Author Topic: Burts/Pequods  (Read 37754 times)

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Offline loowaters

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2010, 09:19:43 PM »
Another effort tonight with the only change being that I upped the TF to the .14 that I mentioned I would attempt this time around.  Here's the money shot on the crust.  The shot showing the depth of the crust from the inside isn't the best quality but hopefully you can get an idea of what it's like.

Loo
« Last Edit: March 18, 2013, 09:35:17 AM by Steve »
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Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #26 on: January 30, 2010, 09:35:39 PM »
Another effort tonight with the only change being that I upped the TF to the .14 that I mentioned I would attempt this time around.  Here's the money shot on the crust.

Loo

Nice job on that char, Loo!
Do you have any more pics to show the thickness of your crust?

Pequod's has a puffy raised crust (yes, very much like pizza hut pan), somewhere between .75" to 1 inch in depth, not counting the charred cheese that makes it's own lip on the outer edge.
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Offline loowaters

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #27 on: January 30, 2010, 09:52:10 PM »
Added.
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Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #28 on: January 30, 2010, 09:55:12 PM »
Thanks, Loo!

I'm curious which dough recipe you used.
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Offline loowaters

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #29 on: January 30, 2010, 10:09:26 PM »
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Offline Lou Dog

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #30 on: January 31, 2010, 02:11:43 PM »
Kudos, Loo!  For you not ever having been to Burts or Pequods, that's a really impressive version--I think you nailed it.  Interesting, I've never attempted to use milk in my dough--what do you think it adds?

Offline loowaters

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #31 on: January 31, 2010, 03:30:43 PM »
The milk in this case will soften dough up especially in the quantity that I used it in this effort.
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Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #32 on: April 06, 2010, 12:24:55 AM »
Full disclosure:  I've never had Burt's or Pequod's.  Quite remarkable considering all the pizza I've eaten growing up in the Chicago area. 

I really thought that I had some better pics but next time I'll take better shots of the caramelized cheese crust from the back.  I thought I did but guess not. 

Here's the formulation based on some qualities and prep techniques of the Pizza Hut Pan recipe:

KA AP Flour   100%
Water (hot)    28
2% Milk (cold) 28
Corn Oil          5.5
Sugar            1.9
Salt              1.5
IDY                .9

TF= .1295     12" dough ball = 415g

All ingredients into bowl and mixed and kneaded with C dough hook in KA Mixer for 5 minutes.  Formed into ball and allowed to double in an oiled bowl for about two hours.  Patted out to just under the 12" size that I wanted on counter top w/out bench flour.  Oiled 12" pan with approximately 2 T of classic olive oil and laid dough into pan to rise to fill pan.  Let rise in oven with light on and hot water for humidity for about 2 hours.  Covered with plastic wrap and put in fridge for 18 hours.  Dough actually contracted a bit in fridge.  Removed from fridge three hours before cooking.  Laid 3/4 lb. of low-moisture part-skim mozz on top of dough trying not to press down.  Each slice of cheese around the outside is laid just against the pan walls to caramelize.  Topped with sauce (1 35 oz. can of Cento Italian Peeled tomatoes de-seeded, cores removed, hand crushed, then returned to remaining puree.  Salt, pepper, touch of sugar, dried basil, EVOO to season.) and some large disks of sausage on one half and pepperoni on the other.  Cooked at 475* for 22 minutes, middle rack, on a preheated dark perforated disk because I was using my lighter colored pan to not burn the cheese too badly.

Again, sorry I didn't get a better look at the caramelized crust.  I will say this...it came out really good!!!  The only thing I'll try next time is to up the TF to .14.  and get the sauce a bit farther out on the cheese to allow it to blend with the cheese and get some of the sugars from the tomatoes to caramelize a bit as well.

I don't know how it rates against Burt's/Pequod's, but it was pretty good and I'm usually really hard on myself especially with first attempts.

Loo
Here's a dough test that I will be baking tomorrow night. I used Ceresota All Purpose flour, 2% milk, and hand mixed/kneaded the dough.
I increased the water and oil because the dough wasn't coming together into a ball. Hopefully it will help with the puffiness I'm trying to achieve with a Pequod-style pan pizza dough. After 2 hours of rising under warm lights, I'm giving it an overnight rise in the fridge.

Edís Quod Mod: 4-5-2010

For a 12Ē

Flour (100%):       300 g   10.55 oz    2.5 cup   
Water (41%):        122 g       4 oz    0.5 cup
ADY (0.8%):        2.39 g               0.63 tsp
Salt (1.0%):       2.99 g               0.54 tsp
Olive Oil (4.5%):  13.5 g    0.5  oz      1 tsp
Corn Oil (9%):       27 g      1  oz      2 tbsp
Sugar (1.3%):      3.89 g    0.14 oz       1 tsp
Milk  (20.5%):    61.31 g    2.16 oz    0.25 cup

Total (150.1%):   448.88 g     15.83 oz     1 lbs | TF = 0.14


I'll try to post pics soon.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2010, 10:31:25 AM by vcb »
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Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #33 on: April 07, 2010, 12:38:21 AM »
Here's a dough test that I will be baking tomorrow night. I used Ceresota All Purpose flour, 2% milk, and hand mixed/kneaded the dough.
I increased the water and oil because the dough wasn't coming together into a ball. Hopefully it will help with the puffiness I'm trying to achieve with a Pequod-style pan pizza dough. After 2 hours of rising under warm lights, I'm giving it an overnight rise in the fridge.

Edís Quod Mod: 4-5-2010

For a 12Ē

Flour (100%):       300 g   10.55 oz    2.5 cup   
Water (41%):        122 g       4 oz    0.5 cup
ADY (0.8%):        2.39 g               0.63 tsp
Salt (1.0%):       2.99 g               0.54 tsp
Olive Oil (4.5%):  13.5 g    0.5  oz      1 tsp
Corn Oil (9%):       27 g      1  oz      2 tbsp
Sugar (1.3%):      3.89 g    0.14 oz       1 tsp
Milk  (20.5%):    61.31 g    2.16 oz    0.25 cup

Total (150.1%):   448.88 g     15.83 oz     1 lbs | TF = 0.14


I'll try to post pics soon.

pics are below (more photos on my blog):
« Last Edit: April 07, 2010, 06:54:39 PM by vcb »
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Offline loowaters

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #34 on: April 07, 2010, 06:16:28 AM »
That looks absolutely fantastic!  Great work, Ed.  What kind and how much cheese?

Loo
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Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #35 on: April 07, 2010, 11:48:34 AM »
That looks absolutely fantastic!  Great work, Ed.  What kind and how much cheese?

Loo

Stella (bakers and chefs) low moisture part skim mozzarella

I'm not sure exactly how much, but it was a 12" slanted pan (11 inches on the bottom, 12 on the top), so it was probably 1 to 1-1/2 lbs of cheese.
I patted the dough flat in a greased pan, not minding a little springback (the cheese fills in the gap!).
Cheese laid out all over the bottom and up the inner edge.
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Offline BTB

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #36 on: April 07, 2010, 01:02:30 PM »
Great, great pictures, Ed.  Looks as good as any of the many Pequod's pizzas that I had over the years.  Their crust is substantially different from the Malnati's, Gino's East, Due's, and Pizano's, but still excellent in their own unique way.  It's been a long time since I had a Buddy's in Detroit, but since you mentioned it, that does seem like a similar style (i.e., more like Sicilian).  It's a great change of pace type of deep dish.  What a great job  -- as appears in the pictures at least -- on duplicating that crust/cheese carmelization.  Can you describe a little more how you put the cheese in the pan edges?  Before or after putting in the dough?  Not clear on how you did that.

Also, how are you finding the Ceresota AP to work with your pizzamaking?

This picture especially makes my mouth water just looking at it.  And I remember a piece like that occupying my plate on numerous occasions. 

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Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #37 on: April 07, 2010, 01:52:03 PM »
Great, great pictures, Ed.  Looks as good as any of the many Pequod's pizzas that I had over the years.  Their crust is substantially different from the Malnati's, Gino's East, Due's, and Pizano's, but still excellent in their own unique way.  It's been a long time since I had a Buddy's in Detroit, but since you mentioned it, that does seem like a similar style (i.e., more like Sicilian).  It's a great change of pace type of deep dish.  What a great job  -- as appears in the pictures at least -- on duplicating that crust/cheese carmelization.  Can you describe a little more how you put the cheese in the pan edges?  Before or after putting in the dough?  Not clear on how you did that.

Also, how are you finding the Ceresota AP to work with your pizzamaking?

This picture especially makes my mouth water just looking at it.  And I remember a piece like that occupying my plate on numerous occasions. 

                                                                                 --BTB


This is my first time using the Ceresota All-Purpose flour. It works pretty well! I'm not sure my dough is quite right yet, but it's close. The crust was soft inside like it should be, but I'd like it a little more pillowy. It might be that the dough wasn't up to room temp when I baked it.

I should have taken a picture of the 'delicate cheese procedure' (thank you Aqua Teen Hunger Force) , but basically it goes like this:

Pat out the dough all the way to the edges of a well greased pan - I used corn oil (do NOT bring the edge up like a lou malnati's).
You want it even all the way to the edge.
As I mentioned above, it's OK if the dough springs back a little or leaves an 1/8th - 1/16th inch gap between the outer edge of the dough and the inside of the pan because the cheese will fill the gap.
Spread sliced mozzarella cheese on top of the dough, slightly overlapping each slice to entirely cover the bottom, going all the way up the edge of the inside of the pan; the outer cheese slices should slightly curve up the edge of the inner wall of the pan.

Add italian sausage (if you're using it) in small quarter sized chunks. I broke up 2 links of raw hot italian sausage, but you can use mild.
Cover completely with sauce, all the way to the edge of the pan, so only the outer cheese slices supported by the inner wall are hanging slightly above.
If topping with pepperoni, press the pepperoni into the sauce (you don't have to bury it under, but make sure it's not just floating on top or it will burn).

I baked them at about 475 for about 35-40 minutes. You have to keep an eye on them so they get the desired outer char.

Pequod sauce is a bit on the sweet and spicy side, and it's very similar to the 'Pastorelli' canned pizza sauce that you might be able to find at your grocery store. That's what I used... with a few modifications:  dilute the sauce with your favorite sweet crushed tomatoes (I used the san marzano white label) , add a bit of sugar if necessary to sweeten up the sauce and soften the bite of the Pastorelli spices.

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Offline joekerjr

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #38 on: March 27, 2011, 11:30:36 PM »
I realize this thread has been dormant a year but I had to take a stab at Pequod's style. I just moved to Austin, TX two months ago and have been craving it ever since.

I started with the recipes here and improvised a little, risky since I've never attempted a Chicago style at all before.

Some of the improve was because my scale is still in Milwaukee and some because I couldn't find 6 in 1 out here.

I used a sloped cast iron skillet that's fairly well seasoned and 9" in diameter at the top.

For the sauce I used a drained can of fire roasted crushed tomato and added; garlic paste, dried basil and dried oregano.

After hand mixing and kneading, I let it rest in a barely warm oven for two hours. I kneaded some more and divided it in half. One half was put in the fridge, the other into the corn oiled skillet. I let that rest another hour then built the pie.

The only disappointment I had was the cheese not caramelizing. I put it between the skillet and the dough. It browned and tasting fairly good but wasn't anywhere near Pequod's. My favorite part was how well the pepperoni turned out; just crispy on the edges, mmm. I pushed each one down after placing it on top of the sauce.

I'll try the other half of the dough tomorrow night after it's been in the fridge 24 hours then let sit on the counter for a few.

Suggestions, comments, criticisms? Welcome!

Offline Dibromin

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #39 on: December 26, 2011, 05:03:30 PM »
Loo, I have learned SO much from reading your posts!  I'm going to try making a pizza this week but I have a very amateurish question first...did you put RAW Italian sausage on the pizza??  I would have thought you would have cooked it first so you could drain some of the fat. 

I also wondered if you put any cheese in the bottom of the pan.

Thanks so much for any help you can give!

Offline loowaters

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #40 on: December 26, 2011, 10:23:03 PM »
This comes up from time to time, so no worries about asking about pre-cooked sausage.  Please, I'm beggin' ya, put the sausage on raw.  From what I've seen, Pequod's uses large slabs of sausage, flattened out.  Looking around at other posts you'll see there's different ways to go about distributing the sausage on different styles. 

No cheese on the bottom of the pan.  The dough was placed in and left to rise without any side walls of dough pulled up like in a traditional type of Chicago Style deep dish.  I placed cheese on the dough leaning up the inside wall of the pan, almost to the top, then gave full coverage within those slices, creating a "bowl of cheese" effect.  That cheese on the side melts, slides, and caramelizes while the pizza cooks.

Good luck and post pics.

Loo
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Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #41 on: December 26, 2011, 10:42:20 PM »
This comes up from time to time, so no worries about asking about pre-cooked sausage.  Please, I'm beggin' ya, put the sausage on raw.  From what I've seen, Pequod's uses large slabs of sausage, flattened out.
Yes. What Loo said. :-)
I think most places in Chicago put the sausage on raw, from thin crust to deep dish.

It's been a few months since I've been to Pequod's, but I can tell you that they're more like half-golfball sized chunks of sausage. They don't do a solid patty slab across the whole pie like Lou Malnati's, Pizzeria Uno, or Gino's.
These are definitely pieces.
Check out the photo from Serious Eats: http://slice.seriouseats.com/images/20080730-pequods-pie.jpg
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Offline loowaters

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #42 on: December 30, 2011, 08:55:48 PM »
Thanks VCB, I wasn't very clear.  If I made it sound like Pequod's did a sausage patty, I apologize, that wasn't my intent.  Their chunks seem larger than most places and I flatten them a bit. 

Loo
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Offline Dibromin

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #43 on: January 17, 2012, 07:30:41 AM »
Using the techniques from this blog, I was able to make a good replica of the Pequod's pizza.  My crust was thicker and drier but, otherwise, it was very similar.  Who would have thought to use SLICED mozzarella?  Thanks everyone!
 

Offline BBH

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #44 on: January 17, 2012, 04:12:34 PM »
Is the pizza really that good?  Or is it the mystique and the fact that these places have been around for so long the reputation is automatic.  Burtís place is unusual, serves in an unusual manner (order ahead of time, pizza goes on a central table etcÖ) a guy that looks like popcorn the moonshiner making the piesÖ.itís all real cool and fun but is the pizza really all that fantastic.  What if a place opened up in a strip mall, didnít have the mystique and served a pizza that looked like that Ė would it be a hit?  Iím not too sure.

Case in point.  There is a famous Italian sausage place in Chicago.  Been there for 50 years, people raved about the sausage so I make the trip and go get some.  While there I talk to the owner and we get to discussing her business and the sausage.  She told me that they opened a new place in another town nearby.  The meat was made at the original facility and delivered within 1 hour to the new place. 

She told me people didnít like the sausage as much, she would tell them itís made at the original location and delivered to the new.  Her customers insisted it tasted different Ė she was perplexed.  Later they closed the new location.

I think some of the old school places have an old reputation that just keeps getting circulated, parent to kids and on it goes. 

Is that pizza really all that good Ė I keep meaning to try itÖ..

Offline vcb

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #45 on: February 06, 2012, 05:17:32 PM »
Is the pizza really that good?

Yes.

I was making some deep dish test pizzas (and videos which I hope to soon get up on my website),
and while building a pequod hybrid pie, something occurred to me.

I think most of us have come to the conclusion that while baking a Burt's or Pequod's style pizza,
the cheese melts down into the edges of the pan and burns into dark crispy nirvana (if you're in to that sort of thing).

I think it may actually be a combination of cheese AND pizza sauce that is charring into that outer-edge that many of us crave.
Next time you try making a pequod-style pizza at home, make sure that you get that layer of cheese leaning against the inside of the pan, but also run your pizza sauce as far out to the edge as you can get it, so when the cheese starts melting down into the void between the rising pizza dough and the pan wall, the sauce will follow down the void.

Another suggestion: If you're using pepperoni on your 'quod clone, start with the oven at about 460-475, and keep a loose sheet of aluminum foil over the pizza pan for the first 20 minutes of baking. The outer edge will still char, but the pepperoni won't burn. Then remove the foil cover for the remaining bake time.

I don't have a favorite dough recipe for this style of pizza yet.
Has anyone got a good puffy,pillowy dough recipe they like?
-- Ed Heller -aka- VCBurger -- Real Deep Dish - Deep Dish 101
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Offline BBH

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #46 on: March 06, 2012, 12:25:11 AM »
This place is exactly what I said it was....caramelized cheese?  You mean burnt cheese. 
Italian Sausage? Nope, more like the polish version with garlic, no fennel to be found...special sauce? Nope, a typical cooked sauce with decent spices. A special crust? Nope, not at all, served right from the warped pan, rather dull, lacking flavor.  The bottom was very crisp and the smell reminded me of Bisquick to a degree.

All Hype.....

I also don't understand why the health department hasn't shut this place down...OMG....

Offline Rich

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #47 on: March 26, 2012, 02:41:18 AM »
Like others have said on here - Pequod's and Burt's are in their own category for deep dish.  Personally, I prefer Pequod's overall for the pizza itself, that you don't have to call ahead just to see if you can eat there, and the reality that Burt isn't getting any younger.  I love Pequod's.  The sauce is acidic, the carmelized cheese is addicting, and the overall pizza is great.  The only knock I have on it is that it can be a bit bready.  Much more so than any other deep dish place that I know.  Burt's is much thinner overall and he has a little different taste.

Pequod's (and Burt's) are definitely love/hate pizzas.  Everyone I know either loves them or hates them.  I haven't found anyone that thinks the pizzas are just good.  Most people I know love them, my girlfriend is not one of them.  I;ve brought many of them home to eat in front of her while she says "I can't believe you like that!" :D

I'm going next week to one of them for my birthday.  Have to flip a coin as to which one I want to go.  I haven't had Burt's in a long time, so maybe I'll give the bearded one my biz.

Offline pulykamell

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #48 on: July 20, 2012, 05:34:58 PM »
Great, great pictures, Ed.  Looks as good as any of the many Pequod's pizzas that I had over the years.  Their crust is substantially different from the Malnati's, Gino's East, Due's, and Pizano's, but still excellent in their own unique way.  It's been a long time since I had a Buddy's in Detroit, but since you mentioned it, that does seem like a similar style

Pequod's/Burt's does very much remind me of Buddy's. I kind of think of Pequod's as a cross between Chicago deep dish and Detroit-style pan/Sicilian pizza. I've had good luck recreating the Pequod's/Burt's style of pies by reading up on the posts on Detroit-style pizza here.  Pizzahog's recipe and technique in post #199 works for me, I just use a round cast-iron pan instead of a square one as in Detroit pizza. White cheddar around the edges, mozzarella in the middle, uncooked 6-in-1 tomatoes with a pinch of oregano for the sauce (sauce more distributed than on a Detroit-style pie), and it works pretty darned well for me.

I'm definitely a big fan of Burt's. There's no hype there. He just makes damned great pizza.


Offline rcbaughn

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Re: Burts/Pequods
« Reply #49 on: July 30, 2012, 10:14:51 PM »
This place is exactly what I said it was....caramelized cheese?  You mean burnt cheese.  
Italian Sausage? Nope, more like the polish version with garlic, no fennel to be found...special sauce? Nope, a typical cooked sauce with decent spices. A special crust? Nope, not at all, served right from the warped pan, rather dull, lacking flavor.  The bottom was very crisp and the smell reminded me of Bisquick to a degree.

All Hype.....

I also don't understand why the health department hasn't shut this place down...OMG....

To me there is a huge difference in burnt and caramelized cheese. I have personally never eaten there but I suspect it's good. Those are some strong words though, but everyone's palette and preferences are different. This is going to be the next style pie I try to make, I love the idea of caramelized cheese on the outside of a pie. I even like to spread cheese to the edge of my thinner pizzas and let them char a bit on the pan. Viva la char!

Is it really that nasty though? The No Reservations episode made the place look like any other dive style restaurant I've seen or been to. Then again I love places like that.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2012, 10:16:28 PM by rcbaughn »
More is better..... and too much is just right.


 

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