Author Topic: yeast lifespan  (Read 2466 times)

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Offline orionkf

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yeast lifespan
« on: July 26, 2006, 01:00:24 AM »
If you add ADY to warm water (100-110)  how long can you let it sit before it goes bad?  Does letting it sit do anything to the flavor, texture, etc.


Offline Pete-zza

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Re: yeast lifespan
« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2006, 05:44:47 AM »
orionkf,

The recommendation is that the active dry yeast (ADY) not be allowed to rehydrate beyond about 15 minutes. Otherwise, there is a possibility that glutathione, an amino acid reducing agent, can leach or otherwise be released from the yeast cells and degrade yeast performance, resulting in a slack dough. I have read that adding a very small amount of sugar to the hydrating yeast may extend the hydration time, but I have not personally tested out that possibility sdince my practice is to keep the yeast and sugar separate, as is recommended by Tom Lehmann. 

Peter
« Last Edit: July 26, 2006, 05:51:14 AM by Pete-zza »

Offline Trinity

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Re: yeast lifespan
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2006, 08:54:33 AM »
I would never add dry yeast (saf-instant) to water. It kills it. Put it on top of everything else just before starting the mixer. Same thing for fresh. imo :)
It's an Earth food. They are called Swedish meatballs. It's a strange thing, but every sentient race has its own version of these Swedish meatballs! I suspect it's one of those great universal mysteries which will either never be explained, or which would drive you mad if you ever learned the truth.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: yeast lifespan
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2006, 09:31:59 AM »
Trin,

The recommended practice when using IDY in a VCM (vertical cutter mixer) is to hydrate the IDY in water because the mixer works so fast you might not get sufficient dispersion of the IDY. From what I have read, that may be the only instance where hydration of IDY in water is a requirement (and possibly also for a Robot Coupe machine). I agree that it doesn't make a lot of sense to hydrate IDY in water but some bakers do it anyway, either out of habit or because they don't know that it is not necessary. I have done it on occasion intentionally where I was using trivially small amounts of IDY, say, a few grains between my thumb and forefinger, in relation to a fairly large amount of flour. I did this because I felt that I would get better dispersion of the IDY throughout the dough than if I tried to blend the few grains in with the flour.

Peter

Offline orionkf

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Re: yeast lifespan
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2006, 10:02:49 PM »
Just an update:  The ADY was in warm water for close to 30 mins, and it turned out fine.  I did add honey to the final knead, not sure if that helped save it or not.  I really didn't notice much difference from a 5 minute proof, except that it took awhile to rise in the fridge.  Thanks to all those that replied.

Offline Trinity

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Re: yeast lifespan
« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2006, 05:29:03 AM »
Trin,

The recommended practice when using IDY in a VCM (vertical cutter mixer) is to hydrate the IDY in water because the mixer works so fast you might not get sufficient dispersion of the IDY. From what I have read, that may be the only instance where hydration of IDY in water is a requirement (and possibly also for a Robot Coupe machine). I agree that it doesn't make a lot of sense to hydrate IDY in water but some bakers do it anyway, either out of habit or because they don't know that it is not necessary. I have done it on occasion intentionally where I was using trivially small amounts of IDY, say, a few grains between my thumb and forefinger, in relation to a fairly large amount of flour. I did this because I felt that I would get better dispersion of the IDY throughout the dough than if I tried to blend the few grains in with the flour.

Peter

I have to admit that the only mixers I have used for dough mixing are/have been 60 80 and 120 quart Hobart mixers so getting it mixed in ok is no problem. But when the seasons change I will up the water temp way hot,,, Or use gallons of ice chips to get my doughs the way I like them . And the yeast does like that. Better for the flour to "moderate" the temperature of everything then risking your yeast. I think planning what you want your dough temperature to be after mixing it THE key to success every time. :)
It's an Earth food. They are called Swedish meatballs. It's a strange thing, but every sentient race has its own version of these Swedish meatballs! I suspect it's one of those great universal mysteries which will either never be explained, or which would drive you mad if you ever learned the truth.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: yeast lifespan
« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2006, 09:15:16 AM »
Trin,

You are a professional so I know that it is important to get the correct finished dough temperature with so much dough at stake. Do you actually take the temperatures of anything, like flour, room temperature, finished dough temperature, etc., or do you just know from experience to use, say, warm water in the winter and cold water or ice in the summer?

Peter

Offline Trinity

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Re: yeast lifespan
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2006, 06:46:43 AM »
Trin,

You are a professional so I know that it is important to get the correct finished dough temperature with so much dough at stake. Do you actually take the temperatures of anything, like flour, room temperature, finished dough temperature, etc., or do you just know from experience to use, say, warm water in the winter and cold water or ice in the summer?

Peter

Hi Pete,

 Well I used to Take temperatures of everything a long time ago, But after 20 years or so I just have "a feel" for it all now. Biggest seasonal changes are the temp of the tap water from summer to winter. In the winter it is icy cold, And in the summer sometimes it is downright warm. Flour temp is a big one to watch also. Sometimes in the winter you'll get a delivery and it will come in off the truck at just about 32dF If you don't adjust to that your in for trouble!
 Room temperature is a big factor too. And another thing to take into account is the heat you get from the mixing process. If my dough still feels to cool I just mix a few minutes more. A nice trick if you want/need a real fast rising dough.

 I had to make pizza dough for a while for a standing order and they come and pick it up and make their own pizzas with it. And the trick with that was to make a real cold dough, Mix about 13 minutes, And then I would divide it into 5# chunks immediately and refridgerate it strait away. About 40# batch's total weight. It lasted them about a week per batch.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2006, 08:19:31 AM by Trinity »
It's an Earth food. They are called Swedish meatballs. It's a strange thing, but every sentient race has its own version of these Swedish meatballs! I suspect it's one of those great universal mysteries which will either never be explained, or which would drive you mad if you ever learned the truth.

Offline Trinity

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Re: yeast lifespan
« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2006, 07:00:22 AM »
I have to admit that the only mixers I have used for dough mixing are/have been 60 80 and 120 quart Hobart mixers so getting it mixed in ok is no problem. But when the seasons change I will up the water temp way hot,,, Or use gallons of ice chips to get my doughs the way I like them . And the yeast does like that. Better for the flour to "moderate" the temperature of everything then risking your yeast. I think planning what you want your dough temperature to be after mixing it THE key to success every time. :)

What I meant to say here was,

I have to admit that the only mixers I have used for dough mixing are/have been 60 80 and 120 quart Hobart mixers so getting it mixed in ok is no problem. But when the seasons change I will up the water temp way hot,,, Or use gallons of ice chips to get my doughs the way I like them . And (If you add your yeast directly to the water especially to hot water, you can ruin it, or seriously retard it. The same is so with very cold water to a lesser extent.) Better for the flour to "moderate" the temperature of everything then risking your yeast. I think planning what you want your dough temperature to be after mixing it is THE key to success every time. :)
« Last Edit: July 28, 2006, 10:02:20 AM by Trinity »
It's an Earth food. They are called Swedish meatballs. It's a strange thing, but every sentient race has its own version of these Swedish meatballs! I suspect it's one of those great universal mysteries which will either never be explained, or which would drive you mad if you ever learned the truth.