Author Topic: Greek pizza  (Read 91081 times)

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Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #140 on: January 27, 2011, 05:46:12 PM »
Norma,

When I first tried the Greek-style dough as discussed at Reply 20, I used a sloping sided PizzaTools 14" PSTK cutter pan and I shaped the skin to fit the bottom diameter of the pan (13.5 inches). At the time, the dough calculating tools did not exist and I did not use a bowl residue compensation. I did all the math using a calculator and possibly a spreadsheet. However, the pan size I used for calculation purposes was the 13.5" diameter of the bottom of the pan, relying on the fact that the dough would rise in the pan during the final proof before dressing and baking and fill it up to a certain extent. In your case, with your sloping sided pan with a bottom diameter of 11", you would need 3.14159 x (11/2) x (11/2) x 0.11, or 10.45 ounces/296.36 grams of dough.

If you discover that you can make a satisfactory Greek-style pizza using your preferment Lehmann dough formulation, you might be able to flip your preferment Lehmann formulation around to include some sugar, maybe up to 2% provided that the bottom crust doesn't brown too quickly or excessively. That will perhaps be less of an issue with your home oven than with your deck oven at market. If your preferment Lehmann formulation can tolerate some sugar, then you might find that you end up with only one dough for both types pizzas. Of course, the proof of the pudding (or should I say, pizza) will in the eating.

Peter

Peter,

I appreciate you told me how much dough I will need for a Greek-style pizza in my deep-dish sloping pan.  I will weigh my doughs in the freezer tomorrow and see if one of them can be used in an experiment at home over the weekend.  I will also make one preferment Lehmann dough ball to try with added sugar to try at market on Tuesday, if it doesn’t snow in our area again.  I would really like to be able to use one dough at market and be able to make Greek-style pizza to see if anymore customers might be interested in trying them.  I know the one person that tried Steve’s (Ev) Greek-style he made really liked the Greek-style pizza.  I am sure other customers would also like the Greek-style pizza if we first gave samples.  I have 4 sloping deep-dish pans, so if the preferment Lehmann dough works out either with or without the sugar, it would be a breeze to make Greek-style pizza at market.  I also have the 18" steel deep-dish pan at market.

Steve’s Greek-style was delicious.  Did you ever try to put pepperoni on the Greek-style pizza like Steve did?  Also did you take any pictures of your last Greek-style pizza you made?

I will see if the proof is in the pudding (or in the pizza)!  Lol

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #141 on: January 27, 2011, 06:59:46 PM »
Steve’s Greek-style was delicious.  Did you ever try to put pepperoni on the Greek-style pizza like Steve did?  Also did you take any pictures of your last Greek-style pizza you made?


Norma,

No, I did not try putting the pepperoni under the cheese with any of my Greek-style pizzas. However, that is one of the trademark methods used by Buddy's in Detroit, as it points out in its menu at page 2 at http://www.buddyspizza.com/documents/Menu.pdf.

I did not take a photo of my last Greek-style pizza since it did not add anything of note worth reporting. I found my notes, however, and one change I made was to use a smaller amount of dough and thickness factor to make a 10" pizza. That change was based on information I gained some time ago from one of the owners of a Massachusetts pizzeria specializing in the Greek-style pizza. The thickness factor that I used to conform to what the pizzeria was doing was 0.08913 (7 ounces for a 10" pan). The finished pizza was thinner than my normal Greek-style pizzas using the modified Lehmann dough but it was still very tasty.

I think what really makes the Greek-style pizzas is the use of cheddar cheese (among other cheeses) and getting a nice crispy bottom. The Greek-style is one of my all-time favorites. I think it is underrecognized.

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #142 on: January 27, 2011, 07:24:10 PM »
Peter,

Thanks for telling me the pepperoni under the cheese is a trademark method used by Buddy’s in Detroit. 

I also think the Greek style is under recognized.  Just because it doesn’t have a puffy rim, with the cheddar cheese, nice dark crisp rim and softness it is really a great pizza in my opinion too.  If it wasn’t for Steve remembering he ate the Greek-style a long while ago, I probably wouldn’t have tried the Greek-style for a long while.

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #143 on: January 29, 2011, 08:23:01 PM »
I removed one preferment Lehmann dough ball from my freezer that was smaller.  It wasn’t the right weight Peter set-forth for a Greek-style pizza, so after it was unfrozen in the mircowave, I just cut off a small portion until it weighed the right weight.  I didn’t want to waste the small piece of dough so I used that for another experiment.  I pressed on the edges and the middle of the dough while it was in the deep-dish pan so the dough wouldn’t rise too much while it was in the oven.

I must say the preferment Lehmann dough did work out well for a Greek-style pizza in my sloping deep-dish pan.  My home oven was around 500 degrees F and I put the deep-dish pan right on the stone on the second to the bottom rack position.  I was surprised how well the preferment Lehmann dough worked out for this pie.  The edges turned out nice and crunchy and the bottom browned well. The deep-dish pan was slightly oiled.  What really surprised me was the crust of this Greek-style pizza tasted so much different than my regular pizzas I made with the preferment Lehmann dough.  I don’t see why any sugar would have to be added to my preferment Lehmann dough formula.  I really enjoyed the slices of the Greek-style pie I ate.  ;D

Thanks Peter for figuring out how much dough I needed for my sloping deep-dish pan. 

Pictures below

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #144 on: January 29, 2011, 08:25:19 PM »
rest of pictures

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #145 on: January 29, 2011, 08:52:44 PM »
Norma,

I'm glad the Lehmann Greek-style pizza worked out well for you. I don't know why I didn't think of it earlier. If you hadn't decided to reheat a couple of slices from Steve's Greek-style pizza and to comment favorably on it, I think I would have missed it. In retrospect, it was in the numbers.

Do you think that your Lehmann Greek-style pizza was good enough to offer at market? Also, at some point you might want to repeat the experiment but using your regular preferment Lehmann dough (not frozen) and your oven at market. It might still be an interesting experiment to modify your preferment Lehmann dough to see if that works better for the Greek style pizza but not adversely affect your regular preferment Lehmann pizzas.

Can you tell me what weight of dough you are currently using to make the preferment Lehmann pizzas at market?

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #146 on: January 29, 2011, 09:10:13 PM »
Norma,

I'm glad the Lehmann Greek-style pizza worked out well for you. I don't know why I didn't think of it earlier. If you hadn't decided to reheat a couple of slices from Steve's Greek-style pizza and to comment favorably on it, I think I would have missed it. In retrospect, it was in the numbers.

Do you think that your Lehmann Greek-style pizza was good enough to offer at market? Also, at some point you might want to repeat the experiment but using your regular preferment Lehmann dough (not frozen) and your oven at market. It might still be an interesting experiment to modify your preferment Lehmann dough to see if that works better for the Greek style pizza but not adversely affect your regular preferment Lehmann pizzas.

Can you tell me what weight of dough you are currently using to make the preferment Lehmann pizzas at market?

Peter

Peter,

I am also glad the preferment Lehmann dough did work out well for the Greek-style of pizza.  I am also glad you decided to look at the numbers after I reheated Steve’s slice of Greek-style pizza. 

Yes, I do believe the Lehmann Greek-style pizza is good enough to offer at market.  If it doesn’t snow a lot on Tuesday I will repeat the experiment with my unfrozen Lehmann dough at market.  I had planned on Monday to use some of my poolish to make at least one or possibly 5 dough balls with sugar to see what would happen to my preferment Lehmann dough.  If it doesn’t snow a lot, I will still do the experiments this week.  If they are calling for a lot of snow, I will just make the regular preferment Lehmann dough and try the experiment the next week. 

The weight of my dough balls at market now are 1.995 lbs.  I can weigh out any amount, but found I like the crusts on my regular NY style pizzas a little thicker than I did before.  I usually have some extra dough leftover from the batches I make, but I just use them for other things I made at market.

Thanks again for thinking about a Greek-style pizza out of my regular dough.  :)

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #147 on: January 29, 2011, 09:16:55 PM »
The weight of my dough balls at market now are 1.995 lbs.

Norma,

Are you sure about that number? 1.995 pounds is just under 32 ounces. That would translate to a thickness factor of about 0.16.

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #148 on: January 29, 2011, 09:33:19 PM »
Norma,

Are you sure about that number? 1.995 pounds is just under 32 ounces. That would translate to a thickness factor of about 0.16.

Peter

Peter,

That was my error.  I meant to type in 1.095 lbs.

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #149 on: January 29, 2011, 09:56:04 PM »
Norma,

Thank you.

The reason why I asked you the dough ball weight is because I wondered what size pan (cutter or deep-dish) you could use, based on a thickness factor of 0.11, without having to change your current dough ball weight of 1.095 pounds. That number (diameter) is calculated by taking two times the square root of (1.096 x 16)/(3.14159 x 0.11). The answer is a diameter of about 14.25". If we treat that as the bottom diameter of a sloping-sided pan, you can see from the PizzaTools website at http://www.pizzatools.com/Cutter_Pans/30870/subgrouping.htm that that would represent a 15" PSTK cutter pan or a 15" PSTK nesting deep-dish pan as shown at http://www.pizzatools.com/Deep_Dish_Nesting/30872/subgrouping.htm. If a preferment Lehmann Greek-style pizza would bake up well in such a pan, and it could be sold (i.e., there is a demand for it), then you could use the same dough ball for the Greek-style pizza as you now use for your 16" NY style.

Peter


Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #150 on: January 29, 2011, 10:34:17 PM »
Peter,

Thank you for figuring out what thickness factor I now use for the preferment Lehmann dough ball weight.  I wasn’t even sure what TF I was using currently.

When I see all those numbers I still freeze.  Maybe one of these days I will be able to figure all this out.

Thanks for also finding what size cutter pan or nesting deep-dish pan I could use for my current dough weight.  For right now, I will use the same weight you gave me for my sloping deep-dish pan because I do have 4 sloping deep dish pans.  I use one at market for making Sicilian pizza out of the preferment Lehmann dough, but if I need them, I also can take the other deep-dish pans to market.  If I ever can sell enough Greek-style pizzas (or even take hold), then I might consider getting some new pans.  Do you see any advantage in using a cutter pan instead of a deep-dish pan for the Greek-style pizza?  I don’t have any dark cutter pans, I just have aluminum ones.

Norma
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Offline Ronzo

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #151 on: January 30, 2011, 01:38:51 AM »
Norma, that is beautiful stuff
Fuggheddabowdit!

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Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #152 on: January 30, 2011, 08:02:43 AM »
Norma, that is beautiful stuff

Ron,

Thanks for the kind words!  :)  Did you ever try a Greek-style pizza?  They are very easy to make and the taste is delicious.  You don't have to worry that much about opening a skin.  In my opinion the cheddar and the crust of this style of pizza makes it so different.

Norma
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Offline JConk007

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #153 on: January 30, 2011, 08:19:19 AM »
Norma,
Looks great as all ways! I did not see it but was there any modification to the sauce you used? I grew up on this style in Franklin Mass. and then again in Laconia NH .Now in Jersey you know its NY alll the way.
Thanks
JOhn
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Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #154 on: January 30, 2011, 08:27:12 AM »
Norma,
Looks great as all ways! I did not see it but was there any modification to the sauce you used? I grew up on this style in Franklin Mass. and then again in Laconia NH .Now in Jersey you know its NY alll the way.
Thanks
JOhn

John,

Thanks so much for your compliment!   :) I used the regular sauce I use at market.  I didn’t know you grew up on this style of pizza. Steve used a different sauce, but his Greek-style was excellent also. Do you ever make Greek-style pizza?  I really like NY style, but have found since Steve made a Greek-style for me I might change my mind at some point and like this style of pizza better than NY style.  If you did make this style of pizza, what sauce did you use?  It was easy to make in my home oven.

Norma
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Offline JConk007

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #155 on: January 30, 2011, 08:33:19 AM »
Everybody here prefers the thin crust and cracker, but the good news is I am the one who makes them all :chef: so Yes I will try it this winter indoors at some point.
John
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Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #156 on: January 30, 2011, 08:38:57 AM »
Everybody here prefers the thin crust and cracker, but the good news is I am the one who makes them all :chef: so Yes I will try it this winter indoors at some point.
John

John,

That is good news that you are the only one that makes all the pizzas, so you should have fun with this style of pizza and also bring back memories.   :chef: :chef:

Post up your pictures when you have a chance to make the Greek-style pizza.

Norma
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Offline Ronzo

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #157 on: January 30, 2011, 09:38:22 AM »
Ron,

Thanks for the kind words!  :)  Did you ever try a Greek-style pizza?  They are very easy to make and the taste is delicious.  You don't have to worry that much about opening a skin.  In my opinion the cheddar and the crust of this style of pizza makes it so different.

Norma
No I haven't yet, but it's on the list.

The pie reminds me of a Detroit style Sicilian. They do the same thing with the white cheddar around the edge of the pan, only on a rectangle instead of the round pan. I agree with you on that part. It gets nice and crunchy and slightly nutty in flavor. Killer.
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Offline norma427

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #158 on: January 30, 2011, 10:02:18 AM »
No I haven't yet, but it's on the list.

The pie reminds me of a Detroit style Sicilian. They do the same thing with the white cheddar around the edge of the pan, only on a rectangle instead of the round pan. I agree with you on that part. It gets nice and crunchy and slightly nutty in flavor. Killer.

Ron,

I have tried Sicilian styles, when I made some Grandma’s pies and some on the Sicilian thread I am on and did oil the rectangular pans.  Somehow the Greek-style tastes different to me, maybe because the crust is thinner.  I am not sure why it tastes different.  I also think the crunchy part on the edges is the best!

Looking forward to what you think of the Greek-style pizza, when you have time to make one.  :)

Norma
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Offline Ronzo

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Re: Greek pizza
« Reply #159 on: January 30, 2011, 10:27:09 AM »
Ron,

I have tried Sicilian styles, when I made some Grandma’s pies and some on the Sicilian thread I am on and did oil the rectangular pans.  Somehow the Greek-style tastes different to me, maybe because the crust is thinner.  I am not sure why it tastes different.  I also think the crunchy part on the edges is the best!

Looking forward to what you think of the Greek-style pizza, when you have time to make one.  :)

Norma

I think you're probably right, Norma. The make up of the dough flavor is probably very different as well. With that said, the Detroit style Sicillian I'm talking about is completely different from the NY style Sicilian I grew up with, so everyone's idea of Sicilian is based on their perspective.

I may just try this some time this week. I need a good pan, though.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2011, 10:29:04 AM by Ronzo »
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