Author Topic: Lastnights pie  (Read 5168 times)

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Offline pnj

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Lastnights pie
« on: August 30, 2007, 12:58:43 PM »
This was a basic dough recipe. no sugar, just flour (1 cut whole wheat, two AP), water, salt, oil, yeast.
I mixed it by hand and set it in the fridge overnight. then let it sit at room temp for about four hours.

I rolled it out w/ a rolling pin and cooked it at 500 on the middle rack. I wanted the bottom to brown so I dropped the pie down to the lowest rack and dropped the heat some. I also left the door open for a bit because the top was done perfectly.

The bottom never browned but the dough cooked and tasted great. I like my edges to rise a bit and this didn't rise at all. It didn't effect the tast though. I know if I added suger it may have helped it brown and the may have help the yeast some too(?). Or maybe if I started on the lowest rack first, then moved it up..?

I think I may have put a tad too much cheese on as well. This was a mix of sharp chedder and mozarella (shredded because it was cheaper..) I added onions and jalapenos.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2007, 01:06:32 PM by pnj »


Offline mzshan

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2007, 10:20:57 AM »
A few mistakes "my opinion" pizza is still too thick to be NY style..
After 4 hour rest at room temp you shouldnt need a rolling pin what so ever to roll and spread out your dough.. thats one reason it never rised back up as you would like too..
Also I have mentioned it before... I make 500g dough balls for a 16 inch pie which I believe is still too much dough for that big pie.. from a 500g dough ball one should be able to easily get an 18" and if you really push it a 20".

I have a dough at the hotel waiting to be cooked tonight i will document it and post the results along with recipe. Still in the testing stages this time I portioned the dough @ 425 for a 16" lets see how it turns out...

shan

P.S I just got back from NYC this past weekend went to a few pizza joints and I saw excatly whats wrong with NYC food PERIOD not just pizza possibly all the food...
will post my thoughts later :)..

Offline pnj

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2007, 11:50:57 AM »
naw, it wouldn't have risen how I wanted it to if I rolled it out by hand. how do i know? cause I did the rest of the dough last night and got the same results... I have been using the rolling pin lately on my pies though so I can get a more uniform crust. I try to use the pin to get the basic shape, then use my hands to get the size I want.

and too THICK for NY? naw...


Offline abatardi

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2007, 12:03:12 PM »
Remind me next time I bake to ask for feedback on my pizzas and then discredit all the good advice that was just given to me.

- aba
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Offline pnj

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2007, 03:09:15 PM »
was that directed at me aba?

what advise was given in this thread?

and I've never been to NY but based on the other pies I see in here, there is a fairly large difference in dough thickness for NY pizza.


Offline Glutenboy

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2007, 06:10:04 PM »
I think all MZSHAN meant to say is that NY style pizza isn't usually rolled out with a pin; it's customarily stretched by hand.  Rolling as opposed to stretching actually will probably hurt your rise because when you roll it out, you're squashing all of the air pockets that would expand in the oven and give you an open, airy rim.  There's certainly variation in thickness in New York City pizza, but traditionally, what most people think of as New York Style pizza is usually pretty thin.  All that having been said, NICE JOB!  If that pizza was here, I'd eat it.
Quote under my pic excludes Little Caesar's.

Offline abatardi

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2007, 08:07:54 PM »
Eh... all I'm saying is you are probably posting pictures here to get some type of critique and/or help?  If so, let us know and I'm sure the collective knowledge on this board could tell you everything wrong with it and how to fix it..  You got some good tips and just seemed to dismiss them (at least that's how I read it).  You may be happy with that pie but if not, you're in the right place to get some help.

- aba
Make me a bicycle CLOWN!

Offline pnj

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2007, 08:29:55 PM »
the only "advice" was that my dough didn't rise because I used a rolling pin and that I shouldn't need a pin if the dough had set out for that long....


Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2007, 08:53:54 PM »
pnj,

What has been said about using the rolling pin is correct. Rolling out the dough with a rolling pin will force the trapped gasses in the dough out of the dough and the crust will bake up flat. However, from what you have said, it sound like you used the rolling pin to open up the dough ball part way and then stretched the dough skin out to the final size. This is a method that Tom Lehmann of the American Baking Institute teaches to students who take his course. As an example of his advice on this matter, see http://www.pmq.com/cgi-bin/tt/index.cgi?noframes;read=30245, and especially the last paragraph of his reply. In your case, if you want to get a higher rise in the crust, you can let the dough rise for about an hour at room temperature, roll and stretch the dough out, and then let the dough rise for about another hour. Then you should be able to dress and bake the pizza. To get adequate height in the dough, you will need to have enough yeast. You didnít indicate how much yeast you used but if it was only a small amount you can try increasing the yeast the next time.

Iím puzzled why you didnít get any bottom crust color. Next time, you might try baking the pizza on the lowest oven rack position, with the oven set at its highest temperature setting. The pizza can be raised to a higher level if the bottom browns too quickly. You can also try adding honey, which goes well with whole-wheat flour in a dough, or even table sugar, to get increased color in the crust. Another possibility is to remove the screen from the oven when the pizza has set up sufficiently to permit you to pull the pizza screen out from under the pizza. I try as much as possible not to open the oven door since that allows too much heat to escape from the oven.

Peter

Offline abatardi

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2007, 12:00:13 AM »
You can roll out dough and still get the lip to rise... but your dough has to actually be good for this to happen.  Enough hydration, enough yeast, toppings not all the way to the very edge....  Post your recipe..

- aba
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Offline Bryan S

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2007, 12:14:56 AM »
You do not say what style you were going for but since you posted in the NY style forum I'll guess that was your intention. Pics look great, pizza looks fantastic, but not NY style at all. Crust as said before is too thick to be a NY style slice. Whole wheat in the crust is not NY style. No ridge/rim on crust is not NY style. Using a rolling pin is not NY Style. Cheddar cheese is not NY style. But your pizza does look great and I would eat it.  ;)
Making great pizza and learning new things everyday.

Offline pnj

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2007, 02:35:31 PM »
BryanS - I don't know what kind of pie I'm trying to make i guess. From my understanding, I'm trying to make a NY street style pie. the kind that is pretty thin, has a puffed up crust that can be folded, has some chew to it and tastes really good. :)

I realize chedder isn't found on NY style pie but to keep my girlfriend eating them (so I can cook them more often) I added the sharp chedder..

Should I be posting in another area?

Thanks.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2007, 03:01:24 PM »
pnj,

As a Moderator, I can move the thread. But let's wait to see where you end up. If you end up with what seems to be a NY style, then there may be no need to move the thread. Otherwise, I can move the thread to the General Pizza Making thread at some point.

Peter

Offline Bryan S

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #13 on: September 02, 2007, 01:55:28 AM »
BryanS - I don't know what kind of pie I'm trying to make i guess. From my understanding, I'm trying to make a NY street style pie. the kind that is pretty thin, has a puffed up crust that can be folded, has some chew to it and tastes really good. :)

I realize chedder isn't found on NY style pie but to keep my girlfriend eating them (so I can cook them more often) I added the sharp chedder..

Should I be posting in another area?

Thanks.
pnj, Make what you guys like. I was just saying that your pizza not really being a NY style pizza and was asking what style you were going for, and it sure does look great. Any reason as to the use of the rolling pin? You can get the crust thinner if you stretch it out by hand and get the rim you desire. I use a rolling pin for all my pan pizzas so it's a even thickness, but for NY I strectch it out by hand. Not sure how to get the rim with rolling the dough out other than maybe try folding the very outer edge over like some do with the cracker style crust. If your GF likes cheddar on her pizza have you checked out the Greek pizza recipe that Peter has posted in the other types forum? [urlhttp://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,691.msg27482.html#msg27482][/url]
I've made that one and it's spot on to the Greek style of pizza I can get here in Lancaster, PA. Granted it doesn't have the rim that you want, but it's awsome. Give it a try and see what you think. No need to post elsewhere it's all pizza, and it's all good.  ;D
Making great pizza and learning new things everyday.

Offline Jack

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Re: Lastnights pie
« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2007, 02:57:02 PM »
pnj, Make what you guys like. I was just saying that your pizza not really being a NY style pizza and was asking what style you were going for, and it sure does look great.

Exactly.  make what you like, but if you want a true NY Style, follow the advice in this thread.

I was weaned on NY and Sicilian style pizza.  BUT. .  When I make a sicilian pie, I put my cheese directly on the dough and add sauce on top in dollops.  Is it authentic?  No!  I do it because the cheese never slides off when you bite into the slice, as it does with a true NY sicilian pie, which is very different than the NY Style pizza being discussed in this thread.  I make it this way because I like it better.  Make what you want and like to eat.

Jack