Mellow Mushroom Pizza found in Atlanta and surroundin areas...Recipes?

[norma427]

Norma

[norma427]

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

Can you clarify the two numbers 18.78 and 21.73 in Reply 1576? Specifically, are they reversed in Reply 1576?

With respect to the oil that you extracted that has some water along with it, you might let the mixture sit, preferably at a warm temperature, to let the water part evaporate. You could also do this by heating the mixture to around 212 degrees F to expedite the evaporation of the water. Then, the oil can be weighed again (e.g., by subtracting the weight of the container with the oil from the weight of the container with the water and the oil).

I hummed when carrying it out to the freezer so I wouldn’t spill any of its contents last evening.

I got a kick out of your humming to keep from spilling the contents of the glass. Apparently if you use a tray and don't look at the item carried, you can achieve the same result, at least according to http://www.fluther.com/100342/how-do-people-in-cafes-carry-coffees-without-spilling-them/ .

Peter

[norma427]

Norma,

Can you clarify the two numbers 18.78 and 21.73 in Reply 1576? Specifically, are they reversed in Reply 1576?

With respect to the oil that you extracted that has some water along with it, you might let the mixture sit, preferably at a warm temperature, to let the water part evaporate. You could also do this by heating the mixture to around 212 degrees F to expedite the evaporation of the water. Then, the oil can be weighed again (e.g., by subtracting the weight of the container with the oil from the weight of the container with the water and the oil).

I got a kick out of your humming to keep from spilling the contents of the glass. Apparently if you use a tray and don't look at the item carried, you can achieve the same result, at least according to http://www.fluther.com/100342/how-do-people-in-cafes-carry-coffees-without-spilling-them/ .

Peter

Peter,

I made a mistake when I was trying to think and type in what I posted at Reply 1576 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3940.msg178057.html#msg178057  I meant to post that before the oil was put into the measuring cup I weighed just the measuring cup and it weighed 18.78 grams.  After the oil was put into the measuring cup I measured both the measuring cup and oil and it then weighed 21.73 grams.  That is how I came to the number of weight for the oil (and probably some ice) of 2.95 grams.  I will correct that. 

Oh my, I already put the oil back into the mixture in the glass.  Don’t tell me I will have to refreeze the whole mixture again to try and weigh the oil again that was in the dough ball.  Another mess. 

I was always kind of doplic (Pa. Dutch talk) when I was younger and still am, so my dad always told me to hum when I was carrying something that was full.  It works.  Glad you got a kick out of me posting I hummed as I was trying to carry the full glass container out to the freezer.

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Oh my, I already put the oil back into the mixture in the glass.  Don’t tell me I will have to refreeze the whole mixture again to try and weigh the oil again that was in the dough ball.  Another mess. 

Norma,

Don't worry about it. When I make my next MM clone dough, I will make some extra dough to see if I can come up with the weight of the oil. Your test actually was a good one since it leads me to believe that even with some water in with the oil there may be a way of isolating the oil from the water using the method I suggested.

Off and on I have been trying to think of ways of doing the isolation, and I even ran some rough tests, but they did not work.

Peter

[norma427]

Peter,

I might freeze the whole mixture again, but think I will use a bigger glass bowl for another oil test because I sure don‘t want that sticky mess again.  I am having fun watching the mixture bubbling or fermenting again right now.  That fermentation (if it really is fermentation) is interesting to watch.  Steve gave me an explanation what might be happening other than fermentation, but I forget exactly what he said.   

Will be interested (when you have time to figure out how the gluten mass test worked out, or want to do those calculations) in the numbers compared to the last gluten mass test with the leftover dough ball using warm water.

I also tried to think of ways to try and isolate the oil someway like using a gravy separator or other devices, but couldn’t think of any way that would work.

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Will be interested (when you have time to figure out how the gluten mass test worked out, or want to do those calculations) in the numbers compared to the last gluten mass test with the leftover dough ball using warm water.

Norma,

Can you refresh my memory by giving me the numbers for the MM leftover clone dough that you mentioned above? I can come up with the ingredient quantities for the most recent 5-ounce MM clone dough based on using KASL and the Golden Barrel Supreme Baking Molasses in the MM#7 clone dough formulation. The most important ingredient is the amount of flour since all of the gluten is formed from the flour. If the two dough balls are not of the same starting weight, I may have to play around with the numbers to try to equalize them for the two dough balls.

Peter

[norma427]

Norma,

Can you refresh my memory by giving me the numbers for the MM leftover clone dough that you mentioned above? I can come up with the ingredient quantities for the most recent 5-ounce MM clone dough based on using KASL and the Golden Barrel Supreme Baking Molasses in the MM#7 clone dough formulation. The most important ingredient is the amount of flour since all of the gluten is formed from the flour. If the two dough balls are not of the same starting weight, I may have to play around with the numbers to try to equalize them for the two dough balls.

Peter

Peter,

At Reply 1529 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3940.msg175975.html#msg175975 is where I was doing the gluten mass test on the 4.7 ounce dough ball from Reply 1527 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3940.msg175958.html#msg175958  You dissected my 4.7 ounce dough ball at Reply 1539 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3940.msg176074.html#msg176074  You also did calculations at Reply 1543 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3940.msg176100.html#msg176100

You really don’t have to do those calculations again since the leftover MM clone dough ball and the 5 ounce dough ball aren’t the same.

Norma

[Pete-zza]

You really don’t have to do those calculations again since the leftover MM clone dough ball and the 5 ounce dough ball aren’t the same.

Norma,

That's no problem. You know me and how I like to unravel the mysteries of the MM clone doughs .

Here is what the two dough balls look like, along with your gluten mass values:

4.7-Ounce MM Clone Dough: MM#7

KASL Flour (100%): Water (Spring Water) (51%): IDY (0.60%): Salt (1.5%): 1-2-3 Vegetable Oil (2.46%): Golden Barrel Supreme Baking Molasses (11.5%): Total (167.06%):

79.61 g  |  2.81 oz | 0.18 lbs 40.6 g  |  1.43 oz | 0.09 lbs 0.48 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.16 tsp | 0.05 tbsp 1.19 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.21 tsp | 0.07 tbsp 1.96 g | 0.07 oz | 0 lbs | 0.43 tsp | 0.14 tbsp 9.16 g | 0.32 oz | 0.02 lbs 133 g | 4.69 oz | 0.29 lbs | TF = N/A

Norma's measured gluten mass = 48.22 grams/1.7009 ounces

5.0-Ounce MM Clone Dough: MM#7

KASL Flour (100%): Water (Spring Water) (51%): IDY (0.60%): Salt (1.5%): 1-2-3 Vegetable Oil (2.46%): Golden Barrel Supreme Baking Molasses (11.5%): Total (167.06%):

84.85 g  |  2.99 oz | 0.19 lbs 43.27 g  |  1.53 oz | 0.1 lbs 0.51 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.17 tsp | 0.06 tbsp 1.27 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.23 tsp | 0.08 tbsp 2.09 g | 0.07 oz | 0 lbs | 0.46 tsp | 0.15 tbsp 9.76 g | 0.34 oz | 0.02 lbs 141.75 g | 5 oz | 0.31 lbs | TF = N/A

Norma's measured gluten mass = 53.21 grams/1.873 ounces

Since the two dough balls were not the same weight, I did two scalings, one up from 4.7 ounces to 5 ounces, and one down from 5 ounces to 4.7 ounces. I did the scalings based on the amounts of flour in the two test MM clone doughs since that is where the gluten resides once combined with water. For the up scaling, I got 51.394 grams gluten vs. 53.21 grams gluten, or a difference of 3.53%, and for the down scaling, I got 49.92 grams gluten versus 48.22 grams gluten, or a difference of 3.41%. I think those variances are not out of line, and the fact that the percent changes are so close to each other is a good sign that your performance of the gluten mass tests has been consistent. Of course, the numbers assume that the 4.7-ounce (actually 4.69-ounce) and 5.0-ounce dough balls were at exactly at those values.

Peter

[norma427]

Norma,

That's no problem. You know me and how I like to unravel the mysteries of the MM clone doughs .

Here is what the two dough balls look like, along with your gluten mass values:

4.7-Ounce MM Clone Dough: MM#7

KASL Flour (100%): Water (Spring Water) (51%): IDY (0.60%): Salt (1.5%): 1-2-3 Vegetable Oil (2.46%): Golden Barrel Supreme Baking Molasses (11.5%): Total (167.06%):

79.61 g  |  2.81 oz | 0.18 lbs 40.6 g  |  1.43 oz | 0.09 lbs 0.48 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.16 tsp | 0.05 tbsp 1.19 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.21 tsp | 0.07 tbsp 1.96 g | 0.07 oz | 0 lbs | 0.43 tsp | 0.14 tbsp 9.16 g | 0.32 oz | 0.02 lbs 133 g | 4.69 oz | 0.29 lbs | TF = N/A

Norma's measured gluten mass = 48.22 grams/1.7009 ounces

5.0-Ounce MM Clone Dough: MM#7

KASL Flour (100%): Water (Spring Water) (51%): IDY (0.60%): Salt (1.5%): 1-2-3 Vegetable Oil (2.46%): Golden Barrel Supreme Baking Molasses (11.5%): Total (167.06%):

84.85 g  |  2.99 oz | 0.19 lbs 43.27 g  |  1.53 oz | 0.1 lbs 0.51 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.17 tsp | 0.06 tbsp 1.27 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.23 tsp | 0.08 tbsp 2.09 g | 0.07 oz | 0 lbs | 0.46 tsp | 0.15 tbsp 9.76 g | 0.34 oz | 0.02 lbs 141.75 g | 5 oz | 0.31 lbs | TF = N/A

Norma's measured gluten mass = 53.21 grams/1.873 ounces

Since the two dough balls were not the same weight, I did two scalings, one up from 4.7 ounces to 5 ounces, and one down from 5 ounces to 4.7 ounces. I did the scalings based on the amounts of flour in the two test MM clone doughs since that is where the gluten resides once combined with water. For the up scaling, I got 51.394 grams gluten vs. 53.21 grams gluten, or a difference of 3.53%, and for the down scaling, I got 49.92 grams gluten versus 48.22 grams gluten, or a difference of 3.41%. I think those variances are not out of line, and the fact that the percent changes are so close to each other is a good sign that your performance of the gluten mass tests has been consistent. Of course, the numbers assume that the 4.7-ounce (actually 4.69-ounce) and 5.0-ounce dough balls were at exactly at those values.

Peter

Peter,

I know how you like to solve any mysteries with any doughs, so I am thankful you did the calculations.  The MM clone doughs and tests on gluten masses, oil tests, coloration, molasses and cloning has been really interesting for me. 

Thanks for explaining why you had to do two scalings and how you did that. 

I know the 5 ounce MM#7 clone dough was exactly (or should be) at the right values, because I used my small scale to do all the small measurements, but I am not sure about 4.7 ounce leftover MM#7 clone dough ball, because I didn’t use accurate measurements in small weights for the small measurements for that dough ball.  I guess the actual weight of 4.69 ounce is from the 133 grams when I weighed it.

As a side note, I have been watching the oil test ferment (or at least I think that is what it is doing) and took a video when it started to ferment and now have been watching how the top is getting frothy and looks like it is fermenting a lot more.  I am going to take another video of how it looks maybe at its peak of fermenting, before I try to freeze it again for the second oil test.  I sure don’t know why it is so interesting to me, but find anything to do with yeast fermenting interesting.  I also want to be able to show Steve the video’s.  I will post the videos later tonight for anyone that is interested.

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

There are a number of places where small errors can creep in, and they can also be cumulative. For example, the MM#7 dough formulation for the two MM clone doughs is based on the conversion values used in the expanded dough calculating tool. Those values can't be exact for the ingredients used to make the clone doughs. For example, there are at least a dozen cane syrup/molasses products that have been used or mentioned in the course of this thread. The expanded dough calculating tool can't handle all of those products from a conversion standpoint. You get only a single, generic conversion value. Then, to get the most accurate numbers, one should weigh each of the ingredients on an accurate scale, rather than using the less accurate generic volume measurements. And once the dough ball is made, it should be scaled to the exact desired weight (e.g., 5 ounces), using the same scale as was used to measure out the individual ingredients. To get that number to the desired degree of accuracy, the scale has to be accurate to say, 0.01 gram. Finally, whether it is the oil or the gluten mass that is to be weighed, the same degree of care is needed to weigh those ingredients. Of course, that means that the flour and oil to begin with also have to be accurately weighed out.

Peter

[norma427]

Norma,

There are a number of places where small errors can creep in, and they can also be cumulative. For example, the MM#7 dough formulation for the two MM clone doughs is based on the conversion values used in the expanded dough calculating tool. Those values can't be exact for the ingredients used to make the clone doughs. For example, there are at least a dozen cane syrup/molasses products that have been used or mentioned in the course of this thread. The expanded dough calculating tool can't handle all of those products from a conversion standpoint. You get only a single, generic conversion value. Then, to get the most accurate numbers, one should weigh each of the ingredients on an accurate scale, rather than using the less accurate generic volume measurements. And once the dough ball is made, it should be scaled to the exact desired weight (e.g., 5 ounces), using the same scale as was used to measure out the individual ingredients. To get that number to the desired degree of accuracy, the scale has to be accurate to say, 0.01 gram. Finally, whether it is the oil or the gluten mass that is to be weighed, the same degree of care is needed to weigh those ingredients. Of course, that means that the flour and oil to begin with also have to be accurately weighed out.

Peter

Peter,

Thanks for explaining where the places are that errors can creep in.  I know you always like to be precise in explaining everything.   I understand more now.

Norma

[norma427]

These two videos are for if anyone is interested in seeing how the oil test on the MM#7 clone 5 ounce oil test ferments or bubbles when left out at room temperature.  I think all the yeast is almost used up because there isn’t any bubbling anymore.  Even if the glass is shaken, only a few bubbles will come to the surface.  The first video is how the oil test bubbles after it starts for a little while and the second video is how the oil test bubbles after it really gets going.  The first picture is of the gluten mass test of what it looked like this afternoon and the second picture is of the oil test after it stopped bubbling.  I am not really sure of what was going on with the oil test bubbling.  I am going to try to freeze the oil test again to see if there can be an accurate reading on the oil amount in the 5 ounce MM#7 clone dough ball. 

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8IV1XbqnBo" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8IV1XbqnBo</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fHowpUhp2o" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fHowpUhp2o</a>

Norma

[CDNpielover]

I just finished the MM pie with 17% Crosby's Fancy Molasses - by far my best MM pie yet.  The dough was excellent, and we were able to detect a good amount of sweetness.  The crust was a tan/caramel color, but I certainly didn't think it was too dark.  The pizza was baked at 475 on stone in middle position.  It had PERFECT bottom browning (no pics, sorry), and I didn't have any issues whatsoever with blackening/burning (this was a problem for me in the past).  The crust was nice and moist.  For me, the key to this pizza is using a low baking temperature (in my previous attempts, I had cooked at 525 and 500).

I used Pete's PJ clone sauce.  This is a "Mexican" pizza, and has taco beef, fresh jalapenos, lettuce, chopped tomatoes, avacado, and a spiral of refried beans.  I also meant to add crushed tortilla chips, but I totally forgot when I was assembling the pie after taking it out of the oven! 

[norma427]

CDNpielover ,

I am glad your MM pie with 17% Crosby’s Fancy was by far your best MM pie.  It sure looks tasty.  Your rim looks nicely formed. 

Norma

[norma427]

The oil test was refrozen last evening for another oil test this morning.

I believe these results really aren’t accurate, but do believe using a bigger glass container and using a regular kitchen knife to scrape what appears to be the fat off the surface of the of the frozen mass is a step in the right direction of being able to do a oil test, after doing a gluten mass test using warm water.  Also doing a bake of whatever is scrapped off the surface seems like a good approach. 

The reasons I think this is a better approach is because of the steps listed below.

 1.  I used a small Pyrex bowl to put the oil test in and it seems like it is much easier to be able to then try to scrape off the oil from the frozen mass than in a drinking glass.

2  The same plastic measuring cup was used to try and weigh the oil and it weighed 18.78 grams (the same as it weighed before when no oil was added).  This time after the oil (or maybe some frozen substance was scrapped off with a kitchen knife) the container and substance weighed 22.22 grams or a weight difference of 3.44 grams.  I thought then I must have scrapped some more of the ice off. 

3  I then decided to take a stainless steel measuring cup and transfer the substance to that to be able to try and do a bake in the toaster oven to get any water out of the oil. The stainless steel measuring cup was used because I didn’t want to put a plastic container in the toaster oven.  I weighed the stainless steel measuring cup and it weighed 82.73 grams before any substance was added.  I might have not gotten all the substance out of the other plastic measuring cup, but it appeared like most of all of it was taken out of the plastic measuring cup.

4.  I then decided to scrape more of whatever might be on top of the frozen mass off incase there might be some more oil that I had missed.  Since I was going to do a bake to try and evaporate the water, I thought what would the harm be in adding more frozen substance in case more oil might be there that I missed.

5.  I am not really sure of the temperature accuracy of my toaster oven and don’t have my IR gun at home, so I just watched and turned up the toaster oven dial a little until I thought it was hot enough so the water might evaporate. 

6.  The frozen substance (by that time it turned to liquid) and oil were baked for 40 minutes.

I really don’t think the numbers in grams of the oil after the bake in the toaster oven are relevant (because of me doing a oil test yesterday and transferring the oil test different times into different measuring cups and different glass containers, but I think that Peter was right in trying a bake on whatever is scrapped off the top of the frozen mass.  I guess only more tests will show if that is true.  I tasted what appeared to be oil after the bake and it tasted and felt like oil, even though it was a browner color.

Norma

[norma427]

Norma

[norma427]

Norma

[norma427]

Norma

[norma427]

I just wanted to add one addition to my last post about the oil test.  I tasted several times again what appears to be the oil left after the bake and it tastes really salty.  I only had put a little of the oil on the tip of my tongue before and didn’t notice the salt taste.  It now makes me wonder if somehow the salt freezes with the oil and even after the bake if the salt stays in the oil from the dough. 

Norma