Author Topic: Burts/Pequods  (Read 27275 times)

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Offline loowaters

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #40 on: December 26, 2011, 10:23:03 PM »
This comes up from time to time, so no worries about asking about pre-cooked sausage.  Please, I'm beggin' ya, put the sausage on raw.  From what I've seen, Pequod's uses large slabs of sausage, flattened out.  Looking around at other posts you'll see there's different ways to go about distributing the sausage on different styles. 

No cheese on the bottom of the pan.  The dough was placed in and left to rise without any side walls of dough pulled up like in a traditional type of Chicago Style deep dish.  I placed cheese on the dough leaning up the inside wall of the pan, almost to the top, then gave full coverage within those slices, creating a "bowl of cheese" effect.  That cheese on the side melts, slides, and caramelizes while the pizza cooks.

Good luck and post pics.

Loo
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Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #41 on: December 26, 2011, 10:42:20 PM »
This comes up from time to time, so no worries about asking about pre-cooked sausage.  Please, I'm beggin' ya, put the sausage on raw.  From what I've seen, Pequod's uses large slabs of sausage, flattened out.
Yes. What Loo said. :-)
I think most places in Chicago put the sausage on raw, from thin crust to deep dish.

It's been a few months since I've been to Pequod's, but I can tell you that they're more like half-golfball sized chunks of sausage. They don't do a solid patty slab across the whole pie like Lou Malnati's, Pizzeria Uno, or Gino's.
These are definitely pieces.
Check out the photo from Serious Eats: http://slice.seriouseats.com/images/20080730-pequods-pie.jpg
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Offline loowaters

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #42 on: December 30, 2011, 08:55:48 PM »
Thanks VCB, I wasn't very clear.  If I made it sound like Pequod's did a sausage patty, I apologize, that wasn't my intent.  Their chunks seem larger than most places and I flatten them a bit. 

Loo
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Offline Dibromin

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #43 on: January 17, 2012, 07:30:41 AM »
Using the techniques from this blog, I was able to make a good replica of the Pequod's pizza.  My crust was thicker and drier but, otherwise, it was very similar.  Who would have thought to use SLICED mozzarella?  Thanks everyone!
 

Offline BBH

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #44 on: January 17, 2012, 04:12:34 PM »
Is the pizza really that good?  Or is it the mystique and the fact that these places have been around for so long the reputation is automatic.  Burtís place is unusual, serves in an unusual manner (order ahead of time, pizza goes on a central table etcÖ) a guy that looks like popcorn the moonshiner making the piesÖ.itís all real cool and fun but is the pizza really all that fantastic.  What if a place opened up in a strip mall, didnít have the mystique and served a pizza that looked like that Ė would it be a hit?  Iím not too sure.

Case in point.  There is a famous Italian sausage place in Chicago.  Been there for 50 years, people raved about the sausage so I make the trip and go get some.  While there I talk to the owner and we get to discussing her business and the sausage.  She told me that they opened a new place in another town nearby.  The meat was made at the original facility and delivered within 1 hour to the new place. 

She told me people didnít like the sausage as much, she would tell them itís made at the original location and delivered to the new.  Her customers insisted it tasted different Ė she was perplexed.  Later they closed the new location.

I think some of the old school places have an old reputation that just keeps getting circulated, parent to kids and on it goes. 

Is that pizza really all that good Ė I keep meaning to try itÖ..

Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #45 on: February 06, 2012, 05:17:32 PM »
Is the pizza really that good?

Yes.

I was making some deep dish test pizzas (and videos which I hope to soon get up on my website),
and while building a pequod hybrid pie, something occurred to me.

I think most of us have come to the conclusion that while baking a Burt's or Pequod's style pizza,
the cheese melts down into the edges of the pan and burns into dark crispy nirvana (if you're in to that sort of thing).

I think it may actually be a combination of cheese AND pizza sauce that is charring into that outer-edge that many of us crave.
Next time you try making a pequod-style pizza at home, make sure that you get that layer of cheese leaning against the inside of the pan, but also run your pizza sauce as far out to the edge as you can get it, so when the cheese starts melting down into the void between the rising pizza dough and the pan wall, the sauce will follow down the void.

Another suggestion: If you're using pepperoni on your 'quod clone, start with the oven at about 460-475, and keep a loose sheet of aluminum foil over the pizza pan for the first 20 minutes of baking. The outer edge will still char, but the pepperoni won't burn. Then remove the foil cover for the remaining bake time.

I don't have a favorite dough recipe for this style of pizza yet.
Has anyone got a good puffy,pillowy dough recipe they like?
-- Ed Heller -aka- VCBurger -- Real Deep Dish - Deep Dish 101
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Offline BBH

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #46 on: March 06, 2012, 12:25:11 AM »
This place is exactly what I said it was....caramelized cheese?  You mean burnt cheese. 
Italian Sausage? Nope, more like the polish version with garlic, no fennel to be found...special sauce? Nope, a typical cooked sauce with decent spices. A special crust? Nope, not at all, served right from the warped pan, rather dull, lacking flavor.  The bottom was very crisp and the smell reminded me of Bisquick to a degree.

All Hype.....

I also don't understand why the health department hasn't shut this place down...OMG....

Offline Rich

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #47 on: March 26, 2012, 02:41:18 AM »
Like others have said on here - Pequod's and Burt's are in their own category for deep dish.  Personally, I prefer Pequod's overall for the pizza itself, that you don't have to call ahead just to see if you can eat there, and the reality that Burt isn't getting any younger.  I love Pequod's.  The sauce is acidic, the carmelized cheese is addicting, and the overall pizza is great.  The only knock I have on it is that it can be a bit bready.  Much more so than any other deep dish place that I know.  Burt's is much thinner overall and he has a little different taste.

Pequod's (and Burt's) are definitely love/hate pizzas.  Everyone I know either loves them or hates them.  I haven't found anyone that thinks the pizzas are just good.  Most people I know love them, my girlfriend is not one of them.  I;ve brought many of them home to eat in front of her while she says "I can't believe you like that!" :D

I'm going next week to one of them for my birthday.  Have to flip a coin as to which one I want to go.  I haven't had Burt's in a long time, so maybe I'll give the bearded one my biz.

Offline pulykamell

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #48 on: July 20, 2012, 05:34:58 PM »
Great, great pictures, Ed.  Looks as good as any of the many Pequod's pizzas that I had over the years.  Their crust is substantially different from the Malnati's, Gino's East, Due's, and Pizano's, but still excellent in their own unique way.  It's been a long time since I had a Buddy's in Detroit, but since you mentioned it, that does seem like a similar style

Pequod's/Burt's does very much remind me of Buddy's. I kind of think of Pequod's as a cross between Chicago deep dish and Detroit-style pan/Sicilian pizza. I've had good luck recreating the Pequod's/Burt's style of pies by reading up on the posts on Detroit-style pizza here.  Pizzahog's recipe and technique in post #199 works for me, I just use a round cast-iron pan instead of a square one as in Detroit pizza. White cheddar around the edges, mozzarella in the middle, uncooked 6-in-1 tomatoes with a pinch of oregano for the sauce (sauce more distributed than on a Detroit-style pie), and it works pretty darned well for me.

I'm definitely a big fan of Burt's. There's no hype there. He just makes damned great pizza.


Offline rcbaughn

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #49 on: July 30, 2012, 10:14:51 PM »
This place is exactly what I said it was....caramelized cheese?  You mean burnt cheese.  
Italian Sausage? Nope, more like the polish version with garlic, no fennel to be found...special sauce? Nope, a typical cooked sauce with decent spices. A special crust? Nope, not at all, served right from the warped pan, rather dull, lacking flavor.  The bottom was very crisp and the smell reminded me of Bisquick to a degree.

All Hype.....

I also don't understand why the health department hasn't shut this place down...OMG....

To me there is a huge difference in burnt and caramelized cheese. I have personally never eaten there but I suspect it's good. Those are some strong words though, but everyone's palette and preferences are different. This is going to be the next style pie I try to make, I love the idea of caramelized cheese on the outside of a pie. I even like to spread cheese to the edge of my thinner pizzas and let them char a bit on the pan. Viva la char!

Is it really that nasty though? The No Reservations episode made the place look like any other dive style restaurant I've seen or been to. Then again I love places like that.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2012, 10:16:28 PM by rcbaughn »
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Offline PuRowdy

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #50 on: August 23, 2012, 02:57:55 PM »
This is the 2nd best pizza I've ever had and by far the best Chicago Style I've had.  I lived in the city for 3 years and didn't find anything that compared to Pequods.  Here is a video I found that goes into pretty good detail on how they make the pizza and get that crust to carmelize. 



They are just using mozzarella cheese, and as you can see it gets lined up all around the edge right over the crust.  Can't wait to try this next time I make deep dish at home.


Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #51 on: August 25, 2012, 02:09:07 PM »
This is the 2nd best pizza I've ever had and by far the best Chicago Style I've had.  I lived in the city for 3 years and didn't find anything that compared to Pequods.  Here is a video I found that goes into pretty good detail on how they make the pizza and get that crust to carmelize. 



They are just using mozzarella cheese, and as you can see it gets lined up all around the edge right over the crust.  Can't wait to try this next time I make deep dish at home.


Pequod's/Burt's,2 places....I don't know that I would call this a "Chicago Style" ?  Actually, I think it is some sort of Greek style. Ev and others make this in a square pan over on the Sicilian section I believe.
Tasty look'in pizza for sure though....
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Offline OTRChef

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #52 on: August 26, 2012, 10:46:48 AM »
Pequod's/Burt's,2 places....I don't know that I would call this a "Chicago Style" ?  Actually, I think it is some sort of Greek style. Ev and others make this in a square pan over on the Sicilian section I believe.
Tasty look'in pizza for sure though....

I totally agree, Pequod's is NOT Chicago Style pizza! It amazes me that "Chicago's Best" would choose Pequods as a local favorite rather than Aurelios, who have been a local favorite in Chicago a lot longer than Pequods. I guess they'll be picking Home Run Inn Pizza next.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #53 on: August 26, 2012, 12:10:27 PM »
I totally agree, Pequod's is NOT Chicago Style pizza! It amazes me that "Chicago's Best" would choose Pequods as a local favorite rather than Aurelios, who have been a local favorite in Chicago a lot longer than Pequods. I guess they'll be picking Home Run Inn Pizza next.
Well, if they make that mistake at least they'll have chosen a Chicago (thin crust) "style".   ;D
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Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #54 on: August 26, 2012, 02:40:39 PM »
Well, if they make that mistake at least they'll have chosen a Chicago (thin crust) "style".   ;D

I would qualify Pequod's/Burt's style pizza as a Chicago style, but I call it a "modern" variation of Chicago Deep Dish.
In the early seventies, two major variations of Chicago Deep Dish were invented: Stuffed, which has become a category of its own, and Pequod's "Pizza In The Pan", which some call "medium dish".

The origins of the Pequod's style are still a bit of a mystery.
I had been calling Pequod's a Detroit/Chicago Hybrid, as it has the characteristics of a Detroit/Sicilian style of pan pizza like Buddy's (burnt cheese on the edges), but baked in a round Chicago deep dish pan (sauce on top).
The geographic proximity of Detroit and Chicago made sense at the time, but as I'm learning more about regional styles, I also see major similarities to the rectangular pizzas from L & B Spumoni Gardens in Brooklyn, New York, who make a rectangular Sicilian pan pizza with the sauce on top.

However, if you follow the history of Burt Katz , the guy who invented the Pequod's Style of pizza, you'll see he grew up in Wicker Park (Chicago) and been influencing pizza in the Chicago area for many years.

Here's an article from Chris Borelli of The Chicago Tribune with a little background on Burt Katz, where he pretty much says he took his own path to develop his style.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/features/food/ct-dining-0929-burt-katz-20110929,0,5069213.story

an excerpt:
Quote
Asked, instead, what a Burt Katz pizza tastes like, Burt Katz's back lowers and he replies earnestly, "It's all one thing. I make my pizzas myself, only me, so I don't see the evolutionary aspects, to be honest. I've been busy making it, adjusting it, playing with it, until I arrived at a pizza where frankly I can't see the point of doing any more research on it. But here's why I think it works: It's not too much of any one thing.

"It's not too much cheese or spice. Overwhelm it with any one ingredient, you kill the whole meal. Life is balance. So this is balanced. You concentrate on overall taste. The crust is not a platform for the ingredients. To taste my pizza, you have to eat the crust of my pizza. Eat the whole damn thing, please! Otherwise don't eat it."

So we can only use educated guesses on where his original pizza influences come from, unless someone manages to get the old man to talk more about them before he has another coronary. Personally, I hope Burt finds a way to live forever.  :chef:
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Offline OTRChef

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #55 on: August 26, 2012, 06:55:12 PM »
I would qualify Pequod's/Burt's style pizza as a Chicago style, but I call it a "modern" variation of Chicago Deep Dish.
In the early seventies, two major variations of Chicago Deep Dish were invented: Stuffed, which has become a category of its own, and Pequod's "Pizza In The Pan", which some call "medium dish".

The origins of the Pequod's style are still a bit of a mystery.
I had been calling Pequod's a Detroit/Chicago Hybrid, as it has the characteristics of a Detroit/Sicilian style of pan pizza like Buddy's (burnt cheese on the edges), but baked in a round Chicago deep dish pan (sauce on top).
The geographic proximity of Detroit and Chicago made sense at the time, but as I'm learning more about regional styles, I also see major similarities to the rectangular pizzas from L & B Spumoni Gardens in Brooklyn, New York, who make a rectangular Sicilian pan pizza with the sauce on top.

However, if you follow the history of Burt Katz , the guy who invented the Pequod's Style of pizza, you'll see he grew up in Wicker Park (Chicago) and been influencing pizza in the Chicago area for many years.

Here's an article from Chris Borelli of The Chicago Tribune with a little background on Burt Katz, where he pretty much says he took his own path to develop his style.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/features/food/ct-dining-0929-burt-katz-20110929,0,5069213.story

an excerpt:
So we can only use educated guesses on where his original pizza influences come from, unless someone manages to get the old man to talk more about them before he has another coronary. Personally, I hope Burt finds a way to live forever.  :chef:

Burt has influenced his own style of pizza, but with all due respect...he has NOT influenced "Chicago Style" pizza one iota. Nice story though.

Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #56 on: August 26, 2012, 07:03:05 PM »
Burt has influenced his own style of pizza, but with all due respect...he has NOT influenced "Chicago Style" pizza one iota. Nice story though.

I think you misunderstood what I meant.
When I say "influencing", I am talking about the handful of pizza restaurants that he started in the Chicago area that were then sold and continued to operate (Pequod's, Gulliver's).
Perhaps, I should have said "introducing his interpretation of pizza".

But feel free to be unnecessarily offended.  :chef: :pizza:
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #57 on: August 26, 2012, 07:44:32 PM »
Jeeez....I think everyone knows that "Chicago Style" pizza is either thin crust greasy 'lil squares or deep dish pan pies.   ;)"
Well, except for PuRowdy, "This is the 2nd best pizza I've ever had and by far the best Chicago Style I've had.".....but he's new at this.  :-D
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Offline OTRChef

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #58 on: August 26, 2012, 08:16:17 PM »
I think you misunderstood what I meant.
When I say "influencing", I am talking about the handful of pizza restaurants that he started in the Chicago area that were then sold and continued to operate (Pequod's, Gulliver's).
Perhaps, I should have said "introducing his interpretation of pizza".

But feel free to be unnecessarily offended.  :chef: :pizza:


I'm not offended...I just do NOT believe Burt had much to do with "Chicago Style" pizza. But, then again I only lived in Chicago for most of my life and ate mostly thin crust or cracker crust pizza's. How anyone can possibly think that thick crust pizza defines "Chicago Pizza" is beyond me. Thick crust came along LONG after thin crust in Chicago. What defines "Chicago" pizza is the sausage (I lived in the 'back of the yards') and the thin crispy crust. When someone asks me what the difference between Chicago pizza and New York pizza is...I simply say, if you can fold it in half without it (crust) breaking than it ain't from Chicago!

Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #59 on: August 26, 2012, 09:12:49 PM »
I'm not offended...I just do NOT believe Burt had much to do with "Chicago Style" pizza. But, then again I only lived in Chicago for most of my life and ate mostly thin crust or cracker crust pizza's. How anyone can possibly think that thick crust pizza defines "Chicago Pizza" is beyond me. Thick crust came along LONG after thin crust in Chicago. What defines "Chicago" pizza is the sausage (I lived in the 'back of the yards') and the thin crispy crust. When someone asks me what the difference between Chicago pizza and New York pizza is...I simply say, if you can fold it in half without it (crust) breaking than it ain't from Chicago!

Most everyone outside of Chicago has a distorted perception of what Chicago Deep Dish is and even more don't even know that we have thin crust.
That's one of the reasons why I started RealDeepDish.com
So, although I share your frustrations with the casual use of the term "Chicago Style",
we may disagree on minor semantics of pizza designation.

That's why I say that Pequod's is "A" style of Chicago pizza, but not "THE" style, as it is clearly not the authentic style of deep dish pizza created in 1943 at Pizzeria Uno, but was a later variation developed by Burt Katz at several of the Chicago area pizzerias that he ran over the years.

I have an article where I talk about the two main Chicago pizza styles that we all know - Deep Dish and Thin Crust.
http://www.realdeepdish.com/2011/12-29-deep-dish-101-lesson-3-chicago-pizza-styles-and-maybe-a-dough-recipe

Anything beyond those two styles I consider a variation. Pequod's is a notable variation, but I agree that it does not "define" Chicago pizza.

I do bring up Stuffed as a legitimate 3rd main style, but I don't really talk about Pequod's on that article because :
A) The dough is thicker and more pillowy than a traditional deep dish .
B) Although Katz is from Chicago and developed his style here, I consider it a hybrid of more than one regional style (the jury is still out on the specific origins).
3) It's not yet a city-wide established style (aka - not every pizza joint in the city has tried to duplicate it yet)

So, if what you're saying is that Pequod's isn't a good example of authentic Chicago Style pizza, you are correct.
It's not the style that comes to mind when people say "Chicago Style".

If this style were created in any other city, I might have called it Chicago-inspired "pan pizza",
but Burt's own origins and his Chicago pizza history are just as relevant to the conversation.

So, I say that yes, it is "a" style of Chicago pizza - not a main style, just a notable variation:
The similarities: cheese on the bottom - sauce on the top - baked in a round pan.
The variations: a thicker, puffy, pillowy crust, caramelized cheese on the outer edge, a zestier, tomato sauce.
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