Author Topic: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM  (Read 2873 times)

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Offline Bill/SFNM

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Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« on: October 31, 2006, 02:39:50 PM »
I really wanted to like this place that just opened last week with a wood-burning brick oven. Before they opened, I briefly chatted with the owner who told me they used Caputo 00 Pizzeria flour in an 800F oven using commercial yeast. All wood - no gas for fuel.

So today with high expectations, my wife and a foodie friend and I gave it a try. Now I wasn't expecting this to be another Bianco's (did you know Chris B. cooked pies here in Santa Fe before he fled to Phoenix due to allergies?). But it wouldn't take much of an effort to surpass the other pizza joints in this small town (although there are 2 other relatively new places I have yet to try).

I ordered a Margherita, my wife ordered a lunch-sized pie with a Caesar salad, and our friend ordered one loaded with peppers, pepperoni, sausage, cheese, and sauce.

The server was friendly, but it took about 30 minutes for our order to come out even though we were the only patrons. 

Bottom line: very disappointed. The pie looked decent, but the crust in the middle was way soggy and the edge was hard; as it cooled, the whole pie got even harder. Not at all like any of the pies I have enjoyed in Naples. The sauce and the cheese weren't anything memorable.

Too bad. I was hoping for more. Santa Fe, for being such a small town, has some great restaurants, but if you're visiting this area, you'll probably want to avoid pizza.

Bill/SFNM



Offline David

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2006, 03:01:44 PM »
Any more info on the oven Bill?
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Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2006, 03:29:38 PM »
Any more info on the oven Bill?

David,

It was clearly a prebuilt job. I had intended to get more info, but after tasting the pies, I didn't see the point.

Bill/SFNM

Offline varasano

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2006, 04:07:34 PM »
That's a great looking pie. Usually I can tell a lot by just the looks. But as I've said, commercial yeast is the kiss of death...

Offline scott r

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2006, 04:28:19 PM »
commercial yeast is the kiss of death...

Jeff, I am as huge a believer in wild yeast as you, but I have to totally disagree here.  Hopefully you can visit Naples soon to see what a properly made pizza with commercial yeast can be like.

Magical is one word that comes to mind.

I can pretty much guarantee that the problem with the hardening of this dough was how the dough was managed possibly during, and probably after mixing.


After trying score of places using wild yeast and not I know Uppercrust, and I think also David actually decided their favorite pizza in Naples was from a place using commercial yeast. 
I think that just like you preach on your website, the main factor is the mixing and dough handling, not ingredients.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2006, 04:43:52 PM by scott r »

Offline varasano

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2006, 04:44:09 PM »
Well I'll have to try it and see. I just got back from a pizza tour in NY and I had 10 pies.  I used to really love some of these places. But once you get past the char flavor, I realize that there's nothing behind it. The dough itself was tasteless on every one, except DiFara's.  FYI (UPN was closed). I think my palate has changed a lot and I'm much more sensitive. It's like when you've been drinking wine for years and you start tasting things you never noticed before.  Without a starter, I'm just tasting next to nothing with these doughs. The whole experience was eye opening for me.

But I trust your judgement and I'll have to get to Naples and see.




Offline scott r

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2006, 04:47:09 PM »
Jeff, I am with you about the flavor.  Whenever I eat a pie without a wild yeast starter I feel like there is something missing, no matter how great everything else is.  You can certainly achieve an excellent texture without, though.

I am excited to hear that De Faras had a good crust while you are there.  I am definitely going to try them again soon.  I have only been there once and the dough really let me down so I never went back.

Offline varasano

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2006, 05:04:19 PM »
Scott, I know you run a lot of tests.  You have access to 800F, yes?

Offline scott r

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2006, 05:18:03 PM »
well, the metal on the back of my oven can get up to 850, but I doubt the actual air around my pizza is that high, and the stone is usually around 700 for things to go right in my oven.  As you know I prefer to talk about pies in the amount of time they take, not a temp.

I get 2 minute pies, but as we have discussed before every now and then all the stars align and I get a dough that finishes a little faster.

Offline David

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2006, 06:02:04 PM »
That's a great looking pie. Usually I can tell a lot by just the looks. But as I've said, commercial yeast is the kiss of death...

I don't know how you can tell the difference visually from a dough using a starter or commercial yeast,how can you tell?I would agree that i think the pizza looks good but to my eyes it's lacking a healthy dose of EVOO,
                                   David
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Offline varasano

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2006, 06:31:09 PM »
> I don't know how you can tell the difference visually from a dough using a starter or commercial yeast,how can you tell?I

That was kind of my point. I can tell temp. I can tell mixing technique to a large degree. but flavor is harder. I can't really tell which yeast is used.

Jeff

Offline David

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2006, 06:48:45 PM »
Sorry Jeff,I missed that.I sometimes wonder about the natural starters and as they can run the gamut between very mild and strong,I really think I shoul try some commercial yeast one day and do a side by side comparrison.Scott is correct IMO about his observations in Naples re ; the use of commercial yeast.
                                                   David
If you're looking for a date... go to the Supermarket.If you're looking for a wife....go to the Farmers market

Offline shango

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2006, 10:41:08 PM »
"I don't know how you can tell the difference visually from a dough using a starter or commercial yeast,how can you tell?"

Well, I could be talking out of my butt here, but, In my recent experiments with wild yeast I have found that the crust will have more oven spring with commercial yeast.  Meaning it will puff up higher...Not a lot higher, just a little.



The taste is a completely different story....
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Offline sumeri

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2006, 01:06:36 AM »
Sorry to rehash an old post, but I haven't had the time to check out the board in a while.
This is the first I have ever heard of this pizzeria and do not know the owner or anything about what he is doing in terms of quality.
In his defense, from someone that has taken the plunge from making a couple of pizzas for family and friends to making a couple hundred for the public, bad days can and do happen.  I had days before opening the pizzeria when I was making pizza for the family and the dough didn't rise properly or over rised or what ever and we would just go out for burgers or something.  You can't just close the pizzeria and turn away 200 people because it was hotter than you expected and the dough over rised a little, you have to make the best of it.
My point is that I hope you will give the place another try.  Again it may not be a great place, but speaking from experience the poor guy might have just been having a bad day. 

Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2006, 01:22:09 AM »
Great point. Of course I will give it another try. I was planning to give them some time to get their act together, but haven't been in a rush since my first experience was not so good.

I have great admiration for those of you who have tried to make a business out of high-end pizza - it can't be easy to maintain consistent high-quality. I hope to visit your pizzeria if I am ever in Las Vegas.

Bill/SFNM


Offline pizzanapoletana

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Re: Farragamo's Neapolitan Pizza - Santa Fe, NM
« Reply #15 on: November 30, 2006, 05:39:02 AM »
Sorry to rehash an old post, but I haven't had the time to check out the board in a while.
This is the first I have ever heard of this pizzeria and do not know the owner or anything about what he is doing in terms of quality.
In his defense, from someone that has taken the plunge from making a couple of pizzas for family and friends to making a couple hundred for the public, bad days can and do happen.  I had days before opening the pizzeria when I was making pizza for the family and the dough didn't rise properly or over rised or what ever and we would just go out for burgers or something.  You can't just close the pizzeria and turn away 200 people because it was hotter than you expected and the dough over rised a little, you have to make the best of it.
My point is that I hope you will give the place another try.  Again it may not be a great place, but speaking from experience the poor guy might have just been having a bad day. 


Indeed a great point! it is something that in this board get often overlooked at and should actually be a reminder of any talks about commercial "artisan" pizza. However, As a famous London restaurant critic put it, is the place charging full prices while they get their act together, or are they charging promotional prices? If they are charging full prices, then they do not deserve a second chance.