Author Topic: Full strength  (Read 268 times)

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Offline Camaro10

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Full strength
« on: May 30, 2014, 01:46:19 PM »
I've been using all trumps but want to switch to full strength bc of all the good things I've heard. Does anybody know where I can get a 25lb bag? I've only seen 50s I've checked gfs and RD. They don't carry full strength. I found it online but only in 50lb. I don't have any room for a 50lb bag. Thanks


Offline Surffisher2A

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Re: Full strength
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2014, 02:14:42 PM »
My local RD carries full strength in 50lb bag, but not 25.

just an FYI -- I had to reduce my hydration % when I switched from all trumps to full strength. I went from 63% to 61% and may even drop down to 59 or 60 on my next batch.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Full strength
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2014, 02:22:40 PM »
I've been using all trumps but want to switch to full strength bc of all the good things I've heard.

I cringe when I hear things like this.

Worrying about the flour probably sets back and delays more people's pizza making progress than any other single factor. If your pizza is not what you want it to be, it's almost a certainty that you can do a lot more to improve it by focusing on your fundamentals. Don't let flour distract you. Fundamental skills make good pizza - not changing flour.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline scott123

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Re: Full strength
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2014, 02:46:40 PM »
Worrying about the flour probably sets back and delays more people's pizza making progress than any other single factor. If your pizza is not what you want it to be, it's almost a certainty that you can do a lot more to improve it by focusing on your fundamentals. Don't let flour distract you. Fundamental skills make good pizza - not changing flour.

Camaro10 is making NY style pizza.  For NY, Full Strength is a better choice than All Trumps because it idiot proofs the kneading process. You can underknead or overknead, and, because extended fermentation always takes the flour to peak gluten development, with this particular lower protein flour, peak gluten is always the right texture, unlike All Trumps, where peak gluten is WAY too chewy, and the steps to prevent peak gluten development from occurring with AT are a major pain in the butt (severe underkneading that risks undermixiing).

Flour is not as important as oven setup (I'd like to see Camaro10 find a way to get a faster bake), but, for NY style, it's definitely second place for things one can do to improve their game. It's a critical part of the NY style road map.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2014, 02:51:20 PM by scott123 »

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Full strength
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2014, 02:50:14 PM »
OK, I'll certainly defer to your expertise in this situation, notwithstanding, I stick with my contention that worrying about flour does more harm than good overall.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline scott123

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Re: Full strength
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2014, 03:02:34 PM »
Camaro10's been making pizza for at least a year, and his game is pretty far along:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=26131.msg263641#msg263641

For NY, over time, one typically reaches a quality ceiling when tweaking the formula and developing stretching skills.  The next big move forward is a faster bake, and then, after that, a move to distributor purchased bromated medium high gluten flour. These two steps, combined, are basically the move from intermediate NY style pizza maker to advanced.

You do know that when I go on and on and on about bromated flour, this is flour I'm talking about, right? :)

Offline waltertore

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Re: Full strength
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2014, 03:02:58 PM »
OK, I'll certainly defer to your expertise in this situation, notwithstanding, I stick with my contention that worrying about flour does more harm than good overall.

Craig/Scott:  I agree with both of you about FS flour.  I agree that it makes a much nicer crust IMO over AT and I agree that flour choices alone are not going to advance a beginner to great crusts.  It is the process of getting to know dough that gets you top dough and for people that know this and can apply it, then the FS is a great change from AT.   I also am of the camp that great dough isn't something one can learn on the net in a few attempts.  It takes years to figure it all out right.  At least it has taken me about 50 years of being around dough to finally say  I found "my" dough.  I always have been a slow learner............  :-D   Putting together a pizza that is perfectly balanced in taste, texture, ingredients, is what takes such a long time.  Cut and paste learning will get you a decent product but if you want to go to the top shelf nothing but time, experimentation, and repetition gets you there.  Walter
« Last Edit: August 07, 2014, 03:04:46 PM by waltertore »

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Full strength
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2014, 03:18:37 PM »
Walter,

Norma has been on the forum for a little bit more than five years. And, in that time, she has perhaps made more types of pizzas than any other member of the forum, and with much success in my opinion. While Norma has learned from doing in a commercial setting and in her home, I view her as one of the greatest examples of a creature of the Internet. Where would Norma be today if it weren't for the Internet, even with all of its perceived deficiencies and shortcomings?

Peter

Offline waltertore

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Re: Full strength
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2014, 03:28:48 PM »
Walter,

Norma has been on the forum for a little bit more than five years. And, in that time, she has perhaps made more types of pizzas than any other member of the forum, and with much success in my opinion. While Norma has learned from doing in a commercial setting and in her home, I view her as one of the greatest examples of a creature of the Internet. Where would Norma be today if it weren't for the Internet, even with all of its perceived deficiencies and shortcomings?

Peter

Peter:  I agree with you on Norma.  She is one of the top pizza makers in the country IMO.  She is also driven to find the answer and no amount of time, distance, obstacle, will deter her.  The time she has put in experimenting is more time than a 100 people combined would put in.  The internet has worked for her but without her putting in countless hours she would never be where she is.  I was refering to people that get on the net, cut/paste a recipe and consider themselves pizza masters in a few weeks.  Photos lie.  I posted some photos a while back of a pie I made with a RT rise.  My scale was broken so I had to eyeball it.  The dough overfermented to pretty much useless.  I was able to shape it somewhat and bake it.  It actually looked pretty good but it tasted terrible.  This is where the net is a hinderence.  Nothing will ever replace the growing up with the pizza in your mouth from birth from a world class area and or putting yourself in it, and or doing like Norma has done.   People like Norma travel to all the places she wants to learn the styles of.   She does repeat trips as well.  She is a rare bird and you and her are a very rare combination.  I still say you should gather all the recipes you 2 have perfected and put them in a book. People here would buy it in a heartbeat.  Walter

Offline norma427

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Re: Full strength
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2014, 07:07:54 PM »
Peter and Walter,

I would have been doomed for almost the beginning of my pizza making days if it was not for this forum.  There were a lot of members that helped me in any way they could.  I guess I am an example of being a creature of the Internet.  That sounds a little weird but it is true.

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!