### Author Topic: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)  (Read 151783 times)

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#### Pete-zza

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #100 on: April 28, 2008, 12:25:07 PM »
Just as a point of reference it would be nice to know how much cheese is typically used for a basic cheese pizza.

ggtennis,

As noted in an earlier post in this thread, I estimate that around 13 ounces of mozzarella cheese is used for a 10" Giordano's stuffed pizza. I arrived at that number by working back from the cholesterol numbers provided to me by Giordano's. Cholesterol can only exist in animal-based fats, in this case mozzarella and Parmesan cheeses. There might also be some additional cholesterol if butter is used to grease the pan, either alone or as part of a margarine/butter blend. From what we know, it appears that Giordano's is using a shredded Stella part-skim, low-moisture/whole-milk, low-moisture mozzarella blend, and a small amount of grated Parmesan cheese. Assuming a 50/50 blend of mozzarella cheeses, which is a standard industry blend, and also assuming that a 10" Giordano's stuffed cheese pizza uses a couple of teaspoons of grated Parmessan cheese, based on typical nutrition data for such cheeses I estimate that around 13 ounces of mozzarella cheese is used. The actual amount may be more or less (we don't have Stella-specific data and we don't know for sure the split between the two cheeses in the blend), but I think 13 ounces of a mozzarella blend is a good place to start. I might add that the whole-milk cheese has higher cholesterol levels than the part-skim, so the actual blend will affect the calculations of the amount of cheese used.

If an accurate number (weight) can be obtained for the sauce used in a typical 10" Giordano's stuffed cheese pizza, it may then be possible to work back from the total weight of such a pizza to determine an approximate weight for just the crust part (actually, two crusts) of the pizza. That number would be for a baked crust, not an unbaked one. However, based on a test that I ran not too long ago, I calculated a weight loss of around 5% for the baked pizza.

Peter

#### ggtennis

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #101 on: May 05, 2008, 08:26:03 AM »
First, thanks again to all who have shared their experiences here.  I have learned quite a bit.  Last night, my 3rd effort at Giordanno's Style pizza was a smashing success.  It may not be an exact duplicate of the original, but my family was delighted with the results.  The recipe I am sharing here represents bits and pieces of advice I have read in various threads on the topics.  In an effort to provide a recipe for the newbies looking for a starting point I thought I would share.  Sorry, no pictures as my family already thinks I'm looney for getting as involved as I am already.  Maybe I'll sneak a shot of a future pie.  The last one was a beauty and it tasted fantastic.  Better than I ever imagined.

So, without further adieu, the GGTennis version...

(Measurements are enough for a 10" pan)

Dough:

3 ½  cups King Arthur All-Purpose Flour, unbleached
1 ¾  tsp Red Star active dry yeast
1 cup water + 1½  Tbsp water
1 ¾  tsp sugar
1 ½ tsp Kosher Salt
½ cup canola oil
2 tbsp extra virgin olive oil

Sauce:

1 28oz can Escalon 6 in 1 All-Purpose Ground Tomatoes
1 tbsp honey
Garlic powder – light sprinkle
Basil flakes – several shakes
Italian seasoning – to taste
Crushed red pepper – dash
Sea Salt – two twists

Cheese:
10 - 12 oz
I use a combination of shredded mozzarella skim and whole mozzarella at a 4:1 ratio (higher on shredded)

Preparing the Dough

Proof the yeast.  This is accomplished by using hot water from the spigot (1 cup plus 1 ½ tbsp) and adding 1 tsp sugar then yeast.  Stir and let sit for 10 minutes.  You should see the yeast fizzing and setting up on top to know it is activated.

While yeast is activating, combine dry ingredients into a bowl. (Note:  1 tsp. sugar has already been used, only ¾ tsp is used in dry ingredients)

When yeast is ready add oil to dry mixture followed by yeast.

Combine together using spoon. Once combined it is time to knead.  Knead by hand for NO MORE than 2 minutes.  Set a timer and do not knead beyond two minutes.  (Note:  dough should have an oily feel, but oil should not be dripping.  If too dry add a bit while kneading)

Weigh the dough ball.  Break off 1/3.

Place both balls in plastic zip lock bags and refrigerate for 20 – 36 hours.  I usually try 24.

Pizza Day Preparations:

Remove dough balls from refrigerator.  Place in large mixing bowl.  Let sit covered with towel over bowl at room temperature for at least 3 hours.

Get fine strainer and drain 6 in 1 Tomatoes for at least 3 hours.

Preheat oven with pizza stone on bottom rack for 45 minutes to 1 hour at 450 degrees.

Putting it Together:

Prepare sauce by combining 6 in 1 tomatoes with spices.  Stir together with spoon and set aside.

Measure/weigh cheese and set aside.

Coat pan (10” cast iron skillet) with Extra Virgin Olive Oil and set aside.

Sprinkle light amount of flour on counter.
Take large dough ball and shape into circle by hand.
Roll dough with rolling pin.
Drape dough sheet into oiled cast iron pan.  Fit to sides.  Excess dough can hang over sides of pan for now.

Put cheese directly on dough in a level layer. Add optional ingredients such as sausage/pepperoni etc., now.  NOTE:  I like extra sauce on my pizza and I put a few spoonfuls directly on the cheese layer, but this is optional.

Take small dough ball, place on counter and roll.  Make sure dough is VERY thin.  Place thin dough layer on top of cheese and toppings.  Press dough down to make room for sauce.  Allow excess to hang over edge of pan.  Coat dough with light layer of extra virgin olive oil. Make 6 - 9 holes in top dough sheet to allow sauce to drizzle to ingredients below.

Using a rolling pin, roll along the outside edge of the pan, pressing the two doughs together.  Take pizza cutter or knife and cut off excess dough along top line of pan.

Apply the sauce directly to the top crust and be careful not to spill on sides.  (Note:  I use almost all of the sauce, but I enjoy extra sauce on my pizza.  Use as much as you like.  The extra can be used later.)

Place cast iron pan on top of pizza stone and bake at 450 degrees for 15 minutes.
At 15 minutes turn the pan 180 degrees and bake another 15 minutes.
Watch dough.  If golden brown, the pizza is probably done, if not, you may need to cook longer.  Cooking times will vary, but 32 minutes is about right for me using a gas oven in a cast iron skillet on top of a pizza stone.

Remove from oven.  Slice and ENJOY!
« Last Edit: May 05, 2008, 08:30:21 AM by ggtennis »

#### film_score

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##### Spice in Giordano Dough
« Reply #102 on: December 02, 2008, 09:46:35 PM »
So, people have been wondering what spice could be in the Giordano's dough as they listed it:

Ingredients:  Crust (Flour, water, vegetable oil, yeast, salt, spices)

Since I didn't taste any spice when I tasted the crust at Giordano's, I would bet that the spice is turmeric, which is frequently used to give things a yellow color and doesn't have much flavor.  I'm sure it's just added for color purposes...

If it was oregano or even red pepper, you would see flecks of it in the crust but you can't see anything.  I guess it could possibly be garlic or onion powder or something as well but I don't think any of that is in there...

#### ElevenBravo

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #103 on: December 20, 2008, 10:14:47 PM »
First, thanks again to all who have shared their experiences here.  I have learned quite a bit.  Last night, my 3rd effort at Giordanno's Style pizza was a smashing success.  It may not be an exact duplicate of the original, but my family was delighted with the results.  The recipe I am sharing here represents bits and pieces of advice I have read in various threads on the topics.  In an effort to provide a recipe for the newbies looking for a starting point I thought I would share.  Sorry, no pictures as my family already thinks I'm looney for getting as involved as I am already.  Maybe I'll sneak a shot of a future pie.  The last one was a beauty and it tasted fantastic.  Better than I ever imagined.

So, without further adieu, the GGTennis version...

Hi All - I just followed GGTENNIS' version and here are my results - delicious! Thanks original poster and all contribs to this thread - Chicago Rules!!!, loowaters, Pete-zaa.

~ ElevenBravo

#### ElevenBravo

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #104 on: December 20, 2008, 10:15:53 PM »
Hi All - I just followed GGTENNIS' version and here are my results - delicious! Thanks original poster and all contribs to this thread - Chicago Rules!!!, loowaters, Pete-zaa.

~ ElevenBravo
More photos:

#### ElevenBravo

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #105 on: December 20, 2008, 10:16:52 PM »

#### marcie

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #106 on: January 31, 2009, 02:50:35 PM »
I am sad...where is Brian?  He last posted on this topic a year ago.  Did any of you finally hit on the right mix of ingredients?  I have made countless pizzas as a mom, and my kids have always cherished my pizzas until they tasted Giordano's.  So I am dying to get a taste-alike copycat recipe for that type of pizza, just to regain my standing as the "best pizza chef" with my kids, who are now adults.
Thanks,
Marcie

Hi all,
I too am very interested in the vegetable oil versus vegetable shortenting (i.e. crisco) conversation going on.  Although my 2 cents would be that mixing the flour, salt, yeast and oil together (before the water), would make this just about a mute point.  Mixing as such creates similar characteristics of making pastery or pie crust - tiny grains of fat which would lend themselves to flakiness.  (This topic has been discussed on the boards as well).

I also wanted to check in with some of my investigative research regarding the Giordano's crust. I keep revisiting the statements made by Giordano's and Nancy's founders on their respective websites. Both pizza crusts are described as originating from a mothers or grandmothers old world italian recipe for easter pie, holiday pie or holiday cake with ricotta cheese and a whole host of other meats and cheeses stuffed like a pie - similar to today's Giordano's stuffed pizza.  (Please read the nancy's pizza and giordano's sites regarding their statements).

I've scoured the internet and have taken a look at dozens of these old world recipes to come up with a few very compelling ingredients to try and incorporate into our test pizza's.
Here is the process I used to qualify my findings:

1. There has to be "some" ingredients carried forward to the Giordano's Pizza from these original holiday easter pies to make the pizza unique in flavor and hold true to their statments that the crust originates from these italian holiday easter cakes and pies.

2. I threw out all ingredients in the holiday easter pies which we know are not listed in the giordano's crust (milk, eggs, baking powder, etc. to name a few)

3. I've kept all possible ingredients from the easter holiday pies that can be categorized as "SPICES". - Since the list of ingredients in the Giordano's crust simply says: "SPICES" without disclosing the individual spices, we must at least consider the unique holiday easter pie ingredients as possible missing items.

4. Keep in mind that just because an ingredient doesn't taste prevelant, doesn't mean its not there. Many "spices" blend together to create a single signature flavor. (What does KFC have -- like 8 secret spices or something?)

Ok.. with that said, the following additional spices I will try to add one at a time are:

* Vanilla
* Millifori - (Orange-Flower essence as a substitute (or orange rind as a last result substitute)).
* Sugar - (if this can be considered a "Spice" since Petes Giordano's ingredient list does not list sugar explicitly).

A few easter holiday pies also stated lemon OR orange. Some stated lemon AND orange rind. Since its not uncommon to include a bit of lemon in the sauce, lemon rind could be included in the sauce.

A small amount of holiday easter pies also include cinnamon. I personally wouldn't think I've ever tasted any hint of cinnamon in the pizza, but again, it could be a miniscule amount to shape the overall taste of the pizza when biting into it.

Lastly, my intention is to simply list these ingredients from some research I've done. Hopefully it doesn't just add confusion or worse, make us more uncertain about the track we are on. I just wanted to do some good old fashioned investigative work and draw some logical conclusions.  Afterall, the ingredient called "Spices" exist in their crust and in their sauce. They obviously have something they want to keep close to their vest and keep their pizza unique.  All of this is just my opinion of course.

As for me personally, the next time I try the recipe, I will add a touch of orange rind and a touch of vanilla. I'll start with that. (I already add a teaspoon of lemon juice in my sauce to cut the tomato acids).  I have no idea where to purchase this Millifori or orange flower-essence so I don't know what these taste like in relation to orange rind.  Bottom line is, that was the re-occurring ingredient in all the easter holiday pies and cakes.

Brian

#### JJ

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #107 on: January 31, 2009, 05:14:03 PM »
The dough has just salt & sugar for spices. It's a fairly simple recipe.
Chicago's southwest side close to Home Run Inn,Palermo's 63rd,Vito & Nick's,Giordano's & Obbie's!

#### Pete-zza

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #108 on: January 31, 2009, 06:48:39 PM »
The dough has just salt & sugar for spices. It's a fairly simple recipe.

JJ,

If you look at the ingredients lists in Reply 23 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5674.msg51855.html#msg51855 and also in Reply 85 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5674.msg53610.html#msg53610, you will see that the dough does not contain any sugar and that salt is listed independently of spices. That information came directly from Giordano's itself. The FDA has very strict rules on how ingredients are specified and would not allow sugar and salt to be considered spices.

Peter

#### JJ

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #109 on: February 01, 2009, 02:57:16 PM »
Pete,
The dough does have salt and sugar in it! Do you think they are going to tell what's in it? My brother in law was a manager back in the 70's and has a very good memory.
Chicago's southwest side close to Home Run Inn,Palermo's 63rd,Vito & Nick's,Giordano's & Obbie's!

#### Pete-zza

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #110 on: February 01, 2009, 04:00:24 PM »
JJ,

I assumed that what Giordano's sent to me is what they would represent to the government by way of nutrition disclosure. It's also possible that as Giordano's has grown over the years it has made changes to its dough formulation since the 1970s. I honestly don't see any reason why Giordano's would try to conceal that it uses sugar in its dough. Just using "spices" hides a multitude of things. As I noted previously, it is possible that the ingredients lists of its frozen pizzas will provide some insights into the Giordano's dough formulation. However, no one has stepped forward to date that I can see to tell us what the packaging of the frozen Giordano pizzas reveals about Giordano's doughs.

Peter

#### JJ

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #111 on: February 01, 2009, 07:23:34 PM »
Pete,
Sounds good to me. I have a Giordano's less than a mile from my house. Don't eat there much,we usually get deep dish from a place called Obbie's. The taste is similar to Giordano's, however it's thicker and the sauce is more tastier. They have been open since 1977.
Giordano's has been open since 1974. My brother in law has the original recipe for deep dish and thin crust. The dough is the same for both,the sauce is different.

Chicago's southwest side close to Home Run Inn,Palermo's 63rd,Vito & Nick's,Giordano's & Obbie's!

#### Pete-zza

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #112 on: February 27, 2009, 02:10:17 PM »
Recently, in the course of assisting member buenokid in developing a dough system for a Giordano's type stuffed pizza, at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8029.msg69107.html#msg69107, I suggested that he use a top skin than is thinner than the dough used in the deep-dish pan itself. To confirm whether I had properly instructed him on this point, I revisited the Giordano's Stuffed Crust video that I originally viewed at the travelchannel.com website (the video itself is referenced earlier in this thread but can be found in the video section of the travelchannel website under Destination:Chicago). In reviewing the video again, I was reminded that a sheeter/roller was used to sheet out the dough skins to be used to make a Giordano's stuffed pizza. I could not tell from the video itself whether the top skin was thinner than the dough used in the deep-dish pan itself but I thought that the sheeter/roller looked like a sheeter/roller product sold by Anets, a manufacturer of sheeter/rollers out of Northbrook, IL. That prompted me to call Anets and to speak with a salesperson to see if the Giordano's sheeter/roller was indeed an Anets product and, if so, to get some additional information on Giordano's use of the product. I was also curious to know if a dough with a large amount of oil could be passed through the machine.

I ended up speaking with a very helpful salesman who confirmed that Giordano's does use Anets products, specifically, a double pass, side operated sheeter/roller designated MDR6. From looking at the current MDR6 product at the Anets website, I believe that the machine I saw in the video is an older version of the MDR6. Apparently MDR6 machines are workhorses and have been in service for several years and, if properly maintained, almost never break down. I was told that there are models of Anets sheeters/rollers that have been in use since 1927. From my discussion, I learned that the top skins for Giordano's stuffed pizzas are, indeed, thinner (I was told much thinner) than the dough skins placed in the pans themselves. The main skin is prepared by running a flattened and floured dough ball through the machine in two passes, with the skin being turned 90 degress before the second pass (this is to get a properly round skin). The top skin is made the same way but using a smaller dough ball. The machine can make skins that are paper thin all the way up to 3/4", and up to 18" in diameter. When I asked whether a dough with a very high oil content, as much as 20% and maybe even more, could be run through the machine without gumming it up or causing the rollers to slip, I was told that so long as the machine is cleaned daily, as recommended (basically keeping the metal or synthetic rollers clean), and that flattened dough balls are dusted in flour before running them through the machine, the machine will sheet the dough very reliably. The salesman emphasized that at a place like Giordano's there is flour all over the place, on tables and other work areas and even a flour tray on the machine itself. That may account for why the skins shown in the video do not have an oily exterior and can be tossed, as shown in the video.

I was also curious to know if Giordano's makes the dough balls at the store level, which might provide some clues as to the Giordano's dough formulation itself, but the salesman did not know for sure. He thought that some of the Giordano stores make their own dough. He did mention, however, that dough balls kept in a cooler should not be run cold through the machines, which can result in tears in the skins. They should first be warmed up for about a half hour or more.

Peter

#### Pete-zza

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #113 on: February 28, 2009, 01:23:57 PM »
I found an article today at seriouseats about the Giordano's stuffed pizza, at http://slice.seriouseats.com/archives/2008/06/giordanos-stuffed-pizza-classic-chicago-illinois.html, in which the author of the article indicated that shortening was used in the Giordano's dough. But, in a followup correction, the writer posted as follows:

Correction to the article: I met with Leo Spizzirri today, who's the GM and Executive Chef at Giordano's. I learned a lot of good pizza info, but wanted to correct one thing here: There is no shortening in Giordano's crust. There is no butter in the dough, but a good amount of butter goes in the pan before the dough is added.

A couple of other good nuggets: they use different sauces for the stuffed and thin crust, with the stuffed version being much chunkier; the cheese is whole milk mozzarella; and the dough is prepared 3-4 days in advance of cooking.

The above leads me to believe that the sauce may be made from two types of tomato products, one of which is perhaps an Escalon product and the other of which may be a somewhat chunky tomato that accounts for the calcium chloride.

But the most important new piece of information, if correct, is that the dough is prepared 3-4 days in advance of using. That would clearly suggest cold fermentation and, I believe, a small amount of yeast.

Peter

#### ElevenBravo

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #114 on: March 02, 2009, 12:34:20 AM »
Correction to the article: I met with Leo Spizzirri today, who's the GM and Executive Chef at Giordano's. I learned a lot of good pizza info, but wanted to correct one thing here: There is no shortening in Giordano's crust. There is no butter in the dough, but a good amount of butter goes in the pan before the dough is added.

A couple of other good nuggets: they use different sauces for the stuffed and thin crust, with the stuffed version being much chunkier; the cheese is whole milk mozzarella; and the dough is prepared 3-4 days in advance of cooking.

The above leads me to believe that the sauce may be made from two types of tomato products, one of which is perhaps an Escalon product and the other of which may be a somewhat chunky tomato that accounts for the calcium chloride.

But the most important new piece of information, if correct, is that the dough is prepared 3-4 days in advance of using. That would clearly suggest cold fermentation and, I believe, a small amount of yeast.

Peter

Thanks for the great research and info, Peter. I've been working on this pizza for a few weeks now and have made a 2 part video here:

Part 1:
Part 2:

This video is the culmination of what I've gleaned from this forum and I give Special Credit to http://www.pizzamaking.com at the end of Part 2.

~ ElevenBravo

#### Pete-zza

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #115 on: March 02, 2009, 01:09:47 PM »
ElevenBravo,

Thank you very much for posting the two links to your videos. They were very professionally done and I enjoyed watching them very much.

As you may already have gathered, my approach to reverse engineering the Giordano's crust has been to try to determine the types and brands of ingredients and the amounts used for one of the Giordano's stuffed pizzas. In my case, I decided to use the 10" stuffed cheese pizza as my working model because it contains the fewest components (crust, sauce and cheese) and, thus, is the simplest and easiest one to use for my purposes. I know that a baked Giordano's 10" stuffed cheese pizza weighs 42 ounces, so if I were able to determine the types of cheeses and tomatoes that go into such a pizza, and their respective quantities, that would allow me to determine how much dough is used in the pizza. I would have to adjust the weights of ingredients to compensate for the fact that an unbaked pizza weighs more than an unbaked one, but that is something that I believe can be adjusted fairly easily. Knowing the amount of dough used for the pizza, along with the pan size (10") and pan depth (2"), and the fact that the dough skin in the pan uses up all of the 2" pan depth, would allow me to play around with the deep-dish dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/dd_calculator.html to determine the thickness factor for the dough.

Where I have encountered some difficulty is in getting nutrition information for the Stella mozzarella cheeses that Giordano's is said to be using. I have read that Giordano's is using either a shredded blend of low-moisture, part-skim mozzarella cheese and low-moisture whole milk mozzarella cheese (as noted in the information sent to me some time ago by Giordano's) or only shredded low-moisture whole milk mozzarella cheese. It is possible that the cheeses are a proprietary blend developed exclusively for Giordano's.

Unfortunately, the Stella cheese website does not show any mozzarella cheeses in its product line, and the Sam's in my area does not carry the Stella mozzarella cheeses to enable me to look at the nutrition information on the labels for such cheeses. I know that Stella is owned by Saputo, which carries several brands of mozzarella cheese, so maybe there is some corporate reorganization and rebranding going on. I have looked at several of the Saputo mozzarella cheese brands and have noted some wide variations in the nutrition information for such cheeses, which suggests that I need Stella-specific information on the two Stella shredded mozzarella cheeses. I feel that having reliable information for the Stella mozzarella cheeses, if indeed they are still being used by Giordano's, would help me better determine how much oil (vegetable oil according to the Giordano's information) is used in the Giordano's dough particularly since I believe that Giordano's may be using considerably less than what our members have been using based on my analysis to date. In light of the recent information on the 3-4 day fermentation window for the Giordano's dough, I also now believe that much less yeast is used than what our members have been using.

It would also help to know what the ingredients are that are listed on the packaging for one of the Giordano's frozen stuffed pizzas, if only to confirm the information previously sent to me by Giordano's.

BTW, for a frame of reference for the 10" stuffed spinach pizza you made and showed in the videos, the weight (baked) for a 10" stuffed spinach pizza from Giordano's is also 42 ounces. To keep the weight of the 10" stuffed spinach pizza the same as the 10" cheese pizza, the information I received from Giordano's suggests that the way this is done is to use less cheese. If you weigh one of your 10" stuffed pizzas some time, both before baking and after baking (allowing the baked pizza to first cool down for a while), that should give you an idea as to how your pizza measures up weight-wise against a like Giordano's stuffed pizza. I realize that you may not be benchmarking against a Giordano's pizza but it might be interesting nonetheless to see how the two pizzas compare.

As a final comment, I would like to offer a small suggestion and that is to rehydrate the ADY separately from the salt, even though the salt is first dissolved in the water before adding the yeast. Another member recently combined the salt and yeast (and, I believe, sugar) in the water but it was not clear whether the problems he experienced were solely because of such combination. However, the advice generally dispensed by Tom Lehmann on the matter can be seen at a recent PMQ Think Tank post at http://thinktank.pmq.com/viewtopic.php?p=44454#44454. It's possible that in your case you used enough yeast (about 1.6% by my calculation) that some loss of leavening power may not have mattered that much.

Peter
« Last Edit: March 07, 2009, 07:25:01 PM by Pete-zza »

#### Pete-zza

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #116 on: March 02, 2009, 01:54:54 PM »
For those who are interested, I took the information provided by ElevenBravo from his videos and, using the deep-dish dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/dd_calculator.html, came up with the following baker's percent version:

 Flour (100%):Water (41.1765%):ADY (1.56862%):Salt (2.02665%):Corn Oil (16.6554%):Total (161.42717%): 963.91 g  |  34 oz | 2.13 lbs396.9 g  |  14 oz | 0.88 lbs15.12 g | 0.53 oz | 0.03 lbs | 4 tsp | 1.33 tbsp19.54 g | 0.69 oz | 0.04 lbs | 3.5 tsp | 1.17 tbsp160.54 g | 5.66 oz | 0.35 lbs | 11.89 tbsp | 0.74 cups1556.01 g | 54.89 oz | 3.43 lbs | TF = N/A

For a single dough piece for making only one 10" stuffed pizza (rather than three), the above dough formulation becomes:

 Flour (100%):Water (41.1765%):ADY (1.56862%):Salt (2.02665%):Corn Oil (16.6554%):Total (161.42717%): 321.3 g  |  11.33 oz | 0.71 lbs132.3 g  |  4.67 oz | 0.29 lbs5.04 g | 0.18 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.33 tsp | 0.44 tbsp6.51 g | 0.23 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.17 tsp | 0.39 tbsp53.51 g | 1.89 oz | 0.12 lbs | 11.89 tsp | 3.96 tbsp518.67 g | 18.3 oz | 1.14 lbs | TF = N/A
Note: One-third of dough is for top skin

Peter

#### ElevenBravo

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #117 on: March 02, 2009, 04:40:34 PM »
ElevenBravo,

Thank you very much for posting the two links to your videos. They were very professionally done and I enjoyed watching them very much.

...<snip>...

I realize that you may not be benchmarking against a Giordano's pizza but it might be interesting nonetheless to see how the two pizzas compare.

As a final comment, I would like to offer a small suggestion and that is to rehydrate the ADY separately from the salt, even though the salt is first dissolved in the water before adding the yeast.

...<snip>...

Peter

Wow, thanks for the positive feedback Peter! That means a lot to me as I look up to you as the "Mack-Daddy Pizza Man of All-Time". I learned a lot from staging and filming those shots. Subsequent videos (and there will be more) will go smoother, take less time to edit and will ultimately be more polished that this first one.

Re: Benchmarking against Giordano's... Although I'm not specifically on a life-mission to perfect a Giordano's clone, I will take some pre/post baking weights next time and see how they compare to the 42 oz weight for the 10" you mention. Also, based on the research here, it's pretty clear that Giordano's does not use sharp provolone or scamorza, but i thought the three formaggio blend in my version would be tasty (and it was).  Even if I stop right now and stay strict to this recipe from now on, I am assured to produce a delicious tasting pie - every single time. That has everything to do with what I've learned here at this forum.

Re: Hydrate the ADY separately from the salt... I will do this next time. So far, (fingers crossed) I have had zero issues with leavening and my dough consistently rises to the occasion, so to speak.

BTW - I regrettably didn't mention it in the video, however the dough I used during the video had been fermenting in the fridge for 5 days prior. I can personally attest that it makes a huge difference and cannot be overstated how important that fermentation time is to get a "mature" flavor and texture for the finished product. The smell of that dough when rolling it out was simply outstanding.

Finally, a huge thank you for converting my measurements using the DD calculator. That will be very handy for anyone that wants to up/down convert the batch size.

Cheers!

~ ElevenBravo

#### BTB

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• Location: Tampa Bay, FL & S.W. Mich. areas
##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #118 on: April 13, 2009, 01:16:07 PM »
I had some great Giordano's pizza recently and reported on it in the Pizzeria and Restaurant Review section below.
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8361.msg72200.html#msg72200  Pizza was great as this picture perfect slice shows.     -BTB

#### Pete-zza

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #119 on: April 13, 2009, 01:38:38 PM »
BTB,

From your viewing station were you able to see the dough closely enough to be able to tell whether it contained a lot of oil or not? And did you see equipment on the premises to make the dough? Also, did you see the dough being sheeted?

Peter

#### BTB

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #120 on: April 13, 2009, 07:24:40 PM »
Peter, the dough did not seem like it had a lot of oil in it, compared to Malnati's, Gino's East, et al.  My rough guess would be that the percentage of oil was anywhere from 8 to 12%.  From my view, it had a curious amount of yellow specks of sorts in the dough skin which was uniformly flattened in many respects.  Can't imagine what the yellow portions of the dough skin were.  There was a sheeter -- as this picture I think shows -- used to sheet the dough skin, which seemed to do the job with ease.  But all in all, the pizza was far superior to that I had in the past at Giordano's and they might make a big fan of me yet.    --BTB

#### Pete-zza

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #121 on: April 13, 2009, 08:08:52 PM »
BTB,

As you know, I have spent a fair amount of time analyzing the nutrition data that was given to me some time ago by Giordano's. After nineteen pages of notes, calculations and photocopies, I have developed a healthy skepticism about the accuracy of such data, along with a suspicion of my own skills in analyzing such data, but I could not conclude that a lot of oil was used in the dough--and certainly not the 20+% figures that many of our members have been using to make Giordano's clone doughs. My last oil calculation was just under 13%. I have held back making a test pizza based on that value pending getting more information about the cheeses (Stella?) used by Giordano's. I was also hoping that some member who has ordered frozen pizzas from Giordano's might step forward and disclose any ingredients list of other information from packaging for such pizzas.

I, too, noted the yellow spots in the dough from the photos you posted. I even used the 400% zoom feature of my PC to examine them more carefully. The only time I have experienced that type of spotting is when I have left a dough uncovered such that a crust formed on the dough. When opening up such a dough ball, the crusty part separates and becomes interspersed with the normal parts of the dough, leading to a mottled overall appearance. Another possibility is that the spots are formed when an oily dough is sheeted with a lot of bench flour. I couldn't tell from the photos, but are the yellow "blobs" in the tray dough? If so, did you see any dough making equipment on the premises? With a sheeter, you don't really need to use dough balls, especially if there is a scale to weigh a piece of dough before it goes through the sheeter. Unless Giordano's has a lot of units in Florida, it would seem logical to make the dough on premises rather than at a commissary, although the dough production could easily be contracted out to a third party.

The sheeter does indeed look like an Anets sheeter such as I researched not too long ago.

Peter

#### loowaters

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #122 on: April 14, 2009, 06:44:11 AM »
Peter, as usual, you are spot on with the lower oil content of this dough, at least as it compares to a Malnati's or Uno's clone.  I've been tinkering with this over the last couple months because we really don't have a baker's percentage on this but I haven't gone as low as 13% just yet.

I might as well throw it out here, right now.  This is the formulation I used on my last attempt with success.

AP Flour   100%
Water       52
Veg Oil      12
Olive Oil      3
Salt           1

TF = .180 (1/3 of total dough amount is used for top dough layer equalling .12 bottom layer and .06 top layer.  Also, dough is rolled out to overhang the top edge of the pan for both top and bottom, before trimming, reducing actual TF even further.)

Section into top and bottom dough balls and give at least an 18 hr. fridge rise, but 24 hrs. is preferable.

I assemble this in the same fashion that we've seen in some videos.  First filling the bottom "shell" with cheese and "toppings" then covering with top layer and tucking it in down in the corners and finally venting before topping with sauce.

I don't have any pics but next time I try this I'll do a few and get them up.

Loo
« Last Edit: April 14, 2009, 06:47:29 AM by loowaters »
Using pizza to expand my waistline since 1969!

#### BTB

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #123 on: April 14, 2009, 08:18:36 AM »
Peter, yes, the yellow "blobs" seemed to have been in the tray dough, too.  Don't recall seeing much bench flour as they sheeted the dough skin.  There was a much larger section of the kitchen to my left as I was taking the pictures, but since it was an "in-between" time (between lunch and dinner), there was no activity going on there at the time.  I think that was in part the dough making area, but am not 100% certain.  They serve alot of pastas and other meals also.  Now you're giving me an excuse to go back and have another stuffed pizza for the sake of food science.                                                                         --BTB

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##### Re: My Giordano's Style Pizza's (with pics)
« Reply #124 on: April 14, 2009, 09:13:11 AM »
BTB:

I'm not zooming in so I can't tell, but could those yellow blobs be butter?
Let them eat pizza.

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