Author Topic: Oil with high-protein flour  (Read 2121 times)

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Offline gschwim

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Oil with high-protein flour
« on: December 09, 2006, 11:12:27 PM »
I want to try the recipe for "Gemelli's Pizza' in the book, Artisan Baking:

According to the book, Gemelli's uses a mix of 75% high-protein (14%) and 25% 00 flour, to approximate the protein content of bread flour.  The specific recipe in the book is:

3-1/2% (100%) unbleached bread flour
1/4 tsp (0.02%) instant yeast
2 tsp (2%) salt
1-1/2 (66%) water

As can be seen, there is no oil.  I had been under the impression that, as Peter Reinhart's books say, that when using bread flour, it is necessary to add some olive oil, otherwise the resulting crust will be too tough.  Does the above recipe, from an apparently successful restaurant, mean that one does not need to add oil to bread dough?  Has anyone here tried Gemelli's pizza and, if so, what was the crust like?

Offline November

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Re: Oil with high-protein flour
« Reply #1 on: December 10, 2006, 12:30:58 AM »
The oil isn't necessary, but it is desirable.  To say it will be too tough without oil is rather subjective.  The first rule to following a recipe is to follow the recipe.  If you don't like the results, go back and modify it.

Also, assuming that you are using Caputo 00 Extra Blu flour with 9.5% protein, and King Arthur Sir Lancelot flour with 14.2% protein, you may find a mix of 68% KASL and 32% 00 to be more like bread flour (12.7% protein), but like I said, follow the recipe first.

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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Oil with high-protein flour
« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2006, 10:07:59 AM »

Tom Lehmann addressed the question of using oil in a pizza dough at :

Is it possible to make a pizza dough/crust without any oil or shortening?
Yes it is. In fact it is commonly done. The oil or shortening in the dough helps it to retain some of those great flavors released during baking, but it isnít necessary to add any oil or shortening to the dough to make a good quality crust. Since oil/shortening is a tenderizer you might find that your crust is a little chewier, but in a pizza crust this is seldom to the point of being objectionable. If you are forming your dough skins by pressing you will probably need to adjust the water content (absorption) of the dough upwards by three to five percent of the flour weight. The reason for this is because oil/shortening is a lubricant that helps the dough to be spread into a dough skin under the pressure of the press. Without the fat in the dough there is a possibility of the dough tearing as it is pressed into shape. If you experience this problem after eliminating the fat, the increase in water absorption should help to correct the problem.


EDIT (1/25/13): Since the above link to the Lehmann article is no longer operative, see the Wayback Machine link to the same article at
« Last Edit: January 25, 2013, 04:36:05 PM by Pete-zza »

Offline gschwim

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Re: Oil with high-protein flour
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2006, 06:51:23 PM »
Thanks, Pete.  I just made a batch of the recipe at the top of this thread, adding 2 tbsp. of olive oil.  I'll leave it out in the next batch and see if I notice a difference.


Offline grovemonkey

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Re: Oil with high-protein flour
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2006, 12:07:41 AM »
I have the book by Pete R. and I've been making the NY style he uses in that book which uses a lot of oil compared to what the Lehman Recipe suggests.  He also has Napolatien sytle crust recipe that doesn't use any oil, I am pretty sure.  That NY style crust in his book isn't bad but the current recipe I am using (lehman style) seems to cook up better for me, using about 63% hydration.  Have you had a good result using that recipe? I found my crust to be a bit too soft and bready for my tastes, but it's definitely edible (of course I will eat anything) and I think if I had a better oven setup I could turn out a tastier pizza.