Author Topic: Papa Gino's Recipe (Read 49974 times)

zalicious · « **Reply #40 on:** March 20, 2009, 07:05:47 PM »

I've got a few questions about the sauce:
I have the Pastene Kitchen Ready ground peeled tomatoes in the regular & Chunky style; which would be better to use?
Can anyone hazard a guess as to how much of the seasonings to use for a 28 oz can?

JConk007 · « **Reply #41 on:** March 21, 2009, 07:41:51 AM »

Good News Peter
I opened my bread box and whala there was a bag of KASL I don't usually keep flour in there just the dry milk , salts, diastaltic malt(sp?), VWG.... all those extra goodies! Anyway the secret dough is rising in the refrigerator at 34 degrees after 45 min at room temp. I did the 75% flour with all water, and rest for 20 min. Then added balance of ingredients mixed on speed 2 for 4 min then speed 1 for 5 min. I used tap water being it was IDY and the final mixed dough temp was 71 Degrees. I will give it a nice 2 hr min room temp rise prior to cooking. Oh FYI final weight was right on! 32.3 oz for the 2 doughs so I will waste I will split to 2 16 oz balls. Still dont know where I am getting the citric acid from with the 6 in 1s? value brand lists that as an ingredient. Is that in the Pastenes Zalicious?
Good luck no pressure I'm just a rookie

To be continued....

Pete-zza · « **Reply #42 on:** March 21, 2009, 08:54:23 AM »

John,

I wouldn't worry about the citric acid. That is a natural byproduct of the canning of most brands of tomatoes but not of the 6-in-1s. It is possible to buy some citric acid and add it to the tomatoes but that is not necessary for our purposes.

Peter

scott r · « **Reply #43 on:** March 21, 2009, 11:48:29 AM »

Quote from: zalicious on March 20, 2009, 07:05:47 PM

I've got a few questions about the sauce:
I have the Pastene Kitchen Ready ground peeled tomatoes in the regular & Chunky style; which would be better to use?
Can anyone hazard a guess as to how much of the seasonings to use for a 28 oz can?

the regular (non chunky) would be the closest to what they use ag PG, and use very little seasoning.

zalicious · « **Reply #44 on:** March 21, 2009, 12:07:54 PM »

Thanks, Scott.
I am really at a loss over the seasoning part, especially as you said that was a very important part of this pie. Can you, or anyone, throw some numbers at me? I have not had a Papa Gino's in over 15 years.

JConk007 · « **Reply #45 on:** March 21, 2009, 02:27:03 PM »

Gotta wing it Zalicious!
I am going with the 6 in 1's with the ingredients Peter and PG's have posted .Hows you dough looking? and I had Papa Ginos like 6 years ago, but before that it was about 19years ! so like peter says almost 30 years ago YIKES ! I am getting old but I do remember that taste. I ate there a lot. so we'll se what comes out tonight?

john

zalicious · « **Reply #46 on:** March 21, 2009, 03:00:30 PM »

Quote from: JConk007 on March 21, 2009, 02:27:03 PM

Gotta wing it Zalicious!
Hows you dough looking?

john
[/quote
'Gotta wing it Zalicious!' That made me laugh.
Actually, I haven't started the dough or anything else yet, as I'm fighting a fever & head cold. If I feel better tomorrow, I'll start it then. I'm eager to hear how yours goes.

edited to say: my post came out funky. Today is definitely not the day to make 'za.

JConk007 · « **Reply #47 on:** March 21, 2009, 03:09:29 PM »

Ok sorry to hear that. Feel better ! I'll make you a slice!
jc

JConk007 · « **Reply #48 on:** March 22, 2009, 08:07:29 AM »

Papa ginos clone (or very close)
A special thanks to Peter for working out a starting point for this clone. I followed as best as I could so we could all have an idea on the quantities and type of ingredients to use.
The dough was a 16 Oz ball 1 day fridge and 2 hrs. room I made 2 and trying the other 2 day tonight to see it there is any noticable difference. You will see the weights are mostly for 2 balls as per peters posts.
Dough Ball right on 16 oz. Not sure if I got it to .10 thickness but close and about 14 inches
the Sauce recommend 6.2 oz and I used about 6.5 oz. but only used about 5.75
The cheese blend was the 73/23/2 Recommended 8.75 oz. I kicked it up to 9.55 oz. everybody here loves cheeese! you can see the oregano in the blend.
The pepperoni I used the recommended 40 slices of hormel weighed out to 2.95 Oz. or 82 grams
so bring down the sauce to like 5.85 oz. take the cheese down to 8.5 and your good to go
Heres the process to the oven
John
PS No leftovers on this one!

JConk007 · « **Reply #49 on:** March 22, 2009, 02:12:50 PM »

Cook on stone preheated for 1 hr at 450
Come to PaPa!

JConk007 · « **Reply #50 on:** March 22, 2009, 02:18:40 PM »

and some cross sections. I tried to keep the rim small and well defined ( thin just inside rim) was difficult with that size and did not want to tear dough so here how they looked
And Man it was GOOD! I loved the diced cheese blend, the dought was perfect with no oil or sugar, the sauce could use some tinkering, but as you all now its hard to wrong with the 6 in 1s but nt sure thats the flavor I rememeber. I did not dd too much of any of the 4 sauce ingredients as per scott r thanks to you also scott! enjoy! this is a keeper!
John

Pete-zza · « **Reply #51 on:** March 22, 2009, 03:02:04 PM »

John,

Thank you for being a real trooper and trying out the Papa Gino's pepperoni clone dough/pizza. By any chance, did you weigh the baked pizza to allow calculation of the loss of weight during baking? Based on your numbers, it looks like the total weight of the unbaked pizza was about 34.25 ounces (16 oz. dough + about 5.75 oz. sauce + 9.55 oz. diced cheese blend + 2.95 oz. pepperoni slices = 34.25 oz.). For comparison purposes, a baked (and cooled) PG pepperoni pizza weighs 34.71 ounces according to the PG nutrition information, but unbaked it would weigh more. Did you use the convection feature of your oven?

The pizza does look very tasty. I'd be interested in any other observations you might have. For example, was the crust of the right thickness based on your recollections, and is there anything you would change in the dough, including the way the dough skin is shaped/stretched? And what do you think you would change in the sauce?

Peter

scott r · « **Reply #52 on:** March 22, 2009, 04:01:35 PM »

Great job! the pizza looks very good. It does look a bit thicker than the papa, was it stretched out to the full size?

Pete-zza · « **Reply #53 on:** March 22, 2009, 08:26:41 PM »

scott,

In a thread on the Sbarro's pizza, a pizza mold is shown at Reply 45 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,2061.msg39550.html#msg39550. In a later post, at Reply 57 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,2061.msg40453.html#msg40453, mention is made that Papa Gino's uses such a mold. Did you ever see such a mold at PG's? I am wondering whether such a mold produces the type of rim that the PG photos show.

Peter

JConk007 · « **Reply #54 on:** March 22, 2009, 09:17:03 PM »

Scott,
Yes a bit thicker than what I remember, apparently not stretched all the way. My peel is 13 1/2 inches and I was within that prob. 12 - 12 1/2 pie I found it hard to get stretched out all the way. I made 2 balls and let the other go another day. That was even harder to get stretched but you can see on the picks this one takes up the entire 13 1/2 inches I did plain cheese to taste the dough. Even though the dough weighed the same and was stretched out further it had even more hieght crumbb thru out the entire pizza is that because of the 2 + day rise? I had it just about paper thin before placing on peel? still the crumb was more open. I must say it did taste really good!

JConk007 · « **Reply #55 on:** March 22, 2009, 09:21:23 PM »

Peter the 5.75 sauce was ok but the 9.4 oz cheese was too much I took the cheese down to like 8.5 oz. wrked better for me. I kept the sauce at 6.05 still had some major crumb in the pie and a nice rim. Prob just right for a true 14" I could not have gotten any thinner without tearing so I dont know how it grew as it did. All in all a good try with good results. I would go no more than 9 oz diced on a true 14 inch skin and keep the sauce below 6 oz. Heres the one from tonight
John
.

Pete-zza · « **Reply #56 on:** March 22, 2009, 10:25:43 PM »

Quote from: JConk007 on March 22, 2009, 09:21:23 PM

I would go no more than 6 oz diced on a true 14 inch skin and keep the sauce below 9 oz. Heres the one from tonight

John,

Also a nice looking pizza. Of the two pizzas, which did you like better?

In the above quote, did you mean to say no more than 6 ounces of sauce and keep the cheese blend below 9 ounces, rather than the other way around?

Also, did you use the convection feature for the two pizzas?

Peter

JConk007 · « **Reply #57 on:** March 23, 2009, 08:17:18 AM »

oops !yes Peter I corrected my post thank you. I think I ate too much pizza this weekend! Also did a BTB Malnatis. I will post over there in my Chicago thread.
I like the second Pizza better. Less is better on the cheese and sauce for the same size. As Scott mentioned it is a bit thicker than they serve at PG or that I remember eating. I would have to translate the formula down to a 12" pie so I can stretch it properly and to get the correct thickness factor. My wolf oven has a bake stone feature. that is the setting I used. Its an element on the bottom with a nice thick stone 14 X16 working surface. I have some pictures of it somewhere, here but cant remember where I posted them. found em

advanced search http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7868.msg67521.html#msg67521 When using this option the dual fans do run in the back of the oven (like the convection mode) I did not check temp of stone( should Have) or Final weight ( should Have) but I know if I preheat at 550 for 45 min the stone is at least 625.
These pies were done at 450 oven setting.
again very satisfiying for those with a good stone and a lower temp. oven I would recommend trying this pizza.
Thanks for the help !
John

scott r · « **Reply #58 on:** March 23, 2009, 09:51:56 AM »

yes, I have seen the molds in use at some locations, but it seems the older and more experienced pizza makers are allowed to go freehand.

Pete-zza · « **Reply #59 on:** March 23, 2009, 11:10:57 AM »

scott,

As you know, a pizza can shrink from the size on the peel as it is loaded into the oven, resulting in a somewhat smaller pizza after baking. In fact, pizzerias are sometimes accused of intentionally "shrinking" the size of the pizzas to save money when it was really only a natural shrinkage. I wonder whether opening up a 16-ounce dough ball to, say, 15", might yield a slightly thinner crust for the baked pizza while ending up with a 14" pizza. I am still trying to figure out the relative weights of the dough, sauce and cheese to fit the nutrition data for the PG pizzas in terms of the weights of the baked pizzas. When I made all of the Papa John's 14" clone pizzas, I experienced weight losses of around 7% in my oven.

Peter