Author Topic: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted  (Read 70719 times)

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Offline Bonita45

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #80 on: August 28, 2010, 01:01:40 AM »
I made this for the first time yesterday.  Turned out very good.  I will need to experiment with the sauce to get it just right.  The one thing I don't know how to overcome is that the crust was quite tough,  Any Suggestion
Sounds like you left it in the oven too long?


Offline RyDub69

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #81 on: August 30, 2010, 08:39:50 PM »
i got to say monicals pizza is delicious. Their weekly buffet pizza is okay, but when you order a fresh pie it tastes so good. Just had it over the weekened with the wifey and the kiddo.

Offline tomrip

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #82 on: July 23, 2011, 04:48:15 AM »
whats the exact recipe for the dough, i don't know how to do conversions.

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #83 on: July 23, 2011, 03:32:25 PM »
whats the exact recipe for the dough, i don't know how to do conversions.


tomrip,

I am not sure that there is an "exact recipe" for the dough. Even if we had the "exact recipe" from Monical's itself, it would be unlikely to work the same in a home setting as in a commercial Monical's setting. However, it looks like there are several versions of the recipe I posted originally at Reply 27 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,600.msg53313.html#msg53313. However, the pizza described in that post is shown starting at Reply 22 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,600.msg52938.html#msg52938. The thread is a short one so you may want to read the whole thing to familiarize yourself with the many aspects of the Monical's clone.

If you are asking for a version of the recipe given in cups, tablespoons, etc., I don't have one. You would need to use a scale but only for the flour and the water. The only other ingredient is the yeast (IDY) and, for that, you would use the volume measurement of about 1/3 teaspoon. For a different size pizza, you would have to use a dough calculating tool such as the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html.

If you do not have a scale or choose not to use one, then you might want to use the Mass-Volume Conversion Calculator at http://foodsim.unclesalmon.com/. That tool was designed by another member (November) for doing weight to volume conversions of different substances. Fortunately, the Harvest King flour (now renamed Better for Bread flour, from General Mills) is in the Substance pull-down menu. For the flour weight-to-volume conversion, you would select the flour Measurement Method you now use, or plan to use, and enter the appropriate weight data to be converted to volume measurements.

Good luck.

Peter

Offline yuma203

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #84 on: December 15, 2011, 07:49:12 PM »
The Crust.  I don't remember the quantities but this is how it's put together.  Start with a 40 qt Hobart mixer.  Add yeast to the mixing bowl.  Next measure out the required amount of water at exactly 80 degrees.  Pour the water in the bowl and mix it together with the yeast using a whisk.  Weigh the required amount of flour and dump it in the bowl.  Turn the mixer on for the required amount of time, the dough will eventually turn in to one big ball.  Squirt some corn oil on the work table and some in the bowl.  Turn the mixer on and lower the bowl.  Pull the dough out of the bowl and put it on the table on the corn oil.  Squirt a little more oil on the dough ball and roll it around just enough to cover the whole ball.  Start cutting off pieces of dough, weigh them to make sure their the right weight.  Using your hands tuck the piece of dough into a round ball.  Next dunk the ball in a tub of flour.  Drop the ball into the top of the sheeter.  The dough will come out of the middle of the sheeter in a long wide strip.  Flour both sides, use plenty of flour.  Slide the dough back into the sheeter and catch it out the bottom on a circular piece of cardboard.  The dough should hang off the sides about an inch or so.  Once you've got about 20 or 30 doughs out of the sheeter you start trimming the excess.  Put the cardboard on a can(tomato puree can), and spin it while trimming the excess dough.  Stack 10 doughs together and put them in the walk-in cooler.  They'll be ready after sitting one day in the cooler.  More to come....

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #85 on: December 15, 2011, 08:03:22 PM »
Dennis,

Do you remember the model of sheeter you used? For example, was it a Somerset or Anets model? And did you turn the skin after the first pass by ninety degrees before the second pass through the sheeter?

Peter

Offline yuma203

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #86 on: December 15, 2011, 10:02:51 PM »
Peter,

I'm not sure what kind of sheeter we used. I'll do a little Internet research and see if I can find something that'll jog my memory.

After we dropped the dough down through the top then yes, you turned it ninety degrees and fed it back into the sheeter.   


I'll post more when I get time.  I worked there for eight years but that was a long time ago.  I made pizzas, cooked them, made pizza doughs, etc, etc. 

Dennis

Offline yuma203

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #87 on: December 16, 2011, 01:15:50 AM »
Peter,

I'm pretty sure we used an Anets sheeter.  I found some pictures of them online and they looked exactly like the one we used to use.  I remember we had a set of feeler gauges to set the rollers depending on if we were making the dough for the thin crust or for the thick crust. 

Some other things I remember:

We had a shaker filled with garlic salt and one filled with basil.  When you finished making a pizza you gave it two passes with the garlic salt and one pass with the basil.

The thin crust sauce was made of tomato puree, oregano powder, salt, and black pepper.  I think it was two cans of puree to one can of water.  They were big cans, I think a #10.  Maybe two tablespoons of oregano, two tablespoons of salt, and two teaspoons of black pepper.  This is not the exact recipe but I think it's close.  The sauce for the thick crust was similar except it had a couple of tablespoons of sugar added.

The ovens we used were hot.  650 degrees Fahrenheit.  Whoever made the dough in the morning had to light the ovens when they got there in order for the stones to heat up enough by lunchtime. 

We used cornmeal on the pizza boards so the pizza could slide off and into the oven.  After you sprinkled the cornmeal on the board and put down the dough, you'd rake the dough with a spiked roller.  This kept the pizza from blowing up like a balloon in the oven.

It took about 5-8 minutes for a thin crust pizza to cook, depending on where you put it in the oven (the back of the oven was a lot hotter).  You spun the pizza 180 degrees halfway through the cooking process.

We used a big Hobart machine to grind all our cheese and vegetables.  The mozzarella came in huge blocks that we cut up and then fed through the grinder.  It came out in long strings that we used our hands to break up into small pieces.   When I first started working there all are veggies were fresh, when I left we had started getting the carrots, green peppers, and onions precut in bags. 

The Italian sausage was a special blend from one particular company.  The french dressing came in big one gallon jugs, it was labeled "Sweet N Tart".  More people used the french dressing on their pizza than on their salad!

The thick crust dough was similar to the thin crust dough except we added sugar to it and the water was at 90 degrees.  If I remember correctly the breadsticks were made out of the thick crust dough.  We sprinkled kosher salt on the breadsticks before we cooked them.

I still love the thin crust pizza there.  Every time I visit home (Illinois), I make sure I visit Monical's.

Dennis


Online Pete-zza

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #88 on: December 16, 2011, 10:09:08 AM »
Dennis,

Thank you for the additional information. Anets is quite big in the Midwest. Giordano's is or was a user of Anets sheeters although I was told by someone I spoke with on the subject of rollers that Giordano's was switching to Somerset rollers in some locations.

It's been a while since I last looked at the Nutrition Facts given by Monical's at its website, at http://www.monicalspizza.com/UserFiles/file/Individual%20Pizzas.pdf. But looking at that information last night and again today, that information has not changed since I last looked at it a couple of years or so ago.

The Monical's Nutrition Facts are quite informative. However, they are quite odd in some respects. For example, the entries in the Nutrition Facts appear to be exact, without the kind of rounding that the FDA permits. From a reverse engineering standpoint, that is good because rounding can change values quite dramatically, and especially where the rounding values become cumulative. Monical's also does not give a serving size, serving size weight, and the number of servings (e.g., a serving size for a pizza is usually a slice). That kind of information makes it easier to reverse engineer products such as pizzas since most of the other numbers in Nutrition Facts (other than calories) are also given by weight. Also, the Monical's Nutrition Facts are for only an individual size pizza, which is 8". Most pizza operators, and especially chains, give the data for all sizes. In Monical's case, however, there used to be a second part of the Monical's Nutrition Facts that said (and later confirmed by an exchange I had with Monical's) that the data for the 8" size (thin crust) was a third of that for the 14" size and a quarter of that for the 16" size. Presumably, that meant that for a 14" pizza, one would use a dough ball three times the weight of that for an 8" pizza and, similarly, for a 16" pizza, one would use a dough ball four times the weight of of that for an 8" pizza. There is nothing in the Monical's Nutrition Facts that explicitly gives the weights of the dough balls. This might be because some of the dough ends up on the cutting room floor after trimming from the cardboard rounds.

Finally, there are empty spots (not even zeros) in the Monical's Nutrition Facts. An example is the column for Sugar. Usually, the entry in Nutrition Facts is for "Sugars" (in the plural), since there are simple and complex sugars that can exist in a dough even if not added to the dough externally, as by adding sucrose (table sugar) or some other sweetener. All flours have small amounts of natural "sugars". The blank space for Sugar may simply mean that Monical's does not add sugar to their thin crust dough. The numbers convince me that there is no sugar added to the thin crust dough. 

Monical's also does not add salt to its dough. There is an entry for sodium but, at 3.9mg, it its trivially small. That amount of sodium is equivalent to 0.00168th of a teaspoon of salt. Under current FDA regulations, Monical's could have entered 0 into the Sodium column because it is less than 5mg. So, where does the sodium come from? There is natural sodium in just about all flours. It is about 1mg for a 100mg sample. There is also natural sodium in water and in yeast. But, they are trivial amounts. I do not even bother to account for them in the work that I do with Nutrition Facts. It is clear that Monical's does not add salt to their dough.

From the data for Carbohydrates, Fiber and Protein, I am fairly confident that Monical's is using a low-protein flour, quite possibly an H&R flour or its equivalent. In fact, the numbers seem to mirror the values of the above components in a 100g serving of all-purpose flour. The Total Fat and Sat Fat entries in the Monical's Nutrition Facts are consistent with the generic numbers for many oils, including corn oil. The values given in the Monical's Nutrition Facts is equivalent to about 1/5th of a teaspoon of corn oil.

So, to sum up, the Monical's Nutrition Facts tell us that the Monical's thin crust dough is made up only of flour (most likely all-purpose flour), water, and yeast, with a small amount of oil. No added salt and no added sugar. We don't know if the yeast is IDY or ADY but if the water used to rehydrate the yeast is warm, that would suggest ADY rather than IDY. Either way, it should not be difficult to come up with an amount of either IDY or ADY for a one-day cold ferment.

With respect to the pizza sauce, when I first looked at the numbers for the sauce (for the 8" pizza size), the numbers were so small that I concluded that either a very small amount of sauce was used for the 8" size (maybe less than a couple of ounces) or the tomatoes were watered down. From what you say, it may be the latter, although the total amount of sauce could still be small.

While I haven't studied the Monical Nutrition Facts in detail on the matter of the amount of mozzarella cheese used, the numbers suggest about 2.5 ounces for the 8" size thin crust pizza. The numbers for mozzarella cheese, both low-fat part-skim and whole milk mozzarella cheese, can vary from one brand to another, so the actual amount may be somewhere between 2-3 ounces for an 8" thin crust pizza.

It is very common for pizza operators to use a given pizza dough to make breadsticks. Last night, when I looked at the Monical's Nutrition Facts for breadsticks, at http://www.monicalspizza.com/UserFiles/file/Non%20pizza%20items.pdf, I did not see a Sugar entry but the Sodium value is considerably higher than for the dough used to make the thin 8" pizza. That made me think that there was salt that was sprinkled on the breadsticks. When I looked at the photo of the breadsticks, at http://www.monicalspizza.com/menus/default.aspx?SegmentId=1&pg=1, I could clearly see grains of salt. And those grains were large enough to suggest Kosher salt, much as one would use with pretzels.

Somewhere in the course of this thread, someone said that the crust made using the Monical's clone dough formulation that I set forth was a bit too thick. That is quite possible. And, if so, it is because there is insufficient information in the Monical's Nutrition Facts to determine the actual weight of either dough balls or of the actual skins after they are trimmed. There are perhaps other ways of getting the crust thickness right, or at least closer to the actual value, but we would need weights of baked pizzas (plain cheese pizzas are the easiest to work with) and work with those in concert with the Nutrition Facts.

Out of curiosity, when you worked for Monical's, did they recycle the scrap dough trimmed off from around the cardboard rounds? Also, I read somewhere that Monical's used white cornmeal on the peel. Is that your recollections also?

Peter


Offline yuma203

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #89 on: December 16, 2011, 12:10:55 PM »
Peter,

We would throw the scrap dough back in mixer with the next batch.  We waited until the new batch was almost finished mixing and then tossed in the scraps. 

We used yellow cornmeal on the pizza boards and white cornmeal on the trays we used to cook the breadsticks.

Dennis


Offline dualdj1

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #90 on: December 30, 2011, 02:14:17 PM »
Signing up!  I hope to give this a try this weekend, and will report with results.  We get Monicals fairly often, though not as often as the wife would like (due to finances), so if I can make a home version to supplement our Monicals intake, that would be awesome  ;D

Offline buenokid

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #91 on: January 14, 2012, 06:49:07 AM »
Seeing as this thread is active again. Thought I might contribute my recent pizza.

I followed everything pretty closely with a few modifications here and there.

I tried the sifting method and was ALMOST able to add all the flour with the minimum hydration. I only added a few drops extra to get all the flour in.

I pulled the dough cold, docked, and then baked immediately. This is how I've always done it.

I'm using an oven in Japan with a baking stone, however, it just didn't crisp the bottom. It's a quasi convection oven so it's a bit iffy to work with. I'm going to try baking on my grill tomorrow. I would say that most of the information covered in this thread is spot on. I think the only change I need is to make my crust a tad thicker. Monicals pizza underneath the cheese would get small bubbles and puffy. The expansion wasn't huge but enough to make it more than really flat.

Anyway, I'll be back with new information. If anyone has any questions feel free to ask.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2012, 06:50:53 AM by buenokid »

Offline Monical Manager

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #92 on: May 17, 2012, 08:16:22 PM »
I worked for Monicals in the 80's as a manager and can tell you this.  Whomever commented about the equipment being as big a part of it, as the recipe was right on the money.  If I remember correctly we all used Baker's Pride Ovens that we turned up all the way.  The pizza was prepared using the previous day's dough, on the corn breaded board and then slid directly onto the oven's deck.  This is what gives the crust the bubbly bottom.  Everything is a very basic, including the spices.  I've noticed that since Harry Bond took over the company the quality is way down, but several of the franchises still put out a quality product.  El Paso, IL being one. 

Offline pizzeriaromaleroy

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #93 on: December 18, 2012, 10:40:09 AM »
Hello,

  Let me tell ya if you trying to duplicate the "corporate Monical's" recipe knock your socks off cause it is not the same recipes for the dough or sauce that Ralph Monical used. My wife and I recently purchased Roma Ralph's Pizza and it is one of two pizza restaurants that were still owned and operated by Ralph. Ralph's oven of choice is Blodgett deck, and according to Ralph protein content of the flour is the most important part, but don't bother asking to say what that is.

Ralph is well into his 70's now and retiring. The sale of his other restaurant is up in the air and may be just closed all-together posibly leaving us as the only one left using the original recipe. I have heard that the Indiana franchises are the closest to the original recipe

If you want the original come to Le Roy IL, I have eaten at the one in El Paso a few times and while good for a franchise store still comes up short to ours. Gibson City is a good franchise store as well.

Offline pizzeriaromaleroy

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #94 on: December 18, 2012, 10:48:21 AM »
Yuma, you left out one important topping spice and the thick crust dough is a bit more different than just sugar. Also the dough is suppose to rise for a pre-determined amount of time before you cut up it into the sizes to be sheeted, this is very important.

Offline CDNpielover

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #95 on: January 26, 2013, 09:54:24 PM »
I just made a pizza using the formulation from reply #27.  I used the online dough calculator to convert the amounts to a 12" pizza.  The pie turned out great - a nice chew to the crust, which I haven't noticed in my pizzas before.  Unfortunately, this is only the second pizza I've made using all new equipment (new stone, oven, food processor, etc. etc. etc.), so i'm not sure if the chew is something specific to this formulation, or if it's from my equipment or how I made the dough.

Anyhow, I followed much of Pete's advice in various parts of this thread.  I first sifted the flour, then added it and the IDY to my food processor and processed to blend.  I then slowly added water and processed for about 30-40 seconds.  The dough would not form into a ball, so I let it rest for 5 minutes before processing for another 30-40 seconds.  During this second bout of processing, most (but not all) of the dough coalesced into a ball.  I let the dough rest for another 5 minutes and then processed a third time for 30 seconds, during which the dough fell into more pieces.  I removed the dough and was able to knead it into a nice ball.  I didn't need to add additional water.

I let the dough proof on the counter for 2 hours (my thermostat reads 71 F).  The dough had roughly doubled in size, I believe.  I then rolled the dough into a 12" skin, wrapped in plastic wrap and put in the refrigerator for about 24 hours.

The pie was topped with about 6 oz. of Great Value whole milk mozzarella, sausage, turkey pepperoni, black olives, and green peppers.  Cooked on my killer new fibrament stone, which measured about 450 using my IR "thermocouple."  Baked for 12 minutes.

Pie was great, I will make this again.  I do have a photo, maybe I will upload it if I ever get around to resizing the photo.  it's such a PITA to upload photos on this site!   :chef: :chef: :chef:

Thanks again Peter for all of your excellent work here.  I thoroughly enjoy reading (and copying haha) your work here.  You really should write a book about pizza, I'd be the first in line to buy it!   ;)

EDIT:  I did not think the crust was too thick, and someone commented earlier in the thread.  In fact, I thought it was absolutely perfect!  That said, I've never actually had Monical's so what do i know!
« Last Edit: January 26, 2013, 09:56:20 PM by CDNpielover »

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #96 on: January 27, 2013, 10:24:03 AM »
CDNpielover,

I'm glad the Monical's clone worked out for you. I occasionally read reports that the Monical's pizza has gone downhill. However, I don't know if that is true since I have never had one of their pizzas. But your clone was based on information that goes back a few years. Sometimes it only takes a cheapening of the ingredients to turn a good pizza bad.

Peter

Offline bubb1

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #97 on: February 05, 2013, 10:45:21 PM »
This thread was part of my motivation for registering on the forum.  I no longer have access to Monical's pizza often (living in CA now) and have found the quality to be degraded over time in Indiana locations, so I look forward to experimenting with some of the ideas put forth in this thread!

I respect that some people associated with the Monical's company do not want secrets divulged, but I for one am glad that some very talented people here have put their energy into extracting a fine facsimile of this wonderful product.  I'm happy to support the restaurants when possible.  After a visit home, I always make sure to take home a bottle of the Sweet and Tart dressing which goes wonderfully with their thin crust pizza!  I will post any results that I have. 

Online Chicago Bob

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #98 on: February 05, 2013, 11:43:06 PM »
This thread was part of my motivation for registering on the forum.  I no longer have access to Monical's pizza often (living in CA now) and have found the quality to be degraded over time in Indiana locations, so I look forward to experimenting with some of the ideas put forth in this thread!

I respect that some people associated with the Monical's company do not want secrets divulged, but I for one am glad that some very talented people here have put their energy into extracting a fine facsimile of this wonderful product.  I'm happy to support the restaurants when possible.  After a visit home, I always make sure to take home a bottle of the Sweet and Tart dressing which goes wonderfully with their thin crust pizza!  I will post any results that I have.  
bubba1,
" I'm happy to support the restaurants when possible."  :-D
It's cool man...this is what we do! And there ain't no stopp'in free information bruddah!!
Welcome to the forum.  8)
Bob
« Last Edit: February 05, 2013, 11:44:57 PM by Chicago Bob »
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Offline cryan8181

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Re: Monical's Pizza Recipe Wanted
« Reply #99 on: August 04, 2013, 09:30:40 PM »
Test post. 8" Monical's pizza.


 

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