Author Topic: hydration and size  (Read 1476 times)

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Offline itnenaer

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hydration and size
« on: July 05, 2008, 12:14:59 AM »
Peter gave me some great information about how to determine the dough amount for the size.  I’ll copy it here

[
color=blue]“The expression is quite simple. It is based on the surface area of a pizza and a so-called thickness factor. The actual expression is 3.14159 (pi) x R x R x TF, where R is the radius of the pizza and TF is the thickness factor. The value of the thickness factor is related to the type of pizza in the sense that different pizza types have different crust thicknesses. For example, an "elite" NY style pizza has a thickness factor of around 0.07-0.09. A NY "street" style had a thickness factor of about 0.10-0.105. An American style pizza or a Sicilian style pizza has a typical thickness factor of around 0.13-0.14. A cracker style pizza might have a thickness factor of from 0.06-0.09. A Neapolitan pizza might have a thickness factor of 0.07-0.08 (and even higher for a home oven application). I think you get the idea.

To give you an example, assume that you want to make a 14" NY street style pizza. The weight of dough for that size pizza would be 3.14159 x 7 x 7 x 0.10 = 15.39 oz. You can make the pizza crust thicker or thinner by changing the thickness factor.”

Peter[/color]
[/pre]

So from that, I have a new question, primarily directed @ Peter, but welcome other comments, input, insights. 

My hydration question stems from Peter Reinharts recipe in bread baker’s apprentice.   In his pizza recipe, he uses high hydration in comparison to the recipes I’ve seen on the forum.  So far the highest I’ve seen is 67%.  In Reinhart’s recipe he does 69.1 water, with an added 9.9 of oil.  I’ don’t like that much oil in my dough so I normally cut it down to like 3% with water being around 68-70%.  I keep it in the fridge for about 2 days and its not all that wet. 

My size question is in his recipe he says you can stretch out 6 oz. dough to about 9-12”.   I tried a 9 oz dough and was about to get it to 12-14” (although sometimes it tears).  Is the difference because in his recipe it’s a Napolenta in comparison to NY?  Does that also explain the difference in hydration?   

I remember in Jersey, would see them have a large dough in their (not sure what they are called, looks like a cake pan) bins.  I’m on a personal mission to perfect my 16” and 18”. 
Next week when I get my flours I’ll follow the equation and post some pics. 

Online Pete-zza

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Re: hydration and size
« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2008, 07:44:29 AM »
itnenaer,

As reported at Reply 19 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,203.msg54497/topicseen.html#msg54497, I attempted the Reinhart dough recipe you mentioned, so I am generally familiar with it. To be honest, I have no idea as to the origins of the Reinhart recipe. If I had to guess, I would say that it was perhaps an extension or adaptation of his work with breads. If, for example, you look at the pizza dough recipes that Reinhart included in his pizza cookbook, American Pie, which he wrote after the Bread Baker's Apprentice, after traveling and extensively researching the subject of pizza both in the U.S. and Italy, you will not find a dough recipe such as the one he included in the Bread Baker's Apprentice book. What makes that recipe unusual and not easy to fit into any one of the traditional pizza styles is not the high hydration but rather the very high amount of oil. That aspect is not part of the Neapolitan pizza tradition, as I so noted at Reply 11 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6327.msg54341.html#msg54341. I personally view the Reinhart dough recipe as somewhat an anomaly that doesn't conveniently fit one of the traditional pizza style classifications, including those that were covered in Reinhart's later book American Pie.

In your case, by lowering the hydration and the amount of oil, you basically converted Reinhart's recipe to a NY style dough recipe, with a thin crust. If you plan to use the Reinhart recipe as you modified it to make a 16"-18" pizza, rather than using the Reinhart recipe as it now stands, that is perhaps a good thing because if you try to use the Reinhart dough recipe as it now stands to make pizzas that size you would no doubt have a lot of problems handling and shaping and stretching the dough out to that size because of the extreme wetness of the dough. If you used 9 ounces of dough to make a 12"-14" inch pizza, that translates into a thickness factor of 0.0585-0.0796. In experimenting with your 16"-18" pizzas, you will want to select both a hydration value and a thickness factor that will produce the results you are looking for but keep in mind that working with doughs for pizzas that size, especially at high hydration values, is more challenging than working with much smaller pizzas such as those contemplated by the Reinhart recipe. If you'd like, I can help you come up with a formulation that you might try based on whatever set of baker's percents, pizza size, and thickness factor you would like to use. At your option, it can be a modification of the Reinhart recipe or a completely new one.

Peter