Author Topic: GI Metal perforated peels  (Read 946 times)

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Offline Buffy

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GI Metal perforated peels
« on: July 05, 2014, 05:46:21 PM »
I have always used a wooden peel to top pizza's on and slide onto stone and a medal peel to rotate while cooking  and remove pizza from oven.  I recently used a perforated medal peel and liked it a lot however it is quite expensive.  Wondering what people think of them.   It seems like it would kill two birds with one stone!
Thanks!
Buffy
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Online Qarl

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2014, 05:49:25 PM »
I love mine.  Gets the extra flour out.

I bought an A-32RF/50 that works great for my Blackstone.   13-inch rectangular perforated blade and 20-inch handle.

http://www.gimetalusa.com/shop/det-perforatedaluminumpizzapeelrectangular13handle20_26_1__.php

Offline Tampa

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2014, 08:11:05 AM »
I love mine.  Gets the extra flour out.

I bought an A-32RF/50 that works great for my Blackstone.   13-inch rectangular perforated blade and 20-inch handle.

http://www.gimetalusa.com/shop/det-perforatedaluminumpizzapeelrectangular13handle20_26_1__.php
I have the same GI peel and bought it from forum member jconk007.  Before that, I used the wood launch, metal retrieve system as you describe.

The GI has been good to me.  The blade is extra thin so you can make the pie on the counter and pull it onto the peel.  Then slide the pie around and/or hop it around on the peel just before launch to remove excess flour.  I didn't have all that much trouble launching from a wooden peel before, but I agree with Qarl that it is easier to get rid of the bench flour and I have never wanted to go back to wood.

Dave

Offline mkevenson

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2014, 08:17:18 AM »
GI metal slotted or perf. Best tool I ever bought. Thanks to a member here who showed me the light long ago.

Mark
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Offline Buffy

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2014, 11:55:02 AM »
Thanks so much for the positive responses.  It is exactly what I was thinking.  Love that it serves multiple functions!
Buffy

Online TXCraig1

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2014, 12:12:34 PM »
I would encourage people not to shake the pizza on the peel. You cause it to contract. Excess flour will fall out on its own. If you see flour falling out of the bottom of the peel, you are probably using way too much flour.
Pizza is not bread.

Online Qarl

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2014, 02:06:07 PM »
I somewhat disagree.  You need to shuffle the pie a few times on the peel to make sure it isn't sticking.  You certainly don't need to shake it vigorously.  A little bit of flour is required to act as rollers or bearings to allow the pizza to slide freely on the peel.  If you are not careful a certain amount of flour will inevitably end up in the oven and burn on the stone or bottom of the crust.  The holes allow any extra flour that may be present to fall out and minimizes chances of all this happening.

There is a YouTube video from GI Metal explaining a lot of this.  Will see if I can find it.

Online Qarl

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2014, 02:06:39 PM »

Online TXCraig1

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #8 on: July 06, 2014, 02:32:52 PM »
I somewhat disagree.  You need to shuffle the pie a few times on the peel to make sure it isn't sticking. 

Trust technique, and you will make better pizza. You need a lot less flour than you think and you definitely don't need to shake or shuffle:

 

You would need glue to get that sheet of rubber in the GI video to stick to the peel.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline Tampa

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #9 on: July 06, 2014, 05:51:42 PM »
There is a YouTube video from GI Metal explaining a lot of this.
Thanks for sharing the video Qarl.  Maybe it is just us high-humidity FL pizza makers, but GI does a better job of keeping that bitter taste away from the underside of my pies.  FWIIW, I learned the shake and shuffle watching experienced guys at the pizza expo - it was either Tony G or Jeff V's class - I think it was Roberto launching Tony-made pies.

Part of the problem, in my case, is our preference for ingredients.  Those tend to weigh down the pizza and make it difficult to pull onto the peel (especially a thick wooden peel).  As a result, we tended to make ingredient pies on the peel.  It was always a race to get everything done in a minute or two (before the pie tends to stick).  With the thin blade on the GI peel, I can either pull the pie on (Neo) or stab the blade under the pie (ingredients).  Either way, I really have to mess things up to get a sticky pie or a bitter bite.

Dave



Online Qarl

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #10 on: July 06, 2014, 06:11:51 PM »
If your dough is stretched properly and is at the right point of relaxation, a shuffle or two of the dressed pizza on the peel to remove any excess flour that may be present won't cause significant enough shrinkage/contraction to be concerned about.

You always needs some flour, unless you stretch your pizza in your hand and place directly on the peel.  A skin on a dry wooden or stone countertop will stick unless bench flour is present.    And regardless how little you use ( even if your technique is perfect), there will always be a certain amount of loose flour on the bottom of the pizza at launch.

Here is the reasoning for the perforations per the GI Metal USA site.

Online TXCraig1

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #11 on: July 06, 2014, 06:14:07 PM »
If your dough is stretched properly and is at the right point of relaxation, a shuffle or two of the dressed pizza on the peel to remove any excess flour that may be present won't cause significant enough shrinkage/contraction to be concerned about.

You are wrong.
Pizza is not bread.

Online TXCraig1

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #12 on: July 06, 2014, 06:27:23 PM »
You are wrong.

I need to qualify that reply. For many styles of pizza, I'm sure you can shake the dough to your hearts content. I have to remind myself there is pizza other than Neapolitan.  ;D
Pizza is not bread.

scott123

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #13 on: July 06, 2014, 09:09:29 PM »
Craig, I could probably count the NP pies that I've stretched on one hand, but, in those instances, I do distinctly recall that, by the time you get around to doing the final on-peel stretch, the exterior of the rim is very extensible, so when you pull the dough out, it doesn't seem to want to contract back much, at all.

Even if you do end up with tangible tension, the act of launching the pizza should relieve that tension and cause it to contract as it's leaving the peel.

Even if I'm completely wrong and the final stretch creates enough tautness for a noticeable potential contraction when jiggled, and the pie could be launched in such a fashion that that tautness could be maintained, I see no issue whatsoever with adding a bit more stretch to compensate should a jiggle be desired.

In other words, in a typical NP setting, I'm not 100% certain how much of a contraction there will be, and, even if there is, it can be compensated for in the stretch.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2014, 09:13:15 PM by scott123 »

Online TXCraig1

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #14 on: July 06, 2014, 10:24:34 PM »
Craig, I could probably count the NP pies that I've stretched on one hand, but, in those instances, I do distinctly recall that, by the time you get around to doing the final on-peel stretch, the exterior of the rim is very extensible, so when you pull the dough out, it doesn't seem to want to contract back much, at all.

Even if you do end up with tangible tension, the act of launching the pizza should relieve that tension and cause it to contract as it's leaving the peel.

Even if I'm completely wrong and the final stretch creates enough tautness for a noticeable potential contraction when jiggled, and the pie could be launched in such a fashion that that tautness could be maintained, I see no issue whatsoever with adding a bit more stretch to compensate should a jiggle be desired.

In other words, in a typical NP setting, I'm not 100% certain how much of a contraction there will be, and, even if there is, it can be compensated for in the stretch.

Iím not sure itís strictly a matter of releasing tension. The mechanical action of shaking may also play a role.  When you stretch dough, there is some amount of tension, however minor.  It takes energy to stretch the dough; however it takes little or no energy (or even releases energy) for the pie to contract. When you shake, part of the pie is pushing away from the center and fighting the tension. On the opposite side, the energy from the shaking is pushing the edge towards the center relieving tension. Clearly the effect is disproportionate. It is much easier for the pie to shrink on the trailing edge than expand on the leading edge. When the direction of the shake reverses, the forces reverse. After a few shakes, the net effect is contraction in all directions. Whatever the mechanism, I've watched dough that spreads like butter pull back 1/2" or more in radius with only a few gentle shakes.

The act of launching might relieve tension and cause a contraction as you suggest if the whole thing wasnít over and the pie on the deck in about 0.1 second. You are thinking about a NY launch not NP.

All of this is a bit of a moot point as the edges really should be hanging over the sides of the peel a bit Ė if you want round pizza anyway Ė and, you are not going to shake with pie hanging over the edges. 

Iím simply making a suggestion. If you or anyone else wants to shake, by all means, shake away. Many folks might not notice a difference. Itís just another one of those little things that combine to elevate good to great.

Pizza is not bread.

scott123

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #15 on: July 07, 2014, 12:41:40 AM »
Craig, we're basically discussing the identical forces involved when you pull a tablecloth from under a table full of dishes and the dishes remain intact. Once the skin is moving, the static friction force drops and whatever tension is in the skin will cause it to contract.  It may take a shake or two for the skin to start moving freely on the peel, but the moment that static friction force truly drops, twang! contraction.

If you're seeing 1/2" radius/1" diameter contraction on even the most manageable  doughs, I'll take your word for it, but a launch, even a .01 second launch, involves the exact same drop in static friction as a shake, and, because of that drop in friction, if there's tension, contraction will occur.

Regardless of whether or not contraction occurs during launching, here's two scenarios

1. Your technique, no contraction
2. My technique, with a 1" additional stretch to the pre-rim area, which is then shaken and contracts 1"

Are you really going to tell me that these two pies will be different in any way?  Are you really going to say that 1 'elevates from good to great,' while 2 does not?

While I do see the occasional edge hanging over the side NP skin, I would definitely not consider that the norm.  And the NP pies I see without the hangover seem to consistently end up round.  What am I missing here?  I would think that if you're consistently seeing skins larger than your peel, wouldn't it be time to purchase a larger peel?
« Last Edit: July 07, 2014, 12:58:13 AM by scott123 »

Online TXCraig1

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Re: GI Metal perforated peels
« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2014, 10:14:48 AM »
If you are shake/sliding the pie slowly off the peel, I agree it might contract in the same way as shaking on the peel. However, with a proper launch, there is no contraction. Your tablecloth analogy is somewhat relevant - the force of the peel being pulled out from under the dough is so abrupt, the dough does not move. It drops straight down to the deck where it will instantly stick and not contract.  There isn't even a tiny fraction of the time needed for the pie to contract.

As I explained above, there is more at work than simply a release of tension. The mechanical action of sliding the pie back and forth on the peel causes contraction. It's not an instant snap back - you can watch it shrink over the course of a couple shakes.

Lastly, yes, I am going to tell you that there can be a difference between your two scenairos. When the pie contracts, the dough has to go somewhere, and that somewhere gets thicker. The thickening is likely to be most evident in the space where the naked dough in the cornicione transitions to the sauce edge. I know you don't agree with this, and I'm not saying it's the sole cause of bowling - clearly stretching technique can cause bowling, but anything that disrupts the cornicione-middle transition so that it is not abrupt and well defined is a negative. It can compromise the aesthetics of an otherwise great pie.

I would also point out that I didn't say this is the difference between good and great, but rather it is one of many little things that you tend to see done in the making of great pies but is overlooked by many.

Maybe none of this applies NY-style dough. I can see how that could be the case.
Pizza is not bread.