.  Yes, it is the powered form.   For the top you can use Parm or Romano or a combination, all are good!
« Last Edit: June 24, 2014, 12:48:18 AM by PizzaGarage »


Offline PizzaGarage

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #34 on: June 24, 2014, 12:45:04 AM »
Really? Wouldn't reballing defeat the purpose of laminating (creating distinct layers)?  ???

Actually, it creates additional layers by folding the edges down and inward when you are reballing.  After the laminating you have to reball to get the shape back.  There are other ways of laminating, this is just how I do it.  It works great for me especially on cracker crusts.


Offline drmatt357

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #35 on: July 06, 2014, 01:53:46 AM »
The Stanislaus 74-40 is described as Filets. Does that mean it needs to be ground before using in a recipe like this?  How is the taste different from their Tomato Magic or 7-11?

I'm going to RD tomorrow and am thinking of picking up a can.

Offline PizzaGarage

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #36 on: July 11, 2014, 11:35:56 PM »
The Stanislaus 74-40 is described as Filets. Does that mean it needs to be ground before using in a recipe like this?  How is the taste different from their Tomato Magic or 7-11?

I'm going to RD tomorrow and am thinking of picking up a can.

The 74 40 does need slight grounding, I use an imersion blender.  Just slight grounding leaving the sauce medium chunky.  Those larger chunks will cook down just fine.

No comparison to 711 or magic, there is no fresher tasting sauce than the 74 40 for canned.  Personally, I think the 711's  though very popular taste tinny and the magic is too sweet.  That's my opinion of course. 


Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #37 on: July 11, 2014, 11:43:49 PM »
`grounding` toms are so wrong for this style of pizza.....you need a trip to chicagoland mister.
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Offline drmatt357

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #38 on: July 12, 2014, 01:44:18 AM »
If not grinding Bob, what do you recommend?

Offline pythonic

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #39 on: July 12, 2014, 01:20:51 PM »
If not grinding Bob, what do you recommend?

Giordanos (the inventor of this pizza) uses 6 n 1 ground tomatoes by escalon.

Nate
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #40 on: July 12, 2014, 02:04:33 PM »
If not grinding Bob, what do you recommend?
sorry, forgot this is `stuffed`.  :-[
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Offline dulcevita

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #41 on: August 21, 2014, 11:14:38 PM »
Dough:


Laminated 3 fold bottom crust
Thinner no fold top crust

What is a laminated 3 fold crust?? Sounds oddly YUMMIE  :drool:


Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #42 on: August 21, 2014, 11:19:52 PM »
Roll dough to size and then `letter` fold, 3 fold, etc. and then roll out again. Dough now has many more [laminate] layers.
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Offline dulcevita

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #43 on: August 21, 2014, 11:26:25 PM »
Roll dough to size and then `letter` fold, 3 fold, etc. and then roll out again. Dough now has many more [laminate] layers.
Thanks Bob, I should have read ALL 3 PAGES!!! it says it page two. 

Offline moose13

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #44 on: August 22, 2014, 04:08:27 PM »
Perfection!

Offline pythonic

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #45 on: August 22, 2014, 08:55:14 PM »
Perfection!

Yep.  Best clone on these forums.  I gave up after gaining 15lbs in a short while.  Helps to have pizza oven in garage though.

Nate
« Last Edit: August 22, 2014, 09:06:46 PM by pythonic »
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Offline pythonic

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #46 on: September 11, 2014, 02:59:02 PM »
Ok so I finally gave this a whirl.  Made slight changes to the oil though and ferment time.  This is my best stuffed attempt to date.  Thanks PG.

9 inch formulation (same bakers percents as page 1)

500g AP flour
215g water
9g sea salt
5g sugar
30g whipped soft spread from restaurant depot
15g olive oil
3/4 tsp yeast (doubled yeast)

3hr ferment (2hr in oven with light on, 1 on countertop).  Used 2/3 dough for bottom and 1/3 dough for top
Greased pan with whipped soft spread and baked at 475 for 26 mins.   Had a minor greasebomb as you can tell.  Not sure if it came from butter in pan, dough or pep.

Crust thoughts:

I did not do a long rise so that may change things but the crust needs to be a tad drier and lighter.  For those of you have never had Giordanos before the crust tastes like a dry sponge with layers.  Will play around with it. May incorporate a little shortening too.


« Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 03:18:16 PM by pythonic »
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #47 on: September 11, 2014, 03:21:20 PM »
Ok so I finally gave this a whirl.  Made slight changes to the oil though and ferment time.  This is my best stuffed attempt to date.  Thanks PG.

9 inch formulation (same bakers percents as page 1)

500g AP flour
215g water
9g sea salt
5g sugar
30g whipped soft spread from restaurant depot
15g olive oil
3/4 tsp yeast (doubled yeast)

3hr ferment (2hr in oven with light on, 1 on countertop).  Used 2/3 dough for bottom and 1/3 dough for top
Greased pan with whipped soft spread and baked at 475 for 26 mins.   Had a minor greasebomb as you can tell.  Not sure if it came from butter in pan, dough or pep.

Crust thoughts:

I did not do a long rise so that may change things but the crust needs to be a tad drier and lighter.  For those of you have never had Giordanos before the crust tastes like a dry sponge with layers.  Will play around with it. May incorporate a little shortening too.
This dough looks drier than your Malnoti....which do you like best?
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Offline pythonic

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #48 on: September 11, 2014, 03:30:24 PM »
This dough looks drier than your Malnoti....which do you like best?

Giordanos is my favorite.  This dough and Malnatis has same hydration but 2 1/2 less times the oil as Malnatis.  I am gonna drop water down 1-2% on my next attempt and do 48hr cold rise.

You know how Giordanos end crust is crispy, tender and airy?  This one was too hard on surface and wasn't dry, tender and airy enough.  Now again this is the closest I've come but you either nail the crust or you don't and I never have.  Maybe it's the oven or lack of sheeter.  Everything is spot on until you get to that end crust.

Nate
« Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 03:34:41 PM by pythonic »
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Laminated Chicago Stuffed
« Reply #49 on: September 11, 2014, 03:51:12 PM »
You didn`t change your cheese/brand on this one did you?
Longer ferment is probably right direction on that crisp factor....where did you get the margarine idea?
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