Author Topic: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice  (Read 13263 times)

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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #20 on: January 29, 2007, 11:09:08 PM »
Mike,

Nice job. Thanks for putting the report together. It should help others if they decide to venture into the City to try the places you visited.

Was there a particular pizza that you sampled and would like to try out in your own home, even if you don't have a very high temperature oven?

Peter


Offline Bryan S

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2007, 01:14:18 AM »
BHC, great review, as i read the post when you were fighting to get some slices, i felt like i was in the Mosh pit with you. Great pics, and just hope I'll be able to do this someday, Thanks Bryan
Making great pizza and learning new things everyday.

Offline Boy Hits Car

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2007, 10:11:19 AM »
Mike,

Nice job. Thanks for putting the report together. It should help others if they decide to venture into the City to try the places you visited.

Was there a particular pizza that you sampled and would like to try out in your own home, even if you don't have a very high temperature oven?

Peter

Peter,

I would love to make a DiFara's Sicilian pie.  I searched the forum and it looks like no one has attempted to reverse engineer it, although I have seen some people request it on the forum.

From watching Dom make the Sicilian and from tidbits from the reverse engineer Difara thread of a few years ago, I can assume this much:

- Dom pre-bakes the crust before dressing the Sicilian.  The crust looked like it came out of the back of the restaurant at room temperature (they might have been in a cooler?).  They must have been made the night before or early in the morning.  They were already pretty charred on the edges and had a bit of sauce on the top, covering everything except the edges; probably to keep the top from burning and to keep it flat.  I'm assuming he uses an Italian type 00 flour mixed with All Trumps or another HG flour.

- He adds olive oil to the bottom of the pan right before dressing the pizza.  The olive oil is either Berrio Mild or extra virgin olive oil.  The pan is metal(steel most likely) and jet black and has about a 1" lip.

- He uses fresh mozz and sliced whole milk blocked mozz, both Grande Cheese.

- He pre-cooks the sauce, most likely using Vantia SM DOP tomatoes.

I'm not sure if high temps are absolutely necessary for the Sicilian, what are your thoughts on that?  Other things that would need further evaluating would be: What is in the sauce and how long is it cooked for?  Is the dough identical to the dough used for his round pizzas or is it modified in some way?  You would think he uses the same recipe for both doughs just to make things easier on himself, but who knows.

Mike

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2007, 04:25:23 PM »
Mike,

Your questions are good ones. There is no reason why the Sicilian crusts can't be pre-baked or par-baked and stored, either at room temperature (for near-term use) or in the cooler or even in the freezer. I'd be very surprised if Dom uses a different dough for his Sicilian pies, although there would be no reason not to use something other than the Vantia's for the sauce. I know for a fact that the sauce is cooked because I asked Dom's son who also told me that the only cooked sauce is for the Sicilian pies. I also saw the son cooking some sauce on the stove in the back area.

I don't think Dom's oven runs as hot as many believe. It is an old Bakers Pride deck oven, which usually runs at a temperature that is quite a bit lower than the coal- and wood-fired ovens. I think you could make a similar product in your standard home oven, but the results would most likely be different because of lack of details on the sauce. If there had been time to ask Dom questions, I think he would have told you what is in his Sicilian sauce and also whether he uses the same dough as for the rest of his pies.

Peter

Offline pizzanapoletana

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A Mano NJ
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2007, 03:34:25 AM »
I think I found the links to tommy's reports (the new member that posted about Roberto earlier in this thread).

http://www.tommyeats.com/tommyeats/2007/01/a_mano_ridgewoo.html

http://www.tommyeats.com/tommyeats/2007/01/mano_ciao_rober.html

The pizza probably still need fine-tuning.

Also, I am sorry to note that the ovens are made by the same guys that made the Donna Margherita's OLD oven that was falling down and had to be demolished ( http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3777.msg31436.html#msg31436)

I really hope his have better luck in durability, but I remember anyway that oven never cooked properly (neapolitan way)..
« Last Edit: January 31, 2007, 06:38:42 AM by pizzanapoletana »

Offline gschwim

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #25 on: February 01, 2007, 03:46:00 AM »
No one seems ever to mention it, but I really like Angelo's, at 117 W. 57th St., between Sixth and Seventh Aves.  Besides the (thin-crust, coal-oven) pizzas, I like the decor and atmosphere, the location right in Midtown -- and afterwards, walking down to Cafe Europa on the corner of Seventh Ave. for cappucino and dessert (as good a place as any to try -- and if you are visiting New York, you must try a slice of New York style cheesecake, very preferably with a scoop of vanilla ice cream).

Incidentally, I discovered Angelo's when, after attending a lecture by an Italian writer at the Rizzoli Bookstore down the street, he invited us all to join him for pizza.  The pizzeria he chose was Angelo's.

Oh, and the prices are quite reasonable.

Here are some customer reviews of Angelo's:  http://newyork.citysearch.com/review/7143707

Gene

Offline varasano

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #26 on: February 01, 2007, 05:32:00 AM »
Angelo's is just ok in my book. Like grimaldi's but not as good. Not close to Luzzo or UPN or DiFara's, in my opinion.

Jeff

Offline thehorse

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #27 on: February 03, 2007, 02:07:04 AM »
Another place near UPN and Luzzo's called Pizza Gruppo is supposed to be really good, although I have not tried it yet. Anyone?.. Maybe I will check it out this week and report back.

Mike

Offline baseballmike1124

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #28 on: February 05, 2007, 10:40:24 PM »
A MANO

thats all I have to say.

This is by far the best pizza place I have ever been to. I have not visited all these great pizza places like most of you have. But A mano in Ridgewood is seriously the greatest pizza place atleast on the East coast.

Offline David

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #29 on: February 06, 2007, 12:09:47 AM »
Oxymoron

That's all I have to say. ;)

I predict Cuba will win the next World Series.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2007, 12:13:32 AM by David »
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Offline thehorse

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #30 on: March 01, 2007, 05:11:25 PM »
I tried Pizza Gruppo on Ave B bet 11&12 today...Its thin crust as in cracker style, big dissapointment. The people at Zagat rated it very high , I think they were very high. It even had corn meal on the bottom ???

Offline David

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Re: A Mano NJ
« Reply #31 on: April 10, 2007, 11:17:56 AM »
I think I found the links to tommy's reports (the new member that posted about Roberto earlier in this thread).

http://www.tommyeats.com/tommyeats/2007/01/a_mano_ridgewoo.html

http://www.tommyeats.com/tommyeats/2007/01/mano_ciao_rober.html

The pizza probably still need fine-tuning.

Also, I am sorry to note that the ovens are made by the same guys that made the Donna Margherita's OLD oven that was falling down and had to be demolished ( http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3777.msg31436.html#msg31436)

I really hope his have better luck in durability, but I remember anyway that oven never cooked properly (neapolitan way)..


Video: A Mano cooks authentic pizza of Naples

http://www.northjersey.com/page.php?qstr=eXJpcnk3ZjczN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXk2MTkmZmdiZWw3Zjd2cWVlRUV5eTcwOTY2MDImeXJpcnk3ZjcxN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXkxNQ==
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Offline David

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Re: A Mano NJ
« Reply #32 on: April 10, 2007, 11:40:48 AM »

The pizza probably still need fine-tuning.

Also, I am sorry to note that the ovens are made by the same guys that made the Donna Margherita's OLD oven that was falling down and had to be demolished ( http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3777.msg31436.html#msg31436)

I really hope his have better luck in durability, but I remember anyway that oven never cooked properly (neapolitan way)..


I didn't realise that the original Donna oven was an Acunto?
The are the same manufacturers ovens that are used at the Naples Pizza fest by all the participents I believe.Interesting to see that Fred Mortati is behind this venture .I think an earlier report said some Indian businessmen were involved.Nice spacious looking restaurant that I must visit one of these days.
David
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #33 on: April 10, 2007, 02:44:57 PM »
David,

I had been meaning to call Fred Mortati for some time to get an update on his side of the pizza business as an importer of the Caputo flours, so your post reminded me to call him today. When I spoke with him and mentioned that I saw the video at the website you referenced, he told me that there was a mistake in the video and that he is not a partner. He has known Roberto for some time and he was at the restaurant to lend support to Roberto who had helped him and his business over the years as a user and promoter of the Caputo flours. I also learned that Acunto did not build the ovens. They were built by a Neapolitan “artisan builder” whose name did not ring a bell. Business at A Mano had been very good, no doubt helped by the article on the restaurant that you posted. I also saw an update on A Mano at tommyeats, at
http://www.tommyeats.com/tommyeats/2007/01/a_mano_ridgewoo.html.

Peter



Offline scott r

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #34 on: April 10, 2007, 04:08:18 PM »
x
« Last Edit: April 10, 2007, 05:35:31 PM by scott r »

Offline pcampbell

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #35 on: April 10, 2007, 04:41:12 PM »
Roberto is making pizzas in Ridgewood, but he is not officially open yet. If you stop by you can probably get a pizza.  The grand opening is scheduled for the end of Jan.  I have not been to Mano, but I did have his pizza at a Caputo sales event here in boston, and at the NY pizza show (with you!).

I had no clue about this.  It is all of 3 minutes from my house.  Seen it a few times but never had the chance to try it.   :o
Patrick

Offline David

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #36 on: April 10, 2007, 09:35:59 PM »
I also learned that Acunto did not build the ovens. They were built by a Neapolitan “artisan builder” whose name did not ring a bell.

Peter

I guess the builder just used an Acunto oven door (which is what I believe is / was Acunto's primary business) from the look of the video.Am I right in thinking Fred Mortati is involved with the import of Acunto ovens / parts.?
I seem to remember speaking to him a few years ago and him mentioning that he could supply that oven.It was a long time ago though ,so I could be wrong.This has really piqued my thoughts actually Peter as I had just taken for granted the fact that because an oven has an Acunto door on it,that the whole oven was supplied / or made by them.Looking forward to trying Roberto's as that shaved Gran Cru and rucola looks delicious,
David
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Offline tommy

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #37 on: April 10, 2007, 10:09:38 PM »
i'm really looking forward to some of you nuts trying Roberto's pizza.  i just love it, and i think it compares favorably to Una Pizza Napletana in NYC.    (i'm the idiot from the tommyeats blog).

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #38 on: April 10, 2007, 10:26:12 PM »
Am I right in thinking Fred Mortati is involved with the import of Acunto ovens / parts.?

David,

I know from prior discussions with Fred that he has many contacts in Italy and is able to get ovens if he wants them, but I don't believe he is in the oven business himself. I did once joke with him that he would have to get into the high-temperature wood-fired oven business just to sell his flours (Caputo) since conveyor ovens and home ovens were inadequate. He may recommend certain ovens to others in order to increase his sales of flours but that may be as far as it goes.

Peter

Offline pizzanapoletana

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Re: New York Pizza Tour - Need Advice
« Reply #39 on: April 11, 2007, 08:23:46 AM »
I guess the builder just used an Acunto oven door (which is what I believe is / was Acunto's primary business) from the look of the video.

There are two Acunto brothers in Naples that run two separate business. The dad had an "Officina" were metals were worked (iron mongers) and he produced doors and flue regulators and other metal parts used in wood fired ovens. One of the two brother has kept the dad business and now industrially produce the same metal parts as well as cheap ovens. The other brother has set up another business which produced those cheap ovens used at the pizzafest that also have performance problems (reports from various user at the same pizzafest).

The doors produced by Acunto are used by many "less skilled" oven builders that cannot get hold of an artisan capable of producing the real hand made door. I even know of one guy that put the door pannel the way around so that the brand is hiden.


 

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