100% whole grain pizza barrier shattered!!!!

[hotsawce]

what peel is that?

[DOC Opa]

http://tinyurl.com/288fvwq  Page two.  Here is a video.   http://tinyurl.com/2ads6eh  bought this one as well.  http://tinyurl.com/2c2ev8l  I saved so much building my own WFO I splurged on a couple tools.

[onemsmom]

I tried making pizza with KA WWW flour and KA regular WW flour. The WWW didn't seem to have enough gluten in it to make a good pizza crust. The regular KA WW on the other hand came out nice and light.



Forgive me if someone else has already asked this, because I haven't finished reading the whole thread, but are you sure you used White Whole Wheat Flour (made from the hard white wheat berry) and not the Whole Wheat Pastry Flour (made from the SOFT white wheat berry?).  The reason I ask is that whole wheat pastry flour has very little gluten.  It's wonderful for cookies/muffins, etc., but will not work in bread.  I think white whole wheat has the same gluten level as red - I use it 1/2 1/2 with red when I bake bread.  Let me know if you still remember (I just realized that post was from 2008!!)

Thanks very much,

Jenn

[Villa Roma]

I tried making pizza with KA WWW flour and KA regular WW flour. The WWW didn't seem to have enough gluten in it to make a good pizza crust. The regular KA WW on the other hand came out nice and light.



Forgive me if someone else has already asked this, because I haven't finished reading the whole thread, but are you sure you used White Whole Wheat Flour (made from the hard white wheat berry) and not the Whole Wheat Pastry Flour (made from the SOFT white wheat berry?).  The reason I ask is that whole wheat pastry flour has very little gluten.  It's wonderful for cookies/muffins, etc., but will not work in bread.  I think white whole wheat has the same gluten level as red - I use it 1/2 1/2 with red when I bake bread.  Let me know if you still remember (I just realized that post was from 2008!!)

Thanks very much,

Jenn

Jenn...I used KA WWW flour and it is made from hard white wheat. It's possible I got a bad batch but KA is usually good quality. http://www.kingarthurflour.com/flours/white-whole-wheat-flour.html

    Villa Roma

[Villa Roma]

"You can't have any pudding if you don't eat yer meat.
How can you have any pudding if you don't eat yer meat?"

My creative aspects with regard to pizza making seemed to have hit a wall lately.
There I was, comfortably numb listening to Pink Floyd when it hit me like a king sized psycho pudding cup! Why not put pudding in my WW dough? I swapped the oil and sugar in the dough for the pudding and got a good dose of dairy to boot. I used butterscotch pudding and the rest is history.

    Pudding, it's not just for desert anymore, Villa Roma

[MikeN]

If I had to pick a recipe I'd go with this one:

800gm GM WW flour
720 gm water (90%)
20 gm salt (2.5%)
16 gm lite olive oil (2%)
1/4 tsp dry instant yeast

So would this be the one you'd recommend for a newbie wanted to do WW?  If so, what's the basic process steps?

Thanks!

-Mike

[Ronzo]

If I had to pick a recipe I'd go with this one:

800gm GM WW flour
720 gm water (90%)
20 gm salt (2.5%)
16 gm lite olive oil (2%)
1/4 tsp dry instant yeast

Trying this now... just put it in the mixer. Made it with some Shiner Bock.

[norma427]

"You can't have any pudding if you don't eat yer meat.
How can you have any pudding if you don't eat yer meat?"

My creative aspects with regard to pizza making seemed to have hit a wall lately.
There I was, comfortably numb listening to Pink Floyd when it hit me like a king sized psycho pudding cup! Why not put pudding in my WW dough? I swapped the oil and sugar in the dough for the pudding and got a good dose of dairy to boot. I used butterscotch pudding and the rest is history.

    Pudding, it's not just for desert anymore, Villa Roma

Villa Roma,

Your pie with the butterscotch pudding looks great!    That sure was a creative way of using pudding!  How did the crust taste?

Norma

[Villa Roma]

So would this be the one you'd recommend for a newbie wanted to do WW?  If so, what's the basic process steps?

Thanks!

-Mike

As  a newbie I would try regular white flour pizza and once you're comfortable with it start making pizza with increasing amounts of WW flour. That's how I eased into making WW pizza. If you've already mastered white flour pizza then you can try the above recipe but I would lower the hydration to 80-85% for the initial attempt.

     Villa Roma

[Villa Roma]

Villa Roma,

Your pie with the butterscotch pudding looks great!    That sure was a creative way of using pudding!  How did the crust taste?

Norma

Thanks Norma! The BS crust tasted similar to my usual WW crust but was very light, soft, airy and handled extremely well. There was not even a hint of the pudding flavor. I'm going to try the BS pudding in a white flour recipe in the future. So far I've used the following ingredients in pizza:

Sweet potato
Regular potato
Applesauce
Coconut milk
Banana
Coffee
Juice

     Villa Roma

[norma427]

Thanks Norma! The BS crust tasted similar to my usual WW crust but was very light, soft, airy and handled extremely well. There was not even a hint of the pudding flavor. I'm going to try the BS pudding in a white flour recipe in the future. So far I've used the following ingredients in pizza:

Sweet potato
Regular potato
Applesauce
Coconut milk
Banana
Coffee
Juice

     Villa Roma

Villa Roma,

Thanks for explaining how your experiment worked out in terms of the crust.  That’s interesting that your butterscotch crust tasted similar to you usual WW crust, but was light, soft and airy.  I am also interested in how the butterscotch pudding will taste in a white flour when you try that.  You sure have tried a lot of ingredients in making your crusts.  Great experiment! 

Norma

[Ronzo]

Trying this now... just put it in the mixer. Made it with some Shiner Bock.

Ok.... so... this attempt at WWW pizza came out pretty damn good for basically my second serious attempt at it. I did the 90% hydration VR suggested, with the beer in it. Let it slow ferment on the counter for about three days.

The key I discovered is to work directly on the peel (with A LOT of bench flour), and to work super quick because the dough is so friggin wet. When I did that, it came out really good. The flavor was completely different that the first serious attempt. It had depth, and was not cardboard like the first time. Next time I'll remember to take some pictures.

[Gino that Bastad]

Loving this thread.

[malvanova]

Hi Villa Roma, question please,  I have a bag of wwf from, con agra mill stone ground medium,as stated on bag, will this be ok to use for ww pizzas, I LOVE WHAT YOU HAVE ACHIEVED, I have wood fired oven I use for bread and pizzas, trying to stay away from white flour as the doc. said   I've read this threadand don't know which formula to use, there are many on here , which would you recommend?with the flour I have?

   Thanks         
           
           Phil

[Villa Roma]

Phil....The Con Agra flour should work fine. I use Gold Medal WW flour that I get at the local Wal Mart. When using WW flour pay particular attention to the use by date and store the flour in the refer or the freezer.

Here's my basic go to recipe (in bakers percents):

WW Flour 100%
Water 85%
Sugar 2%
Salt 2%
Oil 2%
IDY 1/16 tsp per 100 gm of flour

    Villa Roma

[malvanova]

Hi; VR will it be ok to use Camondoli or Ischia starters? in what % do you suggest.

  thanks
\   Phil

[Villa Roma]

Hi; VR will it be ok to use Camondoli or Ischia starters? in what % do you suggest.

  thanks
\   Phil

If you wish to use one of the Italian starters I'd use 5% of the flour weight or better yet use both adding a good pinch of yeast as insurance.

     Villa Roma

[Paparoni]

What's up DOC? I don't have a really standard recipe as I like to experiment with different ingredients and I don't know if WW would do well in a WFO. If I had to pick a recipe I'd go with this one:

800gm GM WW flour
720 gm water (90%)
20 gm salt (2.5%)
16 gm lite olive oil (2%)
1/4 tsp dry instant yeast

Case in point, I used sweet potato and cider vinegar in this batch. It came out a little heavy but it was real easy to stretch.

    How sweet it is! Villa Roma

Hi Villa Roma,

Your 100% WW pizza success is inspiring! I'm pretty new to pizza dough making, but was able to follow your screwdriver dough making video and arrive at the best pizza crust I've ever cooked myself. I gather from your other posts in this thread that you don't usually use that method to make your dough, so I was hoping you could expand on the steps between dumping ingredients in a bowl and putting toppings on your finished dough. Do you use a KA mixer? If so, how long/what speed, and how many times? Do you refrigerate it while fermenting or leave it out, and for how long? Any details you could provide would be much appreciated!

Thanks,

Luke

[Villa Roma]

Luke,

Welcome to the wonderful world of whole grains! As luck may have it, I'm currently working on a new and exciting WW pizza crust recipe. Barring any unforeseen circumstances I should be able to bang off a test batch this weekend and if all goes well I'll detail my findings here.

I use a KitchenAid K5 mixer with the outlaw spiral hook  and let my dough rise at room temperature with a few stretch and folds thrown in for good measure. Stay tuned for the gory details.

     Villa Roma

[Paparoni]

Good luck in the lab! I eagerly await your results.

Luke