Author Topic: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas  (Read 96829 times)

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Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #350 on: March 10, 2014, 11:08:04 AM »
Looking good, Dave.

I think both of you (Dan and Dave) should look into fazzari's "every trick" thread if you haven't already. I've been having a lot of fun with it the last week. It's a lot like the pizza I've been trying to create throughout this thread, yet it's nothing like this. I'm really liking his hot water/warm rise technique and his nearly-immediate sheeting routine, although I think I'm more fond of my method of rolling two thin square sheets and folding them into fourths, because the dough is always within easy reach this way.

Something I've been wanting to try is dividing the dough into small dough balls for each layer right after the short bulk-ferment. I'd figure out the total amount of dough I need for a skin (including scrap dough) and divide it by the number of layers I want. For example, if I wanted to make a 6-layer, 14" pizza, I'd start out with 18.92 oz (536 g) of dough and scale six 3.15 oz dough balls. I'd roll each of the six dough balls very thin, then stack them, press them together with my fists, and roll. Trim to 14-15 oz. Refrigerate for at least a day. Top and bake (directly on stone) immediately after removing from fridge.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline dogboy

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #351 on: March 10, 2014, 11:40:43 AM »
Looking good, Dave.

I think both of you (Dan and Dave) should look into fazzari's "every trick" thread if you haven't already. I've been having a lot of fun with it the last week. It's a lot like the pizza I've been trying to create throughout this thread, yet it's nothing like this. I'm really liking his hot water/warm rise technique and his nearly-immediate sheeting routine, although I think I'm more fond of my method of rolling two thin square sheets and folding them into fourths, because the dough is always within easy reach this way.

Something I've been wanting to try is dividing the dough into small dough balls for each layer right after the short bulk-ferment. I'd figure out the total amount of dough I need for a skin (including scrap dough) and divide it by the number of layers I want. For example, if I wanted to make a 6-layer, 14" pizza, I'd start out with 18.92 oz (536 g) of dough and scale six 3.15 oz dough balls. I'd roll each of the six dough balls very thin, then stack them, press them together with my fists, and roll. Trim to 14-15 oz. Refrigerate for at least a day. Top and bake (directly on stone) immediately after removing from fridge.
Ryan I agree on rolling out thin skins and putting them together. I tried Fazzari techniques which worked great but added in layering. I only used 2 layers but am going to try as you stated.
The 2 layers did not show enough lamination. It was slight but still not what I'm hoping to achieve.
Guess it's time to make some dough.

Offline DNA Dan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #352 on: March 11, 2014, 01:35:56 AM »
I think both of you (Dan and Dave) should look into fazzari's "every trick" thread if you haven't already. I've been having a lot of fun with it the last week. It's a lot like the pizza I've been trying to create throughout this thread, yet it's nothing like this. I'm really liking his hot water/warm rise technique and his nearly-immediate sheeting routine, although I think I'm more fond of my method of rolling two thin square sheets and folding them into fourths, because the dough is always within easy reach this way.

I own a commercial sheeter and it's really easy to roll my skins out. A lot of this is geared towards someone that doesn't own a sheeter. I just pound my dough down, give it 3-4 passes, fold, 3-4 passes then die cut the skin. Easy as that.

Something I've been wanting to try is dividing the dough into small dough balls for each layer right after the short bulk-ferment. I'd figure out the total amount of dough I need for a skin (including scrap dough) and divide it by the number of layers I want. For example, if I wanted to make a 6-layer, 14" pizza, I'd start out with 18.92 oz (536 g) of dough and scale six 3.15 oz dough balls. I'd roll each of the six dough balls very thin, then stack them, press them together with my fists, and roll. Trim to 14-15 oz. Refrigerate for at least a day. Top and bake (directly on stone) immediately after removing from fridge.

Lydia put forward a "cheater" method a while back using Harina Preparada mix and superimposing layers. IMO superimposing several more developed layers is probably the least time consuming way to make a laminated crust. Even though it isn't a true lamination separation, it's tolerable considering how little time it takes.

Offline Mad_Ernie

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #353 on: March 11, 2014, 09:26:06 AM »
For the video on Lydia's Round Table cheater dough recipe, see the link below to the thread about her recipe.  Round Table comes pretty close to a cracker style, but it is a little more hydrated based on this recipe (~50%).  Her Viddler video link should still work for now, but she is planning on moving it.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=1911.msg59541;topicseen#msg59541

-ME
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Offline bigMoose

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #354 on: March 11, 2014, 09:10:12 PM »
I made the same Tommy's clone pizza I made above, but this time use 5% fat flakes instead of Crisco.  The write up is documented in the fat flake pizza thread http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=30173.msg306625#msg306625

I thought it produced a "sophisticated", soft, biscuity like center, with a soft crunch shell.  No breadiness at all.  An interesting crust.

Offline SavageHenry

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #355 on: November 03, 2014, 03:17:49 AM »
I used to live in Whitehall 5 minutes drive with no traffic  ( :-D in Columbus? yeah right!) from Tommy's on Hamilton. I used to eat it at least monthly but sometimes weekly or more often than that. 

I moved to rural AZ 18 months ago and have not had a good pizza since. Of all the issues in Columbus especially the east side that I DO NOT MISS, I do miss Tommy's and access to a variety of pizza and other food.

Thank you very much for doing this and posting it up. I cannot express how much this means to me if I can even come close to Tommy's.   :drool: 

Seriously, If I can even get somewhere in the ballpark of tasting like home I will be very happy.

Offline ccdrrp

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #356 on: March 02, 2015, 10:54:13 AM »
I know this is an old post but I wanted to thank Ryan for posting his tommy's clone.  We have tried many crusts including DKM's thin crust and Ryan's Shakey's clone.  With DKM's we got no separation and the outer crust edges were to hard to chew and the Shakey's clone had some separation in the middle but the outer crust edges were also to hard to chew.  I don't know what went wrong on those but we tried this Tommy's clone and even though we got no separation in the crust under the toppings the outer crust did have good separation.  I don't understand that but the whole crust was delicious and the bottom was crisp and even without the separation it had no tough to chew portions or gummy chewy portions.

I hope Ryan still reads these posts because he has given me hope that I will be able to make a great pizza!

Thank You Ryan for your hard work and attention to detail!!

Rick!!

Offline Mad_Ernie

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #357 on: March 21, 2015, 08:49:07 PM »
This past Tuesday i decided to break out this recipe and give it a try, since it has probably been at about year since I last used it.  I made some adjustments from A.R.'s recipe for the dough.
1. I used KAAP instead of Pillsbury AP because that is what I had on had.
2. To help compensate for the higher gluten content in the KAAP, I changed the hydration to 44% from 43%
3. I scaled the recipe to make one 15" pizza instead of 2, and to allow for less scrap.

My calculations were as follows:
Flour (100%):       326.69 g  |  11.52 oz | 0.72 lbs
Water (44%):       143.74 g  |  5.07 oz | 0.32 lbs
IDY (1.5%):       4.9 g | 0.17 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.63 tsp | 0.54 tbsp
Salt (1.5%):       4.9 g | 0.17 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.02 tsp | 0.34 tbsp
Sugar (1.2%):       3.92 g | 0.14 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.98 tsp | 0.33 tbsp
Shortening (5%):    16.33 g | 0.58 oz | 0.04 lbs | 4.09 tsp | 1.36 tbsp
Total (153.2%):      500.48 g | 17.65 oz | 1.1 lbs | TF = 0.0999

I made a half-cheese/half-mushroom pizza.  Pics of the laminated dough and end results are below.  I baked it on my 2stone device on my gas grill.  I got some nice bubbling, which I poked using a grill fork to bring them back down.
I was very pleased with the results.  I need to use this recipe more often.

« Last Edit: March 21, 2015, 08:50:50 PM by Mad_Ernie »
Let them eat pizza.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #358 on: June 04, 2015, 12:13:13 PM »
Having decided to look at the boards today for the first time in a few months, I'm glad to see that this thread has not died and slipped into obscurity. I'm even more glad to see that some people have attempted to reproduce my results.

Although I have a lot of ideas that I've never been able to try with this style yet, which I would like to try (and learn from), chances are that I'm never going to make another laminated cracker style pizza. It's just physically too difficult for me nowadays, and it's almost certainly never going to get any easier for me.

Although my most recent Tommy's style pizzas (two years ago) were pretty phenomenal, I know there is still a lot of room for improvement. For example, I believe I was using a bulk ferment with my most recent attempts, but now I am inclined to think perhaps rolling the dough right after mixing might be better. If that's not clear, I'm basically talking about fazzari's "Every Trick" method of dough management.

One thing I still have never done is try malt syrup or malt powder in a Tommy's style dough. I did receive some malt syrup about a year ago, which I've used for other pizza styles. However, since my most recent Tommy's style pizza was two years ago and because I've only had the malt syrup for one year, I haven't been able to try malt syrup with Tommy's style... even though I bought the malt syrup specifically to try with Tommy's style. Go figure.

I can't remember exactly what my best-yet formula for Tommy style is--I guess it's the formula in the update in Reply #1--but here is a change I think I would make if I was to resume trying to clone Tommy's: First, if there is any sugar in the formula, which I think there is, I would stop using sugar and replace it with at least 1% malt syrup, if not 2%. Even though I haven't used malt syrup very much, I have used it enough to see that it does create the blistering effect that is so characteristic of Tommy's pizza (or at least Tommy's pizza that you would get at the Upper Arlington unit).

I really like your upskirt shot, Mad Ernie.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #359 on: June 04, 2015, 12:16:24 PM »
Also, I doubt that Tommy's uses shortening. If anyone who has tried making this style prefers shortening to oil, then I guess that's cool. If you prefer oil over shortening, then I guess that's cool, too. All I'm saying is that I don't know the answer. (But I might be willing to bet that they use oil, not shortening.)
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #360 on: June 04, 2015, 12:42:02 PM »
One thing I should have added a couple posts back is that if you do roll this dough right after mixing, you should use hot water in the dough (and probably IDY, instead of ADY). Then, of course, cover and refrigerate the skin as soon as you're done rolling it. Leave the skin in the refrigerator for at least 24 hours. Don't remove the skin from the refrigerator until it's time to top and bake the pizza. (And bake directly on stone, not a pan.)

Something I've been thinking about, but for which I haven't come up with an answer, is baking temperature. I guess the best place to start is 500. It's possible that Tommy's bakes at a higher temperature, but I doubt that they bake at a lower temperature than 500. Last time I made one of these pizzas, I lived with my parents and had an electric oven with a maximum temperature of 500. It's very likely that I calibrated the oven +35 for those pizzas, making the oven temperature 535. So probably anything from 500 to 550 is good, but I doubt that I would want to bake any higher than 550 (or even 550).
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline njc2o

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #361 on: September 02, 2015, 09:45:47 AM »
Hey, joined just to say I'm looking into trying out the Tommy's clone, and found this thread super valuable. Thanks!


Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #362 on: October 12, 2015, 10:07:49 PM »
I actually made one of these yesterday. I am pretty much physically unable to do pizza anymore (especially this style), at least by myself, but I can make it happen if I have an assistant to do most of the physical work, following my instructions. Yesterday was the first time I've made pizza since early this year.

I was finally able to use the malt syrup I bought a year and a half ago for its intended purpose. I also finally used the 0.01 g scale I bought this summer, which I think means yesterday was the first time I have ever made dough (at home) using exclusively weight measurements. Since I had never had a scale accurate to within less than 1 g, I had always used measuring spoons for yeast, salt, and sugar.

I think I followed my best-yet formula (from my very long post about 20 replies back), except I used 2% malt syrup instead of sugar. I didn't realize until today that I had also been wanting to try powdered milk with this style. So hopefully I'll get to try that soon.

Since I was out of practice from having not made pizza in so long, and because this pizza was made in about five hours from start to finish, I didn't take any pictures. My guest did take at least one picture. But this pizza was basically the result of a lesson. My student did an excellent job, but I would grade myself a C or D in instruction. Not as an instructor; just as an instructor yesterday. Still, the pizza came out as good as I could've expected in five hours.

Another change I made in the formula is that I used IDY for the first time. I am not going to say how much right now, because I still haven't figured out how to use IDY exactly how I'm supposed to. Almost all of my pizzamaking (for over 18 years) has used ADY. I have been trying to switch to IDY whenever it may be appropriate, but that's not very easy to do when you basically don't make pizza anymore.

One interesting thing about last night's dough is that it came out much stiffer than I felt it should have. The dough was still so floury after mixing for a few minutes that I ended up making another batch, since it seemed pretty clear that I had done something wrong. Even the second batch came out very stiff, which made me think I had accidentally screwed up one or more of the cells in my spreadsheet or something. But after sleeping on it, I'm beginning to feel like maybe my flour had lost a lot of moisture, as it has sat on my shelf for quite a long time, in a paper bag. In all my years of making pizza, I have never had that kind of thought about flour. I don't even know if that can happen.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline tedcholl

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #363 on: November 01, 2015, 10:35:21 AM »
Ryan,

I actually added 3 new ingredients to the recipe.   ;) One was the Non-Diastatic malt powder, the 2nd was the Baker's Non Fat Dry Milk, and the 3rd was the Durkee Garlic Romano Sprinkle.  The malt powder, while great to make vanilla malts (you need a least 1/4 cup) has never really impressed me with adding much flavor to dough.  DNA Dan has also tried it and I think, concluded the same thing -- it doesn't really add any "malty" flavor to dough in these low quantities and is used, basically, instead of sugar in recipes.  It may add some shine to your crust but I'm not so sure about that either.

The Baker's Dry milk is a great "secret ingredient" that some people add to all of their crusts because they like what it does to it.  For instance see this thin crust recipe by BTB: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,18966.msg185270.html#msg185270 

The Durkee Garlic Romano Sprinkle is one thing I've found (again, thanks to DNA Dan) that really adds flavor to the crust.  The smell of this in my dough makes me happy.

I did refrigerate the folded half-skins because I thought you did it that way, but a bulk rise prior to the folding makes more sense.  (Those little dough pillows did look cool though, huh?)

--Tim


I have made Aimless Ryan's Tommy's clone pizza probably 15 or more times and love them (as well as everyone I invite to the house to eat them).   I decided to try your recipe as I was intrigued about using the NonDiastatic Malt Powder and Powdered Milk.  The only differences from your recipe is that I used KAAP although normally I use KABF.  Also, I bulk fermented for 3 hours then separated into 4 balls and left in the refrigerator.  After I took them out and let them warm up then I did the rolling, folding, and rerolling.  (Great exercise).  I baked in oven on a 3/8" steel at 500.  Pizza turned out great.  Only thing I noticed as being different was more laminating and a little more crunchy.  I suspect it may have been the combination of using All Purpose flour and the higher % of shortening.  Thanks to both you and Ryan as I love this style of pizza.


 

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