Author Topic: In search of the perfect crust  (Read 8778 times)

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Offline November

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2007, 08:48:21 PM »
SemperFi,

The KD-7000 is a very nice scale.† The iBalance i5500 is even better, but I figured most people don't want to spend around $200 for a scale to use in their kitchen.† The iBalance i5500 even compensates for temperature, since things become lighter (more buoyant really) as the temperature increases, and the load cells expand (as most things do) in higher temperatures.† This is a feature usually found in much more expensive scientific scales.† I hope you will be satisfied with whatever scale you decide to purchase.

- red.november
« Last Edit: January 14, 2007, 08:52:24 PM by November »


Offline SemperFi

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2007, 08:53:25 PM »
You know its weird.  I started out thinking I knew quite a bit about baking pizzas..heck never had any complaints before. But then I venture into this forum,  and I realize that I am a babe in the woods in this world.  The collective knowledge of this site is immense.  Thanks again on the gouge of the KD-7000.  Now just gotta convince my wife that I need another toy for the kitchen.  Hee hee :o
Adam

Offline SemperFi

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #22 on: January 15, 2007, 01:01:53 PM »
The deed is done. Unfortunately though "Save on Scales"  was out of stock.  Did go to Oldwillknottscales.com, and got it shipped and all for just under $59.  3 days to wait, and then its party time!!!  Thanks alot November for the direction.  I can't wait to see just how far off my old recipe is after I weigh it.  Should be fun.  Thanks again all!   Adam
Adam

Offline Jimmy V

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #23 on: January 14, 2008, 04:19:23 PM »
Amazing, I worked on my crust for YEARS... a  "Thin but AIRY crust. Specialty high Gluten that I ordered on line, then other specialty flours, let it rise in the fridge slowly, different yeasts, finally bought a dvd on how to make the perfect pizza, you know what I got in the end ? Fustrated and poor results.I dont know HOW many recipes I tried.
Then I found THE PERFECT crust, for me anyway. It's DKM's
Thin ,Crisp & Crackery Crust. I have made this about 20 times with perfect results every time.

3 1/2 cups  All purpose flour
3/4 water  at about 90-100 degree F
3 teaspoons  vegetable oil
1 1/2 teaspoons sugar
1 teaspoon salt  ( I use sea salt )
1 1/2 teaspoons   Active dry yeast.

Thats it !!! No big science, No specialty flour..........  SIMPLE !

pour 75 % of the water and all the oil into your Kitchen Aid mixer bowl. Mix the yeast with the remaining water and allow to proof for 5 minutes, (I throw a pinch of sugar into the yeast also ) you actually SEE the yeast proofing, it'll get foamy on top.
 throw everything else into the bowl after the yeast proofs. I  hand mix 2 cups of flour  first then start the mixer on slow speed and add the remaining 1 1/2 cups. let that mix for 10 minutes. It'll be slightly on the dry side when done. shape into a ball , throw it into a bowl and seal the bowl and let rise at room temp. I let mine rise 18-30 hours. it'll have the appearence of a humane brain when rising rather that a smooth dough ball.
Pre-heat your oven AND stone at 500 for at least 1/2 hour.  take the dough out and roll it out THIN with your rolling pin, I'm talking about 1/16 of an inch, very thin. Then use a docker or fork etc. to put holes in the dough, put the dough on the stone, I par-bake mine for about 3-5 minutes, when you take it out of the oven it'll be stiff but not brown, throw the sauce and toppings on, I bake mine about another 6-7 minutes and watch the bottom of the crust, it usually browns before the toppings are completely done, then I shut the oven off and hit the broiler till the toppings and cheese are brown.
YOU WILL LOVE THIS RECIPE, please try it and let me know. Good luck

EDIT: Flour quantity corrected to read 3 1/2 cups.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2008, 02:23:25 PM by Pete-zza »

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #24 on: January 14, 2008, 04:47:55 PM »
No big science

Jimmy V,

How about a little science, with the same basic recipe, to allow many others to enjoy the recipe who might otherwise not?:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5762.msg49138.html#msg49138 (Reply 16);
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5762.msg49400.html#msg49400 (Reply 49);
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5762.msg49722.html#msg49722 (Reply 61);
plus many other examples by other members in the same thread.

Peter

Offline Jimmy V

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #25 on: January 14, 2008, 04:59:59 PM »
Peter, I definately see your point, but my point was, and this is just me........ FORGET the science, Forget the fancy ovens, FORGET the digital scales, and I did, and I made THE perfect crust.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #26 on: January 14, 2008, 07:21:18 PM »
Jimmy V,

I know that some people are perfectly happy to avoid using science and technology for certain parts of their lives. But, with all due respect, what you have described is a way of making a single pizza of a single size, even if you consider it to be perfect. However, what do you do if someone has a need or desire to make a different size pizza with the same characteristics as yours (such as crust thickness and texture), or to make, say, twenty essentially identical dough balls to make twenty essentially identical pizzas, or to increase or decrease the crust thickness to achieve a different crust characteristic? You are using volume measurements to achieve your results, but I can think of at least a half dozen ways of measuring out flour by volume, and each will produce different results because the weights will be different. And even if you tell someone exactly how you measured out your ingredients so that they can follow in your footsteps to make that perfect pizza, that doesnít help inform someone who wants or needs to make large numbers of pizzas how to do it without just repeating a recipe over and over again for the desired number of pizzas. 

These are the kinds of issues that the dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html was designed to address. It is science based, but why not take advantage of what it can do? Admittedly, to make the most effective use of the tool, one will want to have a scale, preferably a digital one, which is also a product of science. But the tool will do all the calculations of the weights of all the ingredients that are necessary to make any size pizza, with any desired crust thickness, and in any number up to 999 pizzas. And, except for the flour and water, which are recited by weight only, the tool provides volume measurements (using the largest volume measure in each case so that you donít end up with numbers like 80 teaspoons of something) as well as weights for all of the other ingredients. Since the DKM recipe is already stated with bakerís percents, using the tool takes almost no time to come up with the answers, whether it is for one pizza of one size or hundreds of them. Since science is used so effectively in so many aspects of our lives, why not embrace it to make better pizzas too when it makes sense to do so?

Peter

Offline Jimmy V

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #27 on: January 14, 2008, 07:33:14 PM »
Peter, as I mentioned, some people like to get all "rocket science" about recipes..... I DONT ! If some people like to get super technical, knock yourselves out.  I dont need the digital scale, specialty flour, etc. etc. I've been a self -employed lab technician for the past 27 years, I deal with enough "science" and technical data as it is on a daily basis.
 While I certainly appreciate the "technical" aspect of cooking and baking, I am here to make a true and VALID statement that, baking  the "perfect" pizza crust doesnt HAVE to be science.
 For some people such as myself, a simple, basic recipe that WORKS, is absolutely fantastic, and thats what I gave here, for the minority of us that do NOT like to get all technical. In short, this recipe is SIMPLE, and it is not technical, and it WORKS.

Offline November

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #28 on: January 14, 2008, 08:23:27 PM »
I am reminded of a similar conversation about providing dough recipes in a way such that reproducibility and consistency for multiple parties was assured, or at least much more probable.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,4705.0.html

Jimmy,

What Peter has calmly (perhaps with unnatural calmness) tried to explain to you is for everyone else's benefit, not yours.  If you don't care whether everyone else can achieve that same "perfect" crust you achieve, so be it.  However, that raises the question of why you posted it in the first place.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2008, 08:25:33 PM by November »

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #29 on: January 14, 2008, 08:42:00 PM »
Jimmy,

I was not trying to get you to change your methods, or to discourage anyone else from using them, but rather to point out that there are effective ways to do things that are based on science. Had you not mentioned science in the way you did, I would have had no cause to even respond. I mentioned the tool as one good example of achieving certain advantages, but earlier I had referenced other uses of science that would work even with your methods. I agree with you that the DKM recipe is a good one, and I have stated so before, but if I can find ways to improve it using science and expand its range of use, I will do it and let others know so that they can benefit also if they so desire. Our membership extends from individuals wanting to make only a single pizza well to professionals who run significant business operations. So, it will not be surprising that you will see content directed to the needs of all types of members. We don't separate beginners from professionals. It's a community in which everyone gets to see everything. And they are free to pick and choose as they like.

Peter


Offline November

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #30 on: January 14, 2008, 08:50:55 PM »
In addition, one of the most poignant things stated in the aforementioned thread was:

Quote
I have absolutely no quarrel if one chooses just to measure out flour by volume--using any method. But on several occasions I have witnessed that the person doing so will come back later when the results do not pan out and essentially "blame" either the recipe or the author of the recipe, even when the recipe has been proven to be a reliable one over and over again. I know from my own diagnostic experience that it is very difficult under these circumstances to correct whatever problems the person experienced. Using weights for flour and water does not cure every problem but it does eliminate most problems associated with these ingredients in an otherwise functional recipe.

Offline Jimmy V

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #31 on: January 14, 2008, 09:52:07 PM »
I totally understand and agree with your point as well. I have really learned a lot in this forum and hope to exchange many more ideas as time goes by. Thank all of you for your suggestions and recipes.

Offline Bryan S

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #32 on: January 14, 2008, 11:38:17 PM »
Amazing, I worked on my crust for YEARS... a  "Thin but AIRY crust. Specialty high Gluten that I ordered on line, then other specialty flours, let it rise in the fridge slowly, different yeasts, finally bought a dvd on how to make the perfect pizza, you know what I got in the end ? Fustrated and poor results.I dont know HOW many recipes I tried.
Then I found THE PERFECT crust, for me anyway. It's DKM's
Thin ,Crisp & Crackery Crust. I have made this about 20 times with perfect results every time.
"The pefect crust" is a matter of opinion, like most things in life.  ;) But your perfect crust is a thin crackery crust. While my favorite crust is a NY Style pizza. So what you think is "the perfect crust" and what I think is "the perfect crust" is night and day. What's my point? You like what you like and not everyone else is going to like it also. So I dissagree that it's the perfect crust for me. DKM, I mean no dissrespect to you or your recipe.   :'(
Making great pizza and learning new things everyday.

Offline Jimmy V

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #33 on: January 15, 2008, 11:15:28 AM »
perhaps you need to go back and SLOWLY read my post, and I quote myslf
" Then I found THE PERFECT crust, for ME anyway"

Offline asheborobluecomets

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #34 on: January 15, 2008, 10:33:55 PM »
I'm fairly new to this forum & think it is great & full of knowledge. I too said the heck with formulations & weighing & made the perfect crust for ME. When I invited friends over to eat the "perfect" crust I couldn't duplicate it again. I now  believe to get consistancy I need to measure very accurate or weigh.
But my biggest critic was my wife because she knew I was making a mistake by not weighing.
YOU CAN NOT REPLACE EXPERIENCE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 :chef:

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #35 on: February 07, 2008, 08:35:20 PM »
YOU WILL LOVE THIS RECIPE, please try it and let me know. Good luck

Jimmy,

See Replies 138 and 139 starting at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5762.msg53443.html#msg53443.

Peter

Offline Park.Pizza

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Re: In search of the perfect crust
« Reply #36 on: February 07, 2008, 09:17:28 PM »
I use  a i300 scale. Picked it up on ebay new for $15. It works great.

http://www.myweigh.com/scales/medium-scales/i300-series


Tim
Throw me a slice, won't ya


 

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