Author Topic: Mushrooms  (Read 8588 times)

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Offline gschwim

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Mushrooms
« on: April 30, 2007, 07:40:13 PM »
I baked a mushroom-topped pizza in one of those Deni Pizza Bella tabletop ovens (http://www.deni.com/pizza_2100.asp - great product, by the way; I'm sorry they discontinued it), for just two minutes and my pizza had a puddle of liquid in the middle:  liquid exuded from the mushrooms.

Is there something special one needs to do to fresh mushrooms, "dry the out" before putting them on a pizza?


Offline DWChun

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2007, 08:26:54 PM »
I used to have the same problem with excess liquid cooking out of the mushrooms but I have solved the issue by slicing the mushrooms quite thinly. I do use less mushrooms per pizza this way even when covering the surface of my pies since the slices are so thin. I think by having the mushroom thin, the moisture evaporates more readily rather than collecting on the pizza.


DW

Offline gschwim

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2007, 10:44:26 PM »
I'll try that.  THanks.

Gene

Offline lilbuddypizza

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2007, 06:26:50 AM »
I baked a mushroom-topped pizza in one of those Deni Pizza Bella tabletop ovens (http://www.deni.com/pizza_2100.asp - great product, by the way; I'm sorry they discontinued it), for just two minutes and my pizza had a puddle of liquid in the middle:  liquid exuded from the mushrooms.

Is there something special one needs to do to fresh mushrooms, "dry the out" before putting them on a pizza?

While fresh mushrooms will release moisture, I don't think there should be a puddle. I tend to think that it may be the cooker, but that's because DENI-anything is awful. Maybe the tendency for electrical fires has something to do with it,IMHO.
Try blanching mushrooms and patting dry right before putting them on.

Offline gschwim

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2007, 07:21:33 AM »
lilbuddy,

Your "anything DENI is awful" comment surprised me; I really like my Pizza Bella (the old, discontinued model; I haven't tried the new one).  I can't find anything in reasonably priced and usable in a small Manhattan apartment that does.  It heats to full temperature in a few minutes (compared to the usual heat-a-pizza-stone-in-the-oven-for-one-hour routine), has a stone-like surface that duplicates the cooking-surface of a pizza stone, plus it has the heating element in the lid that heats from above and below.  It usually bakes a pizza in three minutes.

My only complaint is that the maximum temperature is about 500-550, but I"ve yet  any small, purpose-designed pizza cooker that does.  The only alternative I've found is something that looks like a miniature brick oven.  I think it's made by Salter, but in any case is available only in Canada, so I've been unable to try it.

If you can suggest a reasonably-priced alternative -- especially if it cna heat to 700 degrees or, ideally, higher -- I would appreciate it.  Even if it operates at the same temperature as the Pizza Bella, but potentially makes a better pizza, could you let me know?

By the way (and I don't mean to sound like a shill for DENI), but I also have -- and like -- their meat tenderizer (http://www.amazon.com/Deni-MT48-Blade-Meat-Tenderizer/dp/B0000DDUCM/?tag=pizzamaking-20) .

Offline grovemonkey

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2007, 06:29:18 PM »
If you are not careful with the amount of toppings and the type of toppings, you get a big pool of water ingredients in the middle.  It's happened to me when I did  mozz., shrimp, tuna, corn, mushroom pizza.  It's seems to be good to work with less toppings rather than more, I am especially light on the sauce and I seem to get decent results with my G3.  The G3 can get past 700 but it seems to only affect the bottom, I wish there was a way to tweak the top element.

grove

Offline gschwim

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2007, 07:57:14 PM »
Thanks, Grovemonkey.  I was putting on mushrooms only.  I just tried recently, with very thinly-sliced mushrooms, which helped, but did not solve the problem completely.  I think I'll ask the local pizzeria what they do.  If I learn anything new, I'll let you know.

Gene

Offline mzshan

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2007, 10:58:02 PM »
Are these Canned Mushrooms we are talking about??
Up here in toronto NO pizzaria's use Canned Mushrooms Freash Buttons Mushrooms and try avoiding washing them The stem can be yanked out and the dome has a thin Layer that can be peeled off. and top freash mushrooms I prefer to saute them then use them..

If they are canned they have to drain for atleast 24 hr in fridge with some weight on top to get most of the moisture out...

shan
« Last Edit: May 10, 2007, 11:02:23 PM by mzshan »

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #8 on: May 11, 2007, 02:54:08 AM »
shan,

My practice has always been to brush off fresh mushrooms with a small brush but I noticed recently that the plastic packaging material says to wash the mushrooms before using. I looked to see if there was any indication on the packaging of the use of chemicals but didn't find anything to that effect. The mushrooms were grown in the U.S.

Peter

Offline colossus

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2007, 04:14:03 PM »
I take a package of sliced portobellas...throw them in a pot, add a splash of olive oil, and fire up the range. These aren't sautéed; just 'sweated'...you'll see, after about 3-4 minutes of heat they're gonna put out a heap of water. This concentrates the flavor too.  If you put too much fresh onto a pie, you'll get more than a puddle- you'll get a raw-ish pie too.

I've been doing homemade pies for about 20 years, and about five in pizzerias (Buffalo-style pizza). All of them that do fresh shrooms either pre-cook or run very very hot gas-fired ovens.


Offline mzshan

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2007, 07:19:14 PM »
Well pete Mushrooms are grown in Steralized Horse Manuare.
So thats why its recomended you wash it or else you be eating Crap LOL.
but really try that Peeling the top of the mushroom its possible you can avoid washing then and just brushing..


P.s Past thursday night I made a 5 Kilo dough bach which yielded me 12 dough portions @ 590 Gram each for a 16 inch pie.. I found for a NY style pizza its to big.. how ever reason I am writing I used the Lehmen calculator for the recipe with Autolyze technique for the first time.. In my years of experience making dough I have never felt such an amazing dough with Stretch capabilities.. I have about 4 left which i am fermenting and cooking on coming sunday I will take pics and post them in detail what recipe I used oven and all...

So look for that..

shan

Offline Pizza-novi

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #11 on: July 16, 2007, 05:44:59 PM »
I tend to use white button mushrooms  usually but I prefer the crimmini  when I am going all-out for taste.  The crimmini can be cut thicker as they are drier and don't weep like fresh buttons will.

 Fresh buttons must be cut thinner (mandoline or a talented knife). I apply them last  and let hem cook for a few minutes to dry them out.  I pat the excess moisture that may have no evap'ed and then apply the final layer of mozzarella and provolone, and bake until the crust gets  browned with a light color on the cheese. I will use older buttons as they dry out with age(a week). The wrinkled skins don't bother me and the taste concentrates.

 Fresh crimminis can be cut thicker, but I still wait for the final layer of cheese until they dry out a bit. 



 I have lurked on this board for 6 months, but this is my first post.

Offline Art

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #12 on: July 16, 2007, 06:37:01 PM »
By making "duxelles" from the mushrooms, you cook off the moisture and really intensify the flavor. 
Chop 3 pounds of mushrooms very fine (I use a food processor) and cook very slowly with 1/2 to 3/4 pound of butter (I use unsalted). Add salt and, if you wish, a little chopped shallot. Let it cook, uncovered, until it is black. It will take at least 3 hours of slow cooking - the slowest - to finish. Stir from time to time.

I then freeze it in an ice cube tray (2 Tbs. per cube), wrap in Saran, and put in a zip-loc freezer bag. Excellent "painted" on a pizza skin for a not-so-white pizza or scatter on top like you would sliced mushrooms.

When baking, follow directions.  When cooking, go by your own taste.

Offline sourdough girl

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #13 on: July 16, 2007, 06:58:12 PM »
Yes, it's true, mushrooms are grown in sterilized horse manure, but the key word there is sterilized, which means that the medium is even less worrisome than normal soil.  We've recently seen many problems with produce grown in soil, but not with mushrooms.  As an undergrad in Horticulture at Oregon State, we visited a mushroom plant in Salem and even tho there were big, steaming piles waiting to go into the mushroom beds, there was NO ODOR at all.  And, inside in the darkness, there was just a warm earthy odor.

Also, mushroom are little sponges: no matter how quickly you try to wash them with water, they WILL absorb some and just add to your problem.  I always saute mushroom slices for a pizza in a little bit of butter until they are nice and dark brown... not quite the duxelles that art mentions (which is another good idea) but getting there.  If you use very little fat, they will brown and seal in the moisture rather than release it.  It usually takes ~20 min over med-low heat to attain a nice dark brown, stirring once in a while so that both sides of the slices are well browned.  I also don't buy white button mushrooms, I buy cremini because, since they are baby portabellas, they are drier and have much better flavor.

~sd
« Last Edit: July 16, 2007, 09:46:56 PM by sourdough girl »
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Offline bakerboy

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2007, 04:45:05 PM »
To all who sugessted a precook of the mushrooms before adding to the pizza, you win the big first prize!!  I've never found any better way, and it really brings out their flavor.  We take whole portobellos, toss them in olive oil, salt, and cracked black pepper and roast them in a 400 degree oven for about 20 min....just til they give up their water.  Then we cool, slice and use at will.  Personally i would rather pan saute them but we're doing like 50 lbs. at a time.
   Manure is harmless.  Usually the dirt that's found on mushrooms isn't manure, its the peat moss thats on top of the manure...also harmless.  What makes ME such an expert on mushrooms?  My family grows portobellos for a living.  I used to make up the manure....so i'm a manure expert.  i know your all jealous!!  lol

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2007, 07:11:50 PM »
Barry,

From your maiden post on the forum, at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3944.msg9538.html#msg9538 (Reply 132), I would say that you know a lot about mushrooms.

Good to have you back posting. I learned a lot about "old dough" and other preferments from your posts.

Peter

Offline bakerboy

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #16 on: July 18, 2007, 04:28:31 PM »
peter, thanks for the kind words.  No one helps anyone more than you one this forum imo.
One thing i forgot to say about mushrooms.  My father ordered a mushroom pizza the other evening and it had, what appeared to be, mechanically sliced (or should i say chipped) mushrooms that were nothing more than dry, leathery, mushroomesque slivers. 
On top of not tasting good, it was horribly unappealling looking.  Not one bit of pride or thought put into that pie.  Was it inedible?  No.  But it just looked really dumb.  It was funny.

Offline csacks

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2007, 10:03:50 AM »
Did anyone see Alton Browns segment on mushrooms?  Turns out the only moisture that a mushroom absorbs when washed is what is caught in the gills.  Not a sponge afterall.  Alton, therefore, washes his shrooms, and so will I.  CraiG

Offline bakerboy

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #18 on: August 07, 2007, 03:13:28 PM »
csacks, same here.  I've never found mushrooms to absorb water.
Now, on the other hand, criminis and especially portobellos seem to suck up as much oil as your willing to put on them.  i've found them to be very much like sponges in this regard.

Offline sourdough girl

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Re: Mushrooms
« Reply #19 on: August 11, 2007, 07:47:42 PM »
Interesting!  I have not seen Alton Brown's pronouncements concerning mushrooms (I'm new to watching the food network... promised myself I wouldn't get hooked cause I'm enough of a foodie already) but I find it highly interesting that they would absorb oil like a sponge but not water.  Maybe that's because the oil is usually added when the shrooms are sliced more often than not?  Maybe that "skin" on the mushroom cap acts as a water barrier.  Maybe my problem is that the surface gets a slimy feeling to it that toweling off doesn't seem to cure... and then that feeling is noticeable to me in the finished (even cooked) application.  When I was in charge of catering in the Deli, we peeled the "skin" off and made fancy-pants designs on the caps with the tip of a sharp paring knife, but I never tried getting one wet after it was peeled... figured it would defeat the purpose since we were peeling them (PitA!!) so that we wouldn't have to wash them!  I will have to go get some mushrooms and do some independent testing (none in the fridge right now.... *GASP*) of my own. 
Here's one website that says not to wash them in a lot of water, carrying on the myth?  I dunno... from what I've seen of Alton, I like him, but I'm not going to take his word as gospel... I'm still not going to wash my 'shrooms cause I don't like how they look and feel afterward... a damp paper towel for me, thanks!
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=97#purchasequalities

~sd
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