Author Topic: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....  (Read 77647 times)

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Offline November

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #120 on: June 28, 2007, 01:16:33 PM »
MWTC,

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5011.msg42433.html#msg42433

I don't recommend freezing sauce.  The quality is inconsistent, and once it's ruined in the freezer, there's nothing you can do to force the water back into the cells.  Removing the water will just leave you with tomato pulp.

- red.november


Offline MWTC

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #121 on: June 28, 2007, 01:55:37 PM »
Have you found the same thing with freezing cheese?

MWTC  :chef:

Offline November

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #122 on: June 28, 2007, 02:09:13 PM »
MWTC,

Cheese doesn't come from a plant, so no, I can't say that I've found the same thing with freezing cheese.

- red.november

Offline MWTC

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #123 on: June 29, 2007, 12:26:30 PM »
How about just adding some tomato paste to the thawed out sauce?

MWTC  :chef:

Offline November

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #124 on: June 29, 2007, 12:46:20 PM »
How about just adding some tomato paste to the thawed out sauce?

That's probably the most sensible solution if you don't mind diluted (in terms of seasonings) sauce.

- red.november

Offline November

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #125 on: June 29, 2007, 01:01:35 PM »
Even if it's for a restaurant, I don't understand the need to make more sauce than what's storable in the refrigerator.  I get nine 14" pizzas out of one batch of sauce made from 28 oz of tomato puree.

MWTC, how much sauce do you go through in a week?  Are you using a #10 can of puree only because you have to for that brand?

Maybe you could just add some alcohol (e.g. wine) to keep it from freezing. ;D

- red.november

Offline MWTC

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #126 on: June 29, 2007, 02:27:33 PM »
I found out that Gordens Food only caries the #10 can of 6 in 1.  I bought one and didn't realized how much that was, so I froze the extra that I couldn't use. I use about one 28 oz. in about a week. So three in about three weeks. I don't know how long the sauce will remain good in the fridge. (I found it to get better with age)Thats why I froze the remainder and found it watery. Prompting the original question.
 
I found a supplier about 40 miles away that supplies restaurants and they sell 6 in 1 in 28 oz. cans by the case and #10 cans by the case.  So I am deciding which size I am going to purchase. When I uses your recipe I usually do it by the small 28oz.can and found myself having to redo the recipe to often. You know all those spices can get a little time consuming to redo all the time.

After realizing that freezing isn't the way to go I will go with the case of 28 oz cans and do about three at a time. Yes, I love the sauce!!!

No, I am not making Pizza Soup or drinking it as a V8 substitute.  :-D

I'll try the addition of tomato paste tonight to the previously frozen sauce.

MWTC  :chef:

Offline November

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #127 on: June 29, 2007, 02:50:05 PM »
MWTC,

If you go through 28 oz a week, I don't see why you can't just keep an entire #10 can's worth of sauce around in your refrigerator.  You're going through your sauce more quickly than I do, and I keep sauce in my refrigerator for as long as a month without a problem.

- red.november

EDIT: Of course the back of my refrigerator where I keep my sauce is around 37F.  Maybe 2-3 28 oz cans at a time would be better for you if your refrigerator isn't just above the freezing point of water.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2007, 02:54:19 PM by November »

Offline sourdough girl

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #128 on: June 29, 2007, 03:10:35 PM »
Hey, MWTC

You could also "par-make" the sauce if your fridge isn't as cold as red.november's...  you state your biggest problem is with measuring out all the spices.  So, why don't you spend an hour or two measuring them out, from sucrose to parsley, into individual baggies so that each baggie makes one batch of sauce, then put the sealed baggies into a tightly sealed jar.  When it's time to make a batch of sauce, all you have to do is grab a baggie and dump it into the tomatoes.  Line up 10 coffee mugs or other similar-sized containers, put a baggie into each one and start measuring... sugar into each, then kosher salt....

Sure seems like it would solve the time issue since you've settled on red.november's sauce and don't want to experiment anymore like I do!

~sd
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Offline MWTC

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #129 on: June 29, 2007, 03:21:35 PM »
sd,

Thats a good idea. The sugar and salt must be kept separate seeing that I don't MAE that portion.

I am still experimenting with other recipes. Your's is next on the list. Just went out and got the bay leafs. Still need to find/get the chunked cheese. Any recommendations?

MWTC  :chef:


Offline sourdough girl

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #130 on: June 29, 2007, 04:14:59 PM »
MWTC,

Glad to hear you're still planning to try my sauce!

If you grate parm or romano over your cooked pie (or spaghetti...) like some folks do, just cut off a chunk of rind which is normally too hard to grate.  It is my way of flavoring the sauce with cheese that would normally go to waste.  I buy a lot of pecorino romano because I love its salty tang... I usually use it grated in other Italian pasta dishes and save the rinds for pizza sauce (or pasta e fagioli...mmmm) where I don't want that grated cheese "grit" in my sauce.

So, my recommendation is to buy a small chunk of good, imported parm or romano and hack up the rind.  It adds a depth of flavor that is warm and wonderful.

~sd
Never trust a skinny cook!

Offline MWTC

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #131 on: June 29, 2007, 06:07:50 PM »
~sd

I stopped by Sam's Club on the way home and bought some Argitoni Pecorino Romano imported from Italy. I now have all the ingredients for your sauce. I will make it tonight and try it after refrigeration per your instructions. I will let you know my results.

Thanks again for the recipe.  ;D

MWTC  :chef:

Offline Anis

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #132 on: June 30, 2007, 06:55:17 AM »
Even if it's for a restaurant, I don't understand the need to make more sauce than what's storable in the refrigerator. 

It's probably because it's going to be used immediately.  The pizza sauce sometimes don't reach the refrigerator.  I use 2 kilos of tomato sauce for pizza sauce (uncooked) per batch, 2-3 batches per day.  When I have some left after the day I put it in the refrigerator.  Next day I heat it up because of the gelling. 

BTW, in my experience gelling also occurs without refrigeration.  I leave some in room temp and let it sit for maybe more than an hour it starts gelling, at this point I just use a wire whisk.  But I will try the MAE to remedy this.  I use fresh garlic and onions in my sauce (pureed in the food processor with some oil before mixing it with the tomato sauce with whisk by hand), now I know that's the reason behind the gelling.  (thumbs up) :)

Will have to figure out how to set microwave to 30% power first.   :)


Offline November

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #133 on: June 30, 2007, 09:00:34 AM »
It's probably because it's going to be used immediately.  The pizza sauce sometimes don't reach the refrigerator.

I don't understand what you're addressing here.  Are you giving a reason why sauce is stored in the freezer?  I ask because that's what I was talking about in the post you quoted.  It sounds like you're giving a reason why the sauce isn't refrigerated in your case.

Offline MWTC

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #134 on: July 02, 2007, 10:58:54 AM »
Sourdough Girl,

I made your Pizza Sauce over the weekend. 

Excellent recipe. A very nice alternative to a sweet sauce. It kind of reminds me of a Lasagna Sauce. I really liked it. A sophisticated taste, excellent.  :D

I am going to experiment with it a little to see what happens. First some sugar then some cayenne pepper. Have you tried either of these. I know you don't like a sweet sauce. If you have, what quantity of either would you recommend?

Thanks again for the recipe. Good job.

MWTC  :chef:
« Last Edit: July 02, 2007, 11:33:21 AM by MWTC »

Offline sourdough girl

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #135 on: July 02, 2007, 08:55:18 PM »
MWTC,

Thanks for the compliments!  I'm glad you like my sauce!

You're correct, I don't like sweet sauces... if I want sugar, I'll eat chocolate!   ;)

However, I DO like spicy food, so when I make pizza with this sauce, I sometimes add hot pepper flakes right when the pizza comes out of the oven... the surface is hot and moist enough to pull some flavor out of the flakes, but not overcook them.  I usually let my pizzas sit for about 5 minutes when they come out of the oven because I really don't care for molten cheese stuck to the roof of my mouth   :'(  I also don't usually spice the sauce up because sometimes DH is not in the mood for spicy and I am, so I can just dress my 1/3 of the pie with the pepper flakes.  I don't know how spicy you like your sauce... if I were you, I'd probably start with 1/4 t cayenne and 1/2 t sugar and work up from there.  If you're more adventurous, start with 1/2 t cayenne and see how that lights you up!

~sd
« Last Edit: July 02, 2007, 09:13:37 PM by sourdough girl »
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Offline 454Casull

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #136 on: August 07, 2007, 09:55:11 PM »
Sorry if this is too off-topic, but can anybody tell me if November's #2 sauce or a variant thereof is a good spaghetti sauce?

Offline sourdough girl

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #137 on: August 07, 2007, 10:39:27 PM »
454Casull,
I have not tried red.november's #2 sauce, so I cannot speak for it, but I use a variation of my sauce posted on the prior page of this thread for spaghetti...  the major difference being that I put the sauce, as posted, in a pan over medium heat and add red wine, maybe 1/3 cup, and let it simmer for about an hour.  Turns out pretty tasty, at least to me.  But, spaghetti sauce, just like pizza sauce, is very subjective.  I don't like a sweet sauce (which is why I started making my own... store bought sauces all have sugar added) so, if you like a sweeter sauce or your tomatoes are too acidic, you can add a tsp or two of sugar, to your taste.

Hope this helps!
~sd
Never trust a skinny cook!

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #138 on: January 10, 2008, 02:24:36 PM »
While looking for something else at the PMQ Think Tank, I stumbled upon the following thread regarding the treatment of dried herbs: http://thinktank.pmq.com/viewtopic.php?p=3600#3600. I was particularly interested in the post by "Steve at Stanislaus", which I took to be a post from someone at Stanislaus, one of the top producers of fresh-pack tomatoes used by many pizza operators. For convenience, I have copied and pasted this post below:

Most pizzerias add dry seasonings directly to the tomatoes and let them infuse overnight in the fridge. But heating seasonings in water may help speed the process. Because the flavor in aromatic seasonings like oregano, pepper, basil, etc are oil based, a potentially more effective way is to briefly heat dry seasonings in olive oil (or other vegetable oil) before stirring through the tomatoes. If a pizzeria is experiencing sauce "gelling" (harmless thickening) or flavor souring, heating seasonings in water or oil prior to adding to the sauce can help prevent either situations.

Peter

Offline November

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Re: Cooked vs Uncooked pizza sauce....
« Reply #139 on: January 10, 2008, 02:48:31 PM »
Heating oil in the microwave would be a potential hazard if one also added water to dissolve the water-soluble compounds.  Oil alone would dissolve less than water alone.  Alcohol would dissolve more than either.

One thing I didn't mention because I didn't know how people felt about alcohol in their sauce, is that you can use absolute alcohol instead of water and extract more in less time.  More because alcohol is a better solvent for plant resins, and less time because alcohol evaporates much more quickly.

Also, heating with oil only really makes sense if the sauce recipe calls for oil.  It's not like the oil is going to evaporate away like water or alcohol.  I find the timing of that PMQ post interesting.