Author Topic: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?  (Read 158589 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline norma427

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 21970
  • Location: Lancaster County, Pa.
    • learningknowledgetomakepizza
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1420 on: February 22, 2012, 11:55:14 AM »
Norma,

Can you compare the Groeb version of the MM#7 clone dough formulation with the other MM#7 clone dough formulations you have tried, and also in terms of the sweetness and color of the crust and crumb?

Peter

Peter,

The Groeb version of the MM#7 clone dough formulation was about the same as the other MM#7 dough formulations I have tried before in terms of the sweetness of the crust.  The crust and crumb were a little darker, but not by much.  I donít know, but think because the Groeb Golden A Molasses is something like the Golden Barrel Supreme Baking Molasses product that is why the results were almost the same.  The texture of the rim was even almost the same.  I think any kind of molasses that is about 14 grams of sugar for a tablespoon seems to work out well in the MM#7 clone dough formulation you set-forth, at least for me.  That also would include the Grandmaís Original Molasses in the MM#7 clone dough formulation.

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!


buceriasdon

  • Guest
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1421 on: February 22, 2012, 12:48:10 PM »
Peter, Norma and the few others who have contributed to this fine thread, I would have gladly participated but I've learned the hard way if I don't have the correct ingredients it's best not to get involved. In my case molasses. However I have enjoyed watching the process and have followed it since Tampa(Dave), then Biz and Peter first posted. I've learned a lot in the journey vicariously.
Don

Online Pete-zza

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 22072
  • Location: Texas
  • Always learning
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1422 on: February 22, 2012, 04:34:13 PM »
Don,

I believe you. Since you indicated an interest in Papa John's clone doughs, it would be natural to extend those to the MM clone doughs. They are both American style chain doughs with a relatively high sugar content and, while I haven't tried it, I suspect that it might be possible to bake MM clones in a conveyor oven using screens. In your case, I wondered whether you would be able to use a blend of your local all-purpose flour and the La Perla Integral flour to get the protein content up and use that blend with a suitable hydration value and agave syrup as a sweetener. However, two of the attributes of molasses is the tangy flavor and the dark color that you might not be able to get with the agave syrup alone.

Peter

Offline norma427

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 21970
  • Location: Lancaster County, Pa.
    • learningknowledgetomakepizza
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1423 on: February 22, 2012, 08:06:46 PM »
Don,

I have no idea if this would work for a MM clone dough if you would be interested in trying, but saw that in Mexico they sell Piloncillo which is a form of Mexican sugar that is dark brown in color.  It is known for its strong molasses flavor.  http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-piloncillo.htm and http://mexicanfood.about.com/od/mexicanfoodglossary/g/piloncillo.htm

Doesnít Mexico produce cane syrup?  I donít know but thought Coke uses cane syrup in some of its retro Coke, but could be wrong.  I would think Mexico would grow some cane sugar or make cane juice from it.  Do you know if they do?

Poor Peter would sure have to do some more calculations if you found some form of something to try for your pizzeria for a MM clone. Doesnít Mojito contain sugar cane juice?  Maybe I might be wrong and it might be evaporated cane juice.

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!

buceriasdon

  • Guest
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1424 on: February 23, 2012, 08:23:02 AM »
Norma, That's a brilliant idea! Piloncillo is available everywhere here, one of the primary uses is in the making of flan. Now all I have to do is reread all this topic :o And yes the Coca Cola tastes different than up north. Mexicans drink more Coke per person than anywhere in the world. My Coca Cola BBQ sauce started out as somewhat of a joke but I've got it tweaked to a point now I use it exclusively. Thanks for the great idea!
Donaldo

Offline Chicago Bob

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 10618
  • Location: North Carolina
  • Easy peazzy
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1425 on: February 23, 2012, 08:38:27 AM »
Go for it Donaldo!!   >:D

Bob
"Care Free Highway...let me slip away on you"

Offline norma427

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 21970
  • Location: Lancaster County, Pa.
    • learningknowledgetomakepizza
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1426 on: February 23, 2012, 08:58:36 AM »
Norma, That's a brilliant idea! Piloncillo is available everywhere here, one of the primary uses is in the making of flan. Now all I have to do is reread all this topic :o And yes the Coca Cola tastes different than up north. Mexicans drink more Coke per person than anywhere in the world. My Coca Cola BBQ sauce started out as somewhat of a joke but I've got it tweaked to a point now I use it exclusively. Thanks for the great idea!
Donaldo

Donaldo,

Although I am not really familiar with what Piloncillo is, does it have any Nutrition Facts on a package it comes in or is just sold without that information.  Maybe if you could find out some other information about Pinocillo at least you could give it a shot to see what happens.  I know you are the adventurous type in all the experiments you have done.  ;D Do they sell cane juice/syrup in Mexico?  I know you were playing around with a Cola Sauce, but didnít know you had perfected it.  Congrats to you!  :chef:

I agree with Bob, go for it!  >:D

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!

buceriasdon

  • Guest
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1427 on: February 23, 2012, 09:19:00 AM »
Norma, The cones are sold sometimes wrapped in kitchen wrap but most often not. There are two kinds, light and dark. I've never seen any info on them. Piloncillo is made from pure, unrefined sugar that is pressed into a cone shape and it does have a molasses flavor to it. Besides flan it's used to make Atole a hot thick drink thickened with masa(corn flour) and sweetened with piloncillo. It's quite popular.
Don

buceriasdon

  • Guest
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1428 on: February 23, 2012, 09:29:23 AM »
Peter, I have located a supplier of bulk flour, 44 kilo bags I will be buying from. One of my baker friends here, always good to have friends in the business, has provided me with samples from time to time and I'm guessing it's protein content to be 12.5. It has very good flavor and with the addition of some integral would make a very nice sweet crust.
Don

Offline norma427

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 21970
  • Location: Lancaster County, Pa.
    • learningknowledgetomakepizza
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1429 on: February 23, 2012, 09:38:48 AM »
Don,

These are some Nutrition Facts on some brands of Piloncillo http://caloriecount.about.com/calories-goya-piloncillo-brown-sugar-cane-i250314  http://caloriecount.about.com/calories-melissas-piloncillo-brown-sugar-cones-i115725  http://caloriecount.about.com/calories-bolners-fiesta-piloncillo-i269383  http://www.melissas.com/Products/Products/Piloncillo---Brown-Sugar-Cones.aspx  It appears the total carbohydrates (sugar) is lower than molasses products we have been trying in the MM clones. 

I am not sure, but would guess, that something liquid or something that brings the sugar content up would be needed to try Piloncillo in an MM clone dough.
http://www.jjdst.com/produce/index.cfm/category-mgmt/ethnic-specialties/sugar-cone/

Do you notice any difference in the molasses flavor when using light or dark Piloncillo in anything?  I would think the dark Piloncillo would have a stronger molasses flavor, but I sure donít know.

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!


Online Pete-zza

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 22072
  • Location: Texas
  • Always learning
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1430 on: February 23, 2012, 10:37:15 AM »
Don and Norma,

There is a good article on panela/piloncillo at the Wikipedia website at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panela. From what I can tell, the piloncillo is essentially all sucrose with some invert sugars (fructose and glucose). And, because the piloncillo includes some molasses, it is like a brown sugar in the U.S. I previously reported on light and brown sugars as a sweetener for an MM clone dough formulation at Reply 940 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3940.msg165477.html#msg165477. Thus, the piloncillo has to be viewed like it is essentially all sucrose with a modest color and flavor contribution from the molasses. However, to get much color, you would have to use so much that the sweetness would essentially become intolerable. One possibility might be to combine barley malt syrup and the piloncillo. The barley malt syrup is not as sweet as sucrose and has a caramel like taste that some liken to molasses but it would add color. This may not be comforting for Don to know if he can't get barley malt syrup in Mexico either.

Peter

Offline norma427

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 21970
  • Location: Lancaster County, Pa.
    • learningknowledgetomakepizza
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1431 on: February 23, 2012, 10:50:34 AM »
Peter,

That was a good article you referenced on panela/piloncillo.  I now see why piloncillo wouldnít work alone for Don to try a MM clone attempt. 

I wonder if Don might be able to find a product like Steenís in Mexico.  I know products that are easily found in the US like barley malt syrup or other products might be hard for Don to locate if he wants to try a MM clone. 

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!

Offline norma427

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 21970
  • Location: Lancaster County, Pa.
    • learningknowledgetomakepizza
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1432 on: February 23, 2012, 11:19:43 AM »
This is probably another crazy idea, and I sure donít know how it would work, but doesnít Mexico produce barley malt dry or barley liquid malt for making beers?  I never tried liquid barley malt for beer in pizza dough.  If Mexico does sell barley malt for beer maybe that could be combined with piloncillo.  Just my .02 cents.  :-D

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!

buceriasdon

  • Guest
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1433 on: February 23, 2012, 02:02:06 PM »
Norma, I have one place that I can ask for barley malt. In Spanish it's called malto de cebada. If not, all is not lost, I think with substituting my agave syrup(expensive) with your suggested piloncillo along with dry milk I can come up with a sweet dough that browns well.
Don

Offline FLJohnson

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 13
  • Location: Apex, North Carolina
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1434 on: February 23, 2012, 02:58:42 PM »
I thought I should just add a small correction to the terminology regarding barley malt (aka malted barley). What you are describing is actually barley malt extract (liquid or dry). Barley malt is actually the malted (germinated) grain of the barley plant. The grains are crushed and then "mashed" in warm water to allow the amylases in the malted barley to convert the starches in the grain to sugars. The sweet, sugary liquid is then rinsed from the mashed grain. This extract is then concentrated into a thick liquid or dried to the powder form.

Fred
« Last Edit: February 23, 2012, 03:02:34 PM by FLJohnson »

buceriasdon

  • Guest
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1435 on: February 23, 2012, 03:58:59 PM »
I am waiting for a reply: http://www.maltexco.com/productos/extractos-de-malta
No one locally carries barley malt.
Don
p.s. That was fast. I think I'll have to pass as the minimum order is a plastic or metal drum at 300 kilos or plastic bucket at 25 kilos. The reply I got said they have no smaller quantities or distributors closer than Guadalajara.
 
« Last Edit: February 23, 2012, 04:10:37 PM by buceriasdon »

Offline norma427

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 21970
  • Location: Lancaster County, Pa.
    • learningknowledgetomakepizza
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1436 on: February 23, 2012, 05:27:52 PM »
I am waiting for a reply: http://www.maltexco.com/productos/extractos-de-malta
No one locally carries barley malt.
Don
p.s. That was fast. I think I'll have to pass as the minimum order is a plastic or metal drum at 300 kilos or plastic bucket at 25 kilos. The reply I got said they have no smaller quantities or distributors closer than Guadalajara.
 


Don,

Sorry, the amount of barley malt you would need to purchase is too much for you to experiment with.  Maybe since you are going to be a pizza operator they might give you a sample to try.  At least some of the molasses products I have used on this thread were given to me as samples if I used the contact feature for molasses in some of the websites.  It is interesting to see what other countries carry or do not carry.

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!

Offline FLJohnson

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 13
  • Location: Apex, North Carolina
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1437 on: February 24, 2012, 09:00:16 AM »
One can purchase small amounts of liquid barley malt extract from any homebrew supply store, including mail order.

Fred

Offline FLJohnson

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 13
  • Location: Apex, North Carolina
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1438 on: February 24, 2012, 01:10:56 PM »
Norma:

I've been trying to figure out where your pizza place is located. Are you aware that your profile says, "Dutch County, PA" and not "Dutch Country, PA"?

Fred

Offline FLJohnson

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 13
  • Location: Apex, North Carolina
Re: Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?
« Reply #1439 on: February 24, 2012, 02:48:39 PM »
Suggestion for modifying Expanded Dough Calculator - Yes, this is realted to the Mellow Mushroom clone

Peter:

As I am filling in the gaps in my reading of the MM clone thread, I came across a few posts related to the thickness factor of MM 10" vs. 14" vs. 16" pizzas. The discussion was related to a different thickness factor for the 10" pizza relative to the other sizes. As I explored the Expanded Dough Calculator, I noticed that the calculator simply performs a calculation on the weight of the dough relative to the overall area of the pizza,  and it has no factor in it for the thickness of the rim of the pizza relative to the center. One apparent intent of the thickness factor is to allow one to scale the recipe up or down to achieve the same thickness of the pizza, but this thickness factor only applies to pizzas of uniform thickness from perimeter to the center. Considering pizzas like those at Mellow Mushroom, which have a thick rim, it seems to me that the recipe should be scaled up based on two changing dimensions: (1) the rim ring inside and outside diameters with its desired thickness and (2) the interior diameter of the pizza with its desired thickness. To make a small vs a large Mellow Mushroom pizza, the amount of dough would be a function of the change in these two separate dimensions. The area (and volume) of the rim plus the area (and volume) of the center. These two volumes are not in a contstant ratio as one goes from small to large pizzas, so the amount of dough for a 16" pizza with a thick, 1" rim is not a simple ratio to the area of a 10" pizza with the same thick, 1" rim.

It seems we need to add another factor in the calculator to adjust the recipes based on the relative thickness of the rim vs the center of the pizza and the varying dimensions of these. This would result in recipe scaling that would come much closer to having a constant thickness of pizza in the center and in the rim than does the current version of the calculator.

What do you think?
« Last Edit: February 24, 2012, 03:21:25 PM by FLJohnson »