Author Topic: Having Fun (Read 2696 times)

DKM · « **on:** January 14, 2007, 05:54:55 PM »

I was planning on making three 9" pies and before I could rework my recipe I got a message from Peter about a new tool he and another user are working on.

I figured what better way to test it and play with a new recipe so I went off to the tool and plugged in the following

.132 thickness factor
9" pan
3 dough balls
straight edge
pulling the dough 1.5" up the side
50% Hydration
20% oil
1% IDY

and here are the results

DKM · « **Reply #1 on:** January 14, 2007, 05:55:45 PM »

Pete-zza · « **Reply #2 on:** January 14, 2007, 06:18:04 PM »

DKM,

For a Texan, you make one mean Chicago deep-dish pie

.

I'm breathing a little bit easier knowing that the tool did its job

.

Peter

Troy T · « **Reply #3 on:** January 14, 2007, 10:07:47 PM »

DMK
They are some great lookin Pies!.... I was working with the Lehmann Calculator earlier today trying to figure out the correct TF for Chicago Dish, and Thin Crust pizza to get the correct weight for a given size pan.

DMK, Peter,
Is this a new Calculator for the Chicago Pan Pizza? If so where can it be accessed? Or is there some specific TF used for the extra dough needed for a pan style crust using the Lehmann Calculator.

Troy

Pete-zza · « **Reply #4 on:** January 15, 2007, 09:48:02 AM »

Troy,

The tool that DKM used is a "beta" version of the Deep-Dish Dough Calculating Tool that Boy Hits Car mentioned in a recent post on another thread. I wanted DKM to preview the tool because of his affinity for the deep-dish style, which he has championed since he became a member of this forum almost 4 years ago.

The tool is pretty much complete but for a few remaining features that need fine-tuning. The tool will be much richer in features than the Lehmann tool, which was developed specifically with the Lehmann NY style dough formulation in mind. I think it may be possible to find a thickness factor for the Lehmann tool that will produce the same amount of dough as DKM used but it will take some tinkering with since it is not simply multiplying a Lehmann thickness factor by a single number because of different pan sizes, depths, shapes, etc. I will see if I can figure it out and post it if I can come up with the right number that corresponds to what DKM used for his 9" straight-sided pans. Fortunately, DKM used the same ingredients available on the Lehmann tool (flour, water, oil and yeast--no salt or sugar). The new tool will have around 20 ingredient choices, including multiple forms of salt, yeast and oil.

Hopefully, once the tool is complete and Steve has time, it will be put on the forum front page along with the Lehmann tool.

Peter

Bill/SFNM · « **Reply #5 on:** January 15, 2007, 10:13:02 AM »

DKM,

I have to confess I have never been a fan of this style of pizza and some of the photos that have been posted on this forum have reinforced my reluctance to make it. But the photos above really look delicious. I definitely plan to try to make some soon. Thanks!

Bill/SFNM

Pete-zza · « **Reply #6 on:** January 15, 2007, 10:23:13 AM »

Troy,

If you go to the Lehmann tool and enter the values noted in the ingredients list presented below, you will get almost exactly the same numbers as the new tool produced for DKM:

Flour (100%): 649.59 g | 22.91 oz | 1.43 lbs
Water (50%): 324.8 g | 11.46 oz | 0.72 lbs
Oil (20%): 129.92 g | 4.58 oz | 0.29 lbs | 9.28 tbsp | 0.58 cups
Salt (0%): 0 g | 0 oz | 0 lbs | 0 tsp | 0 tbsp
ADY (1%): 6.5 g | 0.23 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.72 tsp | 0.57 tbsp
Sugar (0%): 0 g | 0 oz | 0 lbs | 0 tsp | 0 tbsp
Total (171%): 1110.81 g | 39.18 oz | 2.45 lbs | TF = 0.2053
Single Ball: 370.27 g | 13.06 oz | 0.82 lbs

For a single dough ball, the numbers are as follows:

Flour (100%): 216.53 g | 7.64 oz | 0.48 lbs
Water (50%): 108.27 g | 3.82 oz | 0.24 lbs
Oil (20%): 43.31 g | 1.53 oz | 0.1 lbs | 9.28 tsp | 3.09 tbsp
Salt (0%): 0 g | 0 oz | 0 lbs | 0 tsp | 0 tbsp
ADY (1%): 2.17 g | 0.08 oz | 0 lbs | 0.57 tsp | 0.19 tbsp
Sugar (0%): 0 g | 0 oz | 0 lbs | 0 tsp | 0 tbsp
Total (171%): 370.27 g | 13.06 oz | 0.82 lbs | TF = 0.2053

Please keep in mind that the thickness factor noted (0.2053) is not a universal number that can be used for all deep-dish dough formulations. It is unique to DKM’s specific case with the particular pan size (9"), dough depth (1 1/2") and shape of pan (straight-sided) he used. The new tool will allow users to work backwards from a known dough ball weight. For example, users will be able to enter a known starting dough ball weight (e.g., 370.27 grams in the above example) and the tool will calculate the ingredient quantities for that dough ball weight using a specific set of baker's percents. No thickness factor will be needed. For some, that approach may be more useful than the thickness factor approach.

Peter

Randy · « **Reply #7 on:** January 15, 2007, 10:45:33 AM »

DKM, you've got the magic!

DKM · « **Reply #8 on:** January 15, 2007, 12:09:25 PM »

Now that I have some time...

Outside of helping test the tool, my purpose for using the tool was to get a dough ball weight for a 9" pie and to figure how much dough to make for 3 pizzas.

In addition I wanted to test out what a lower hydration, high (corn) oil dough would be like. I used the tool to get the recipe amounts and then went from there.

In the bowl of my mixer I added the flour, yeast, water, and oil in that order. I turned the mixer onto its lowest setting and mixed until the dough just came together. I then turned it up two settings for 30 seconds, and then turned it off. I lightly oiled the dough ball, covered with plastic wrap and a towel and put in the fridge for the night.

The next morning I took the dough out of the fridge and punched it down then cut and weighed for the dough balls and put them in the pans which I covered with plastic wrap and towels and left on the counter to raise for about 3 hours. This is a new step for me. I use to weigh out the dough balls right after I made the dough and never punched them down. I decided to try it this way as this is what Marc Malnati said they do on the Food Network's Road Tasted.

After the 3 hours I took the dough out and oiled the pans, put the dough back and made the pizzas: one cheese, one pepperoni, one Italian sausage.

I cooked them on the second from the bottom rack at 450^o F for about 25 minutes, turning and moving them around halfway though the cooking time. They turned out quite well I do believe.

DKM

Troy T · « **Reply #9 on:** January 15, 2007, 12:10:02 PM »

Thank your Peter, I am looking forward to the new tool

Troy

DKM · « **Reply #10 on:** January 15, 2007, 12:12:29 PM »

Quote from: Bill/SFNM on January 15, 2007, 10:13:02 AM

DKM,

I have to confess I have never been a fan of this style of pizza and some of the photos that have been posted on this forum have reinforced my reluctance to make it. But the photos above really look delicious. I definitely plan to try to make some soon. Thanks!

Bill/SFNM

Bill - It is all about the right tools and the right amount of love.

DKM

DKM · « **Reply #11 on:** February 24, 2007, 10:52:49 PM »

Quote from: Bill/SFNM on January 15, 2007, 10:13:02 AM

DKM,

I have to confess I have never been a fan of this style of pizza and some of the photos that have been posted on this forum have reinforced my reluctance to make it. But the photos above really look delicious. I definitely plan to try to make some soon. Thanks!

Bill/SFNM

So did you ever try?

DKM

Bill/SFNM · « **Reply #12 on:** February 25, 2007, 03:38:50 AM »

Quote from: DKM on February 24, 2007, 10:52:49 PM

So did you ever try?

DKM

Sorry to say, not yet. But thanks for reminding me. I'll get right on it! This week!

Bill/SFNM

Bill/SFNM · « **Reply #13 on:** February 27, 2007, 05:21:17 PM »

So I made my first Chicago-style deep dish pie today - not really knowing what I was doing, but forging ahead fearlessly. Didn't have the right pan, the right sauce, commercial yeast, nor any idea how this thing is supposed to taste. For the sauce, I pureed some San Marzanos and added some seasoning. For the cheese, I used Fresh mozzarella from Alleva Dairy. TJ meatballs were included in the toppings.

Everyone enjoyed it, as did I, though I'm sure this pie pales in comparison to those made by you experts. As I was eating, I was continually struck by the high ratio of topping to crust and how hard it was to notice the crust, which for me is the star of the show. Perhaps if I knew what I was doing the results would have been better. I'll probablly have to eat a Chicago pie that causes me to say, "Now this is something I wish I could make" before trying again.

Bill/SFNM

Pete-zza · « **Reply #14 on:** February 27, 2007, 05:45:37 PM »

Bill,

I'd say you did pretty well for a first try.

Based on your ingredients, including your Caputo flour, San Marzano tomatoes, fresh cheeses, and your natural starter, you can make a deep-dish pizza using those ingredients, as I did and reported at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,2365.msg20625.html#msg20625. I thought the Italian-themed deep-dish pies made an elegant presentation.

Peter

DKM · « **Reply #15 on:** February 28, 2007, 12:14:42 PM »

Quote from: Bill/SFNM on February 27, 2007, 05:21:17 PM

So I made my first Chicago-style deep dish pie today - not really knowing what I was doing, but forging ahead fearlessly. Didn't have the right pan, the right sauce, commercial yeast, nor any idea how this thing is supposed to taste. For the sauce, I pureed some San Marzanos and added some seasoning. For the cheese, I used Fresh mozzarella from Alleva Dairy. TJ meatballs were included in the toppings.

Everyone enjoyed it, as did I, though I'm sure this pie pales in comparison to those made by you experts. As I was eating, I was continually struck by the high ratio of topping to crust and how hard it was to notice the crust, which for me is the star of the show. Perhaps if I knew what I was doing the results would have been better. I'll probablly have to eat a Chicago pie that causes me to say, "Now this is something I wish I could make" before trying again.

Bill/SFNM

For someone who didn't know what he was doing and didn't have the right equipment and didn't have the right toppings, you did a hell of a job!

Yes, deep dish is about the toppings as much as the crust and for those who are use to the Neapolitan Style or neo-Neapolitan Style (Classic New York) it does take some adjusting in one's way of thinking.

Come to Texas and some of us here will make a good one or two. (of course yours looked pretty good)

DKM

Bill/SFNM · « **Reply #16 on:** February 28, 2007, 08:53:21 PM »

Thank you Pete-zza and DKM.

So if I really want to taste a great Chicago-style pie I should go to Texas rather than Chicago? Sounds good to me.

Bill/SFNM

DKM · « **Reply #17 on:** February 28, 2007, 10:17:02 PM »

Quote from: Bill/SFNM on February 28, 2007, 08:53:21 PM

Thank you Pete-zza and DKM.

So if I really want to taste a great Chicago-style pie I should go to Texas rather than Chicago? Sounds good to me.

Bill/SFNM

You can go to Chicago if you want

But not only can you get a real good Deep Dish here, but some real good BBQ as well.

DKM

Pizza Making Forum